The FAA has decided to add a second controller to the weekend night shift at Blue Grass Airport in Lexington, KY.http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?Content...64-7e427fb28b78

Interesting, yet false comment at the end of the piece by someone named John Nance, who is not attributed to any agency of the govt.He says its not the controllers responsibility to "baby-sit" every flight, but indeed that is the primary purpose of the tower controller is to insure the safe, orderly and expiditious movement of the aircraft. And as I have clearly shown elsewhere, the regulations say the controller must be assured of the aircraft's position prior to issuing a clearance.bt

"someone named John Nance"How could you be involved in or follow real world aviation yet never heard of John Nance?:-hmmmFYI -http://www.johnjnance.com/orhttp://www.bookreporter.com/authors/au-nance-john.asp--------JRR

Well, conspiracy theory aside JRR indeed:* I worked in the Aviation Industry as an Air Traffic Controller for 15 years* I held an SEL rating for over 20 years* I read lots of books, but never heard of Mr Lance. Can't say I'm impressed with his understanding of Air Traffic Control* Finally, whats with the "hmmmm"? :)bt

Hello All, John Nance is former Vietnam combat pilot, current 737 pilot, if memory serves me correctly, John has also piloted 757's for a bit, and he is an internationally know aviation writer, and has produced a gob of great aircraft related novels, of which I have read all but one . . . He's a talented speaker, writer and a most talented and seasoned pilot.Anyone with excess of 13k hours in the sky happens to know a wee bit of what he talks about. Now, I am NOT an air traffic controller, but I am a pilot, and I don't think I'd have trouble right seating John Nance any day. I doubt if John would make me nervous one little bit . . . and trust me, I'm VERY careful with whom I fly.Best to all, Clayhttp://www.dreamfleet2000.com/gfx/images/F...ers/Dopke01.jpgClayton T. Dopke (Clay)Major, USAF (retired)"Drac"

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-0...g-dangers_x.htmAn article with a good interactive graphic that compares the old, new and accident taxi routes used at that airport.Hopefully, one new rule that comes out of this is that controllers will be prohibited from clearing an aircraft to takeoff while there are runways left to be crossed.One innaccurate piece of information in that article though, is that there is no requirement for pilots to announce that they have reached the runway. In most cases, once we reach the hold short point to our assigned runway, we will sit there in sequence, in silence, until we are cleared onto the runway. For each aircraft to announce that they've reached the runway would create an immense amount of congestion on the radio frequency, especially at a busy airport. Etiquette is to sit there holding short until the controller calls to you. The only time we would ever say "...ready at 22" would be if we get there and have been waiting and see no reason for the controller to not clear us onto the runway.

>Hopefully, one new rule that comes out of this is that>controllers will be prohibited from clearing an aircraft to>takeoff while there are runways left to be crossed.i hope you are wrong. this was obviously an accident. lets not be rash. they already are lax with traffic separation and for that i never call someone "in sight" on final approach (it is simply their get out of jail free card).the last thing we or ATC needs is more stupid "rules" because 1 thing happened out of millions. it is this attitude that the idiotic TSA operates and look how well they do their job.

>Well, conspiracy theory aside JRR indeedI don't recall mentioning any conspiracy theory - I was just surprised that someone in the avaition industry never heard of him. That's all. >* I worked in the Aviation Industry as an Air Traffic>Controller for 15 years>>* I held an SEL rating for over 20 yearsWhile you are highly experienced - so is John Nance:. . . he is also a decorated Air Force pilot veteran of Vietnam and Operations Desert Storm/Desert Shield and a Lt. Colonel in the USAF Reserve, well known for his involvement in Air Force human factors flight safety education. John has piloted a wide variety of jet aircraft, including most of Boeing's line and the Air Force C-141, and has logged over 13,000 hours of flight time in his commercial airline and Air Force careers. John flies his own turbine aircraft, was a veteran Boeing 737 Captain for Alaska Airlines, and is an internationally recognized air safety analyst and advocate, best known to North American television audiences as Aviation Analyst for ABC World News and Aviation Editor for Good Morning America. . . . >* I read lots of books, but never heard of Mr Lance. Can't>say I'm impressed with his understanding of Air Traffic>ControlI'm neither a pilot, ATC or an avid book reader for that matter - John Nance has been a news consultant regarding the aviation industry for many years which is how I know know of him. (see above) Do you suppose he was simply relating his experience with control tower interactions over his airline pilot career? >* Finally, whats with the "hmmmm"? :)I thought that was rather self-explanatory . . . . please don't read into it.---JRR

>>i hope you are wrong. this was obviously an accident. lets not>be rash. they already are lax with traffic separation and for>that i never call someone "in sight" on final approach (it is>simply their get out of jail free card).>>the last thing we or ATC needs is more stupid "rules" because>1 thing happened out of millions. it is this attitude that the>idiotic TSA operates and look how well they do their job.They're lax about a lot of things. Clearing people to takeoff while they're still a good taxi away from their runway, with other runways to cross, is just one of those lax, hurry-up, things they do that reduces margins of safety and increases the onus on YOU. If you're so unwilling to call traffic in sight, why would you be so willing to accept such a takeoff clearance that increases your risks? Think this through.

My reply was meant to be largely tongue-in-cheek.As to Mr. Nance, I looked at his resume (the links you provided) and I'll agree...one impressive hombre. I've got no quarrel with his qualifications, nor am I qualified to counter his opinion on a variety of topics, I'm sure...But his widely circulated quote about "controllers don't baby-sit" is flat out wrong, especially in the context that he used it in. That lone controller was responsible to ascertain the location of that aircraft prior to issuing a departure clearance. It appears that did not happen. The 7110.65 regulation is clear, and any controller will tell you that situational awareness is job # 1 in ATC. What role that single event in the event chain played will not be clear until the final report is published, but I believe it will earn a contributing. As KevinAU described in his excellent post, frequently Tower would clear them for takeoff during taxi. Legal? As I explained in a previous post, yes. Good judgment, well you decide. My experience with aviation incidents is generally pushing the envelope or not following procedure strictly will often come back to haunt.Now as to "I thought that was rather self-explanatory . . . . please don't read into it"I would ask that you do likewise.Best, reallybt

Well said . . . . these accidents rarely have just one single cause. BTW - I have read several of his books and they were well worth the read . . . that is if you ever have any spare time . . .---JRR

I too disagree with Mr. Nance's statement that "controllers don't baby-sit". The FAR regulation you post says otherwise.I know if I were a controller, I would want to know where my plane was, if it was on the correct taxiway, at the correct threshold. And I would want my planes to "taxi to and hold short." no matter what the conditions. It only takes a few seconds to stop and assess. Dead is forever.Probably the NTSB will end up concluding that it was BOTH the flight crew's fault AND the controller's fault...if I had to hazard a guess.RhettAMD 3700+ powered by Gerbil wheel + gerbil, eVGA 7800GT 256, ASUS A8N-E, PC Power 510 SLI, 2 gigs Corsair TWINX, blah blah, etc. etc.

As the pilot who has flown out of that airport stated above - it is common to be given clearance to takeoff while on the main ramp or on the taxiway, long before the aircraft arrives at the departure runway - at that airport and many others of the same size.Two other aircraft - SKW and EGF took off on the correct runway before the Comair flight in the five minutes before the Comair flight crashed.The only controller had three departures, and was then required to complete all the paperwork.From CNN: Andrew Cantwell, regional vice president of the controller's union,.....said controllers are not required to watch planes depart. "I believe the controller performed his duties as required and, unfortunately, there were other duties to be accomplished at the same time," he said.In addition to ground operations and monitoring the radar, the controller was responsible for supervisory duties, including paperwork, Cantwell said.Now part of that I am sure is the union protecting it's people. That's their job.

Hi Regie...Andrew Cantwell, is correct when he says:"controllers are not required to watch planes depart."But controllers are required to:3-1-7. POSITION DETERMINATION Determine the position of an aircraft before issuing taxi instructions or takeoff clearance. NOTE-The aircraft's position may be determined visually by the controller, by pilots, or through the use of the ASDE.It's really that simple. Before a clearance to depart is issued, controllers are MANDATED by law to determine the A/C's position. Think about intersection departures, about crossing runway departures, etc. There are good reasons why 3-1-7 exists.Do controllers fudge, like KevinAU said...sure they do. Will it eventually buy them a "deal" (controller parlance for an incident)...you betbt

Oh, I agree with you. Everyone takes shortcuts - and eventually we all get caught. Luckly for most of us it's not in an airplane or another life or death situation.One thing I always find disappointing in news reports of air crashes is that the media never places the crash in context.We were told it was a dawn departure and the definite implication in the news reports I saw was this was the first flight of the day.It took some work with flight tracking databases and schedules, but I found that two aircraft took off just ahead of this plane.A couple years ago a B200 went down not executing a proper missed approach from KMTV. Some 30-35 aircraft diverted that morning to an alternate airport due to low visibility. The media was all over the story that the airport was unsafe and should be closed.What didn't come out until the NTSB reports was that almost 130 aircraft made successful landings that morning, there were around 40 properly flown missed approaches, and one which resulted in a crash.I've assisted the official recorders on a few military crash investigations. The chain of little things which add up to a crash are always disheartening.