I've compiled EGPD.xml Aberdeen tonight.  Comms freqs are accurate with the current AIP and UK2000 EGPD.  VRP positions and names are accurate as per the current AIP.  The HoldPointExtras should be as close as possible to Hold Short Nodes in the scenery AFCAD.  These values are commensurate with the Hold Short Nodes in UK2000 EGPD.

 

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>
<Airport ReplaceUnits="true">
  <ATSUApproach Name="aberdeen approach" Frequency="119.05" />
  <ATSUTower Name="aberdeen" Frequency="118.100" />
  <ATIS Name="aberdeen" Frequency="121.850" />
  <ReferencePoint Name="Banchory" Departure="true" Arrival="true">
    <Position Latitude="57.05" Longitude="-2.501666667" Altitude="0" Name="RP1" />
  </ReferencePoint>
  <ReferencePoint Name="Insch" Departure="true" Arrival="true">
    <Position Latitude="57.34277778" Longitude="-2.614166667" Altitude="0" Name="RP1" />
  </ReferencePoint>
  <ReferencePoint Name="Meldrum TV Mast" Departure="true" Arrival="true">
    <Position Latitude="57.38583333" Longitude="-2.400833333" Altitude="0" Name="RP1" />
  </ReferencePoint>
  <ReferencePoint Name="Peterhead" Departure="true" Arrival="true">
    <Position Latitude="57.50694444" Longitude="-1.776666667" Altitude="0" Name="RP1" />
  </ReferencePoint>
    <ReferencePoint Name="Stonehaven" Departure="true" Arrival="true">
    <Position Latitude="56.9625" Longitude="-2.21" Altitude="0" Name="RP1" />
  </ReferencePoint>
  <ReferencePoint Name="Turriff" Departure="true" Arrival="true">
    <Position Latitude="57.53861111" Longitude="-2.46" Altitude="0" Name="RP1" />
  </ReferencePoint>
  <HoldPointExtras>
    <HoldPointExtra Name="echo nine" HasStopLights="true" StopLightsDefaultOn="true">
      <Position Latitude="57.20974468" Longitude="-2.20193401" Altitude="0.0" />
    </HoldPointExtra>
    <HoldPointExtra Name="echo six" HasStopLights="true" StopLightsDefaultOn="true">
      <Position Latitude="57.20555808" Longitude="-2.198905796" Altitude="0.0" />
    </HoldPointExtra>
    <HoldPointExtra Name="echo three" HasStopLights="true" StopLightsDefaultOn="false">
      <Position Latitude="57.203536704" Longitude="-2.197886109" Altitude="0.0" />
    </HoldPointExtra>
    <HoldPointExtra Name="echo two" HasStopLights="true" StopLightsDefaultOn="true">
      <Position Latitude="57.199919262" Longitude="-2.194178939" Altitude="0.0" />
    </HoldPointExtra>
    <HoldPointExtra Name="echo one" HasStopLights="true" StopLightsDefaultOn="true">
      <Position Latitude="57.198763267" Longitude="-2.192661752" Altitude="0.0" />
    </HoldPointExtra>
    <HoldPointExtra Name="mike one" HasStopLights="true" StopLightsDefaultOn="true">
      <Position Latitude="57.194332704" Longitude="-2.193753272" Altitude="0.0" />
    </HoldPointExtra>
    <HoldPointExtra Name="alpha four" HasStopLights="true" StopLightsDefaultOn="true">
      <Position Latitude="57.20318439" Longitude="-2.200951602" Altitude="0.0" />
    </HoldPointExtra>
    <HoldPointExtra Name="delta two" HasStopLights="true" StopLightsDefaultOn="true">
      <Position Latitude="57.204055914" Longitude="-2.201799455" Altitude="0.0" />
    </HoldPointExtra>
    <HoldPointExtra Name="mike five" HasStopLights="true" StopLightsDefaultOn="true">
      <Position Latitude="57.205402189" Longitude="-2.202400765" Altitude="0.0" />
    </HoldPointExtra>
    <HoldPointExtra Name="mike seven" HasStopLights="true" StopLightsDefaultOn="true">
      <Position Latitude="57.209010758" Longitude="-2.204594314" Altitude="0.0" />
    </HoldPointExtra>
    <HoldPointExtra Name="mike nine" HasStopLights="true" StopLightsDefaultOn="true">
      <Position Latitude="57.210212387" Longitude="-2.205451727" Altitude="0.0" />
    </HoldPointExtra>
  </HoldPointExtras>
</Airport>

Edited January 13, 20215 yr by kevinfirth

On 1/12/2021 at 11:34 PM, kevinfirth said:

Why not start a thread per question and tag TW in it?

now i know what "tag" means .... 

1 hour ago, kevinfirth said:

The HoldPointExtras should be as close as possible to Hold Short Nodes in the scenery AFCAD.

& @tegoid too

Now I know of this feature, I'll be "trialling" it on the continent (of Asia), but first a few questions.

• As with frequencies, will these negate those included in any afcad for an airport
• For an airport like WFS's VHHH, I would then set them up to match the "photoreal" not the afcad which is a tad in error but therein lies a further question, what are the coordinates of ....nosewheel + a tad / cg of a generic aircraft. I often find it difficult to hold accurately enough aside a "photoreal"  hold without tweaking an afcad hold to suit my heavy (77F/W) for voxatc to know I'm ready. But then an afcad hold is the cg, hence smaller AI hold further back from the "photoreal".
• The parameters for hold short lights may be "false" if an addon has separate lights modelling

And a couple of extra feature type questions:

• Could one differentiate Cat I from Cat II/III holds ? (I suspect directly no unless one reads the visibility of a metar)
• Use them for taxiing across runways to remote cargo for example and / or across a crosswind ? (I suspect yes)
• Include an airport's specific TA / TL in lieu of the region parameters in VASetting.xml

Edited January 13, 20215 yr by vadriver

Kevin might have a better feel for the answer but my experience has been that whatever one includes in the <ICAO>.xml file will override everything in the sim, including stock airports, fsaerodata, the Navigraph LevelD files and add-on airports. 

One caveat. Little NavMap will not recognize the information in the <ICAO>. XML file.

23 minutes ago, vadriver said:

• As with frequencies, will these negate those included in any afcad for an airport
• For an airport like WFS's VHHH, I would then set them up to match the "photoreal" not the afcad which is a tad in error but therein lies a further question, what are the coordinates of ....nosewheel + a tad / cg of a generic aircraft. I often find it difficult to hold accurately enough aside a "photoreal"  hold without tweaking an afcad hold to suit my heavy (77F/W) for voxatc to know I'm ready. But then an afcad hold is the cg, hence smaller AI hold further back from the "photoreal".
• The parameters for hold short lights may be "false" if an addon has separate lights modelling

Freqs - dont know, I will be editing the AFCADS to make sure they match so as to avoid conflicts where possible.

Holds - it would be ideal and possible to change the AFCADs to match the charts and photoreal. Whether that had any impact on AI operation....??? I think hold short nodes need to be within a certain distance of a runway in SIM, but in real life some are further away which could make this a compromise.

 

56 minutes ago, jabloomf1230 said:

whatever one includes in the <ICAO>.xml file will override everything in the sim

Jay

Indeed, I summised the "whole" purpose of those files is so that it can be done to suit Voxatc's traffic engine more accurately.

Time for some "experimenting intelligently, learning by discovery" .....  

Edited January 13, 20215 yr by vadriver

Hi Gents,

Sorry for not being around, it's been manic for me over the past weeks, for a few reasons.

I have only managed one flight out of Bristol and on this one flight the frequencies I added seem to function as I wanted, I will play around a bit more when able.

Quote

PM me with an email address if you'd like me to email you a small zip (7k) with the updated xml files.

This offer is greatly appreciated. I 'drive' a tube liner and nothing else so, class G airspace activity, LARS etc does not really affect me; so far as I understand.

The discussion around editing AFCADS is interesting. There are definitely AFCADS where the hold short node is too far away from the runway and so does not work as it should. I have not, for a very long time, edited an AFCAD. I thought about playing around with one to see if I can stop the jerky movement of the AI (slightly different subject I know) I wondered if they nodes were closer together it might  help?

Quote

• The parameters for hold short lights may be "false" if an addon has separate lights modelling

I find that the VOXATC lights are much brighter than any built in to an addon. Unrealistic but it does provide a clear hold point to stop at to trigger the next phase of VOXATC. Not perfect but I can work with this.

On the subject of holds, this time those in the air, I find that the opportunity to add a hold to flight plan extras in unrealistic. The hold shown on the charts cannot be chosen in VOXATC flightplan extras. I have tried to manually add them but they are ignored. It would be good to be able to select these so that the procedure is accurate. Not sure if this possible?

I'm still very busy but will test Bristol and report back. I'll check the forum as well, I don't get notification of replies for some reason.

Regards

Dave

14 hours ago, egkkman said:

I find that the VOXATC lights are much brighter than any built in to an addon. Unrealistic but it does provide a clear hold point to stop at to trigger the next phase of VOXATC. Not perfect but I can work with this.

Dave

I had little joy adding "extra holds" in a VHHH.xml  file (above WFS's addon)..... at various taxiway intersections. Sure they showed correctly but were not included in vox's taxi instruction nor influence AI behaviour.

I will try similar for runway short holds just to see how that works.

As for editing frequency, worked well although some "names" weren't pronounced correctly / completely..

 

Hi John,

I was thinking about pronunciation yesterday. I thought I could try to misspell those names that VOXATC struggles with e.g. Iraklion = heracklion? I don't know 🤪 Over all I think VOXATC does well but there are oddities; for example pronouncing wind as wind, as in wind the handle and glide slope as glid slope. Maybe I can change glide to glyde?

I will get an opportunity to 'fly' later today and will test the frequencies I have changed.

I will pursue the airborne hold positions as well. I think from memory the hold needs to be further than 40 miles of the airport, I wonder if there's a parameter I can change?

Regards

Dave

 

Changing "wind" isn't going to work because it's a problem of context with most Windows TTS voices. It pronounces the word as a verb when it occurs at the beginning of a sentence. VOXATC would have to change its phrasing to "The wind is 22 at 280." for it to be pronounced correctly. 

On 1/23/2021 at 10:15 AM, vadriver said:

some "names" weren't pronounced correctly / completely.

dave

should have written weren't said .......

e.g. 

  <ATSUClearance Name="hong kong delivery" Frequency="129.90" /> said hong kong clearance
  <ATSUGround Name="hong kong" Frequency="133.85" /> said hong kong ground
  <ATSUTower Name="hong kong south" Frequency="118.40" /> said hong kong south tower
  <ATSUApproach Name="hong kong radar" Frequency="119.35" /> said hong kong radar (&not as expected hong kong radar approach)
  <ATSUDeparture Name="hong kong radar" Frequency="124.05" /> said hong kong radar (&not as expected hong kong radar departure)
  <ATIS Name="hong kong" Frequency="127.05" /> said hong kong international (the afcad ID)

'Tis a tad quirky, some do, some don't.

ps pronunciation is better with payware TTS voices, no problems with one's "wind"

9 hours ago, vadriver said:

'Tis a tad quirky, some do, some don't.

must add, using voxatc copilot ... wonder how it goes in PF & / or "expert" mode ??

Hi Guys,

 

Had a very quick check on the frequency changes at Bristol.

Same as John where Delivery was announced as Clearance, also Director announced as Approach, although it was not clear if Director was actually ignored, I will check this again.

My setup does not allow for the 8.33Hz spacing so, I decided to round down the frequencies in all cases so that I can always work out what the frequency I should tune to if the chart shows a 8.33Hz spacing. For example, Bristol Clearance, as it's called on the chart is 121.93 so I made it 121.90 in VOXATC. When VOATC asked me to tune to 121.90 (which was a good thing 🙂) nothing happened. I could not hear any talking and I could not a reply; I have yet to look into this.

I also noted that Bristol Radar was used and not Bristol Approach, which was good, same as John with HK.

I wondered if it might be possible to call "ATSUClearance" something else e.g. "ATSUDelivery", again to match the charts.I'll try it but don't really expect it to work.

Anyway, I hope to have more time for this over the coming weekend.

Regards

Dave