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Would you really pay for this?

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My own response to your question Manny is a resounding yes. The reason I'm more than happy to pay (purchased every UK 2000 scenery ever released including the Xtreme series) is after designing and releasing a few UK airfields, I know exactly how time consuming it can be. The UK 2000 series have, over the years, represented great value, with often 30-40 airports being sold at well under

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Hi Manny, You also can design it yourself with SBuilderX and FSDS, but doing this for the whole of the UK takes a lot of time and experience...;-) RegardsBertwww.worldoffs.com

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If I used FSX I'd buy it. I use VFR Photographic scenery on FS9 If you read the description more closely you'd see it offered far more than "some buildings and trees". It actual adds buildings, runways, taxiways, etc in the CORRECT position in relation to the photographic scenery. I Don't know about FSX, but in FSX the default biulding and runways are not in exactly the rght places.

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If the Dollar was in balance - yes. His work in freeware has been excellent. Perhaps this price is a bit high even in Euros but I view it as a thank you for ALL his contributions. Perhaps I will get it post-recession!Regards,Dick BoleyA PC, an LCD, speakers, CH yoke

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Darn that grass looks good, but heck no. The price is crazy. Seems like so many people are treating FSX like an oportunity to grab some cash. FSX deffinately has the greediest mod community of any game. Almost everyone wants to be paid for any contribution, no matter how small.Lights? That'll be $10.00Grass? That'll be $19.99E.Don't mind me, I'm just grumbling out loud. I'm just glad the culture of profiteering hasn't made it's way to racing sims yet.

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I think having a thriving add-on community is part of the reason why FSX is so much fun. Lots of talented add-on producers are toiling for very long hours to produce some very fine software.Every time I get bored with FSX, there's usually an add-on I can purchase that makes the game new to me again.30 bones for grass ... however.Jumpin jiminy. Am I missing something here?

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>My own response to your question Manny is a resounding yes.>The reason I'm more than happy to pay (purchased every UK 2000>scenery ever released including the Xtreme series) is after>designing and releasing a few UK airfields, I know exactly how>time consuming it can be. >>The UK 2000 series have, over the years, represented great>value, with often 30-40 airports being sold at well under

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>Hi Manny, >You also can design it yourself with SBuilderX and FSDS, but>doing this for the whole of the UK takes a lot of time and>experience...;-) >>Regards>Bert>www.worldoffs.comTrue that!And thinking about it more..if someone offered me something similar for the entire state of Texas or atleast 30-40 airports for $1 a piece, I'd grab it.:)Manny

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>Its not Gary's fault. SP2 has forced him to it. >>Before SP2 & with FS9 his groundwork was excellent. >http://www.uk2000scenery.com/newsite/My_Ho...les/Page15.html>>You may find me strange. But if someone sold me 30-40 airports with just Photo texture or custom texture runways and taxiways... thats it. Even if no other improvements were done, I would jump with job and grab it. I would be willing to pay a premium price for that too!LOL :)Manny

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>I am really curious to see how many would pay for this.I sure would'nt. I wouldn't even bother to download and install it if it was freeware. Sorry if I hurt somebodys feelings, but that's just my opinion. I would never post a negative opinion on a freeware add on, but this is payware.Ulf B

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>Its not Gary's fault. SP2 has forced him to it. >>Before SP2 & with FS9 his groundwork was excellent. >http://www.uk2000scenery.com/newsite/My_Ho...les/Page15.html>>He wasn't forced. He had the option to do nothing. A long time ago he choose to develop add ons for FS. On every decision point on the FS evolution lane, he allways had an option to pull out. The transition from FS9 to FSX showed up to be a real big step. A positive step for me as a user of FSX. A negative step for a lot of developers. Some was forced to redraw from the market. Others have adopted and strive to get a reasonable profit. The reasons for this have by know have been beaten to death on this and other forums.Any way, this is how it is. Some user like FSX. Some don't. Some developers adopt. Others don't. No user is forced to buy any add on. No producer is forced to continue his business forever. If a developer promises to deliver something that he really can't, that's plain bad business. If a developer chooses to deliver below the market expectations, he'll be out of business sooner or later.So please, no one and nothing forced Gary to do anything, other than Gary himself.Ulf B

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>I think having a thriving add-on community is part of the>reason why FSX is so much fun. Lots of talented add-on>producers are toiling for very long hours to produce some very>fine software.>>Every time I get bored with FSX, there's usually an add-on I>can purchase that makes the game new to me again.>>30 bones for grass ... however.>>Jumpin jiminy. Am I missing something here?I was just about to ask the same question, I found the grass textures at fspilotshop:Aero Files - Ground Details FSXand i was wondering if they really meant only grass textures!!!This add-on is really generous by comparison:New TaxiwaysNew RunwaysNew Runway lightingNew ApronsNew Taxiway-markingsNew Runway snow effectsNew Runway & Taxiway Wet lookNew Runway lightsNew Water bump map on all worldwide oceans, rivers & lakes.New Sun EffectsQuality Sharpened Texturesfor a lousy $54.95, on same site, touted as texture bundle with 100+ textures.Just compare this to ground environment and some freeware sets. Complete rip-off in my opinion, especially as add-ons like photoreal grass etc. are available for free.Makes me wonder who falls for this crap... *:-* Sascha

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I read over at FSADDON that starting Feb. 1st 2008 they are going to treat the US dollar ($) the same as the EURO. No difference. If the other developers would do this I would be more apt to buy their products.I also figure that the FSX after-market products are indeed getting way out of control. All we have to do is stop buying until the market adjusts. I love capitalism.:-walksmile

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I personally feel that nickle and dime changes to a flight sim and charging for them are a slap in the face of those spending hours doing the same thing and contributing for free.With E-Commerce being more accesable to everyone, we are probably going to see the trend increase. I think those that are deciding to charge for their contribution should actually evaluate the value to the sim and the community. Will the average Joe spend 20 euros for grass, or keep looking and spend that 20 euros on a new aircraft. Which one gives you more for your money, and which one is just grass......$5us for grass, yea sure, i'll pay for that. But I will be afraid of the next $5 add on......new tire smoke - $5? Sun flare - $5? Water Texture - $5?

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What forces a perspective for me is the initial cost of the sim.For $50.00 you get fsx deluxe which includes the world, 24 aircraft, 45 high detailed airports, 38 high detailed cities, 51 missions, etc. Now that's what I call value. When compared to the parent product, the majority of addons are overpriced. I know many of them represent an incredible amount of man hours, and even monetary expendature on the part of the authors. I feel people should be justly compensated, but there comes a point where the cart is pulling the horse.

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how can you even remotely compare software released by Microsoft compared to software released by a small company, sometimes one individual? That is ridiculous. if you want to look at it in such a narrow minded view, please stay away from this hobby! You are scaring all the good people who make/have made payware addons

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Al,You were a bit harsh, doncha think? The guy was just expressing his opinion that he thinks addons should cost less than the parent product. There is some logic there.I disagree that his view is "narrow minded". Suggesting he stay away from the hobby has me close to pressing the "alert" button.Bob

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I wondered how long it would be before we got a post comparing the price of add-ons with the price of FS. Market forces determine the price. The producers set the price and the consumers decide whether to pay it. If a developer stays in busness then his prices is fair, reasonable, value for money etc etc. The cost of production determines whether or not the producer makes a profit - it doesn't determine the price.

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>What forces a perspective for me is the initial cost of the>sim.>>For $50.00 you get fsx deluxe which includes the world, 24>aircraft, 45 high detailed airports, 38 high detailed cities,>51 missions, etc. Now that's what I call value. >>When compared to the parent product, the majority of addons>are overpriced. I know many of them represent an incredible>amount of man hours, and even monetary expendature on the part>of the authors. I feel people should be justly compensated,>but there comes a point where the cart is pulling the horse.Heh - heh...let's see here...FSX = $50I had a computer that ran FS9 (and everything else I owned) perfectly well. But not FSX. So...New Computer = $2800 (FSX runs fine now)Although my "new computer" isn't "technically" and "addon", for the past 15 years, every new version of Flight Simulator that has been released has resulted in "...the cart is pulling the horse".Let's face it...we are all addicted to this FS thingie. Addons, addons, addons. Like you said above, FSX deluxe "...includes the world, 24 aircraft, 45 high detailed airports, 38 high detailed cities, 51 missions, etc." And most people couldn't run it with just that without upgrading. And they STILL "addon" more stuff to it.I think we are all just insane...yeah...that's it! ;-)PS - Gotta go search the 'net for my next FSX addon....(Note! The above is INTENDED to be "tongue in cheek". So relax. It's just that I ran out of Valium while trying to get my latest addon to work in FSX.) ;-)FalconAF

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>how can you even remotely compare software released by>Microsoft compared to software released by a small company,>sometimes one individual? That is ridiculous. if you want to>look at it in such a narrow minded view, please stay away from>this hobby! You are scaring all the good people who make/have>made payware addons;-) And if you don't mind, I'd ask you to stay away from the racing sim hobby where most stuff is free and devs still do it for the love of racing. Just joking, I could care less what you do.And on another note,Just how much value is there in FSX addons and their prices. After all, two years from now everthing you buy will be obsolete when the next version of FS is released. Then, you'll have to fork up that cash all over again. Some of the devs dont even offer discounts to repeat customers.And if anyone cares I have UTX, Xgraphics, GEX, FSgenesis mesh, FSdiscover, MyTrafficX, Xclass, and 5 payware aircraft.

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Ulf B,Thank you for the insight. Your eco-darwinian explanation is so...original and refreshing.PatAMD Opteron DC 185 @ 3GHz, Zalman7700Cu cooler, Corsair XMS 2GB DDR, 7800GS-OC, Asus A8V MoBo, RaptorHDD, TrackIR4, CH FSYoke+TQ+peds, Eclipse RED KB, WinXP-sp2

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There is a simple solution for you. No Addons! Just don't get it.I regret starting this thread. My intention wss not to beat up Gary or UK2000. They are one of the premier addonn vendors. I hope they continue doing what they are doing.Manny

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I don't believe it is harsh at all... you are comparing the price of software from a multi-billion dollar company to the price of software from a company of maybe 5-10 people. FS has always been the base for people to expand, it takes a long long time to develop something for the sim, especially complicated add-ons like airplanes, scenery, environment textures, etc. All that work and again, from a small company. I don't see a problem with prices being up around the same price as the game itself. Because Microsoft doesn't bother making a complete game, we are left relying on others to make the game complete. Quite frankly, the default game is boring and is probably the number one reason why the sim community never really explodes with new users after a new release of flight sim. New people buy it, play it for a bit, and put it away, while veterans know to rely on payware and freeware to keep the replay ability going for years to come. I believe an addon like a PMDG or Dreamfleet aircraft for example is worth the same price as the game itself because it is really a new game when you are playing. And again, these companies are not cash cows, they charge a price because they need to cover high costs and long development cycles demanded by simmers who want nothing but complete perfection and exact features like real life.So until people understand the economics of the situtation, and stop comparing apples to potatoes, we will constantly have good payware companies die off and/or struggle to make new products.

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