A350 iniBuilds - catastrophic release as never seen before

[lwt1971]

1 hour ago, mpo910 said:

.....what is exactly the user problem? That he can´t use his product? Because thats the case for me at the moment (and many others)!

Of course that is my problem (user problem). But NOT my responsibilty. So I ad some pressure to the developer and raise attention and the next time I won´t buy on the first weeks If I ever buy from them a plane again.

Is that the developers interest (inibuilds is meant here)? Surely not! Because it harms them. I am sure that at some point they will see in their revenue what they have delivered for quality IF enough users act and respond.

I am not sitting here "at" my problem......I am solving mine with communication AND if needed with my buy or not buy strategy. 😉

And just to make myself clear:

I did NOT buy blindly, I did watch all the trailers, some streams before release and also "TRUSTED" a company who claimes to raise the bar, make outstanding products and high quality planes!

When you buy a car, you are able to watch at it, drive a round and decide......and after you bought, you may encounter issues! Is that always your problem? Surely not because you bought a new car (aka new software product)...The deliverer IS still responsible.

I don´t buy such sentences like you stated here with Buying blind is a users problem. LOL

Firstly I was responding to LRBS's specific points not yours. I completely understand your situation and frustration. Nobody said it's your responsibility. All I was saying is that it's unwise to buy blindly on release day (or early days) when it comes to complex software. You said you waited, so did you not read about the bugs/crashes/issues being reported around here and elsewhere?

And no, buying add-on aircraft for a simulator where you pretend to fly planes in a computer is not the same situation as buying a car.

Given the reality of the software world these days, it's always best to wait to hear from early adopters and then decide on buying or waiting, especially if one is averse to bugs. That's at least my philosophy, you're free to disagree of course.
 

Edited March 10 by lwt1971

[mpo910]

3 minutes ago, Simon_C said:

Same happened with MSFS 2024.

Yes. The bigger the product the bigger the chance issues are in there.

And MSFS2024 was also a complete new product in the sense of being streamed almost completely (even the planes!). Thats needs a huge test in front of a release.

Jörg admittet in a dev stream they never will release a produvt this way again, they seem to have recognized the problems happening after release. Recognizing and admitting is a good step in the needed direction and acting has to follow up to not loose customers trust and after that, losse customers and then revenue.

IniBuilds had indeed major and OBVIOUS issues. TCAS issue is obvious, turn it on and watch the traffic....CTD occure almost immedialtely. Navigraph charts didn´t work at all! Not tested at all, all streamers used LIDO charts....."coincidence"???? I do honestly not know but it has a bad taste

Checklists not correctly.....items from planes that are NOT A350.....;-). Big issue, no not if you ask me, but painfully and it is obvious what happened here.

Even some streamers had DAY one freezes.....while importing a flightplan.....is this minor? No, thats major and obvious again. That should not happen at the customers end. And IF it happens....they need to be clear that customers see obviously right through their way of work...

It is al a matter of "wasting credits".....and a good former Boss of mine told and tought me once:

Every customer is equally important! Don´t rely on your good or famous name....because that gets burned if you do not deliver what expected!  

[Simon_C]

1 minute ago, lwt1971 said:

And no, buying add-on aircraft for a simulator where you pretend to fly planes in a computer is not the same situation as buying a car.

You've got it the wrong way around. It's not the customers responsibility, but the responsibility of the company releasing the product.

What I do, whether unwise or not, I will carry that decision on my back and will never make anyone else responsible for that.

[mpo910]

2 minutes ago, lwt1971 said:

You said you waited, so did you

I bought ealry and not waited this time. But that is not the root cause of my issues....the product its quality is.

But I get your point. I am not frustated, just disappointed and thats fine for me 🙂 

 

[lwt1971]

1 minute ago, Simon_C said:

You can't be serious.

Dude... we develop financial software for multi-billion companies, like car-industry, pharma, tobacco, etc... just for the reference, and I am no software dev, rather IT infrastructure for the whole shabam of stuff we have.

If we had that kind of position towards our development and customers, we would have closed eons ago. We do have test-versions, we do have test-environments, for each of our customers, and we let THEM choose whether they want to test it or not. And which version. Before going to production.

If the software is not finished, call it that, call it early access, call it beta, but be fair. With ini-A350-release, it was vice-versa. It was called complete. The greatest addon for MSFS ever or something along the lines.

I simply don't buy anymore into things like "ohhhh, sorry, we didn't know". Same story with MSFS2024. Sure they knew. It is a money-grab. The percentage of people who will do credit-card or Paypal-returns is most likely rather small. Reputation? Through the window.

Look at BATC. Working already so good. Yet, still early access.

Dude, financial software for multi-billion companies is a tad different from add-on software for a software platform where you pretend to fly planes in a computer. The developer can call it whatever they want, it's up to the user to believe them or not.. it's rather practical for said user, in the current world of entertainment software, to wait a bit and take stock of how it really is before buying. If you want to get it early and then if the the developer has not released it to a quality you're expecting, feel free to shout and whine, but you can also save yourself the trouble by not jumping in too early.

 

[mpo910]

4 minutes ago, lwt1971 said:

early adopters

If everyone acts like you suggest......NO ONE will be early adopter.....

[lwt1971]

2 minutes ago, Simon_C said:

You've got it the wrong way around. It's not the customers responsibility, but the responsibility of the company releasing the product.

What I do, whether unwise or not, I will carry that decision on my back and will never make anyone else responsible for that.

Sigh, who says it's the "customer's responsibility"? All I am saying is to save oneself the pain, best not to buy very early, especially if your tolerance for bugs is low.
 

[mpo910]

3 minutes ago, Simon_C said:

I will carry that decision

me too......it is my decision to buy early.....and that I am responsible for yes. 

That does not keep me quiet......not yet at least 😉 

[Simon_C]

2 minutes ago, mpo910 said:

Every customer is equally important! Don´t rely on your good or famous name....because that gets burned if you do not deliver what expected!  

This. We have only 18 customers. But for that huge worldwide companies. But it takes only one bad seed, one bad word that spreads around, and you have unproportionally huge problem.

[lwt1971]

Just now, mpo910 said:

If everyone acts like you suggest......NO ONE will be early adopter.....

Nope, those who're *not* averse to bugs are the usual early adopters. There are plenty of those users currently using MSFS 2024, ini A350, etc without any deal-breakers or having to pull their hair out in frustration.
 

[mpo910]

1 minute ago, lwt1971 said:

Nope, those who're *not* averse to bugs are the usual early adopters. There are plenty of those users currently using MSFS 2024, ini A350, etc without any deal-breakers or having to pull their hair out in frustration.
 

buy enough products for enough money, make enough experiences with wasted your money because to manx bugs and not usable products, you will NOT buy again or at least early again.

If a company goes this way of "thinking" your revenue WILL reduce....or better explained.....you could easely make MORE revenue when the quality is matched and expectatiosn where set not to high (marketing leveling)

[Simon_C]

3 minutes ago, lwt1971 said:

Dude, financial software for multi-billion companies is a tad different from add-on software for a software platform where you pretend to fly planes in a computer. The developer can call it whatever they want, it's up to the user to believe them or not.. it's rather practical for said user, in the current world of entertainment software, to wait a bit and take stock of how it really is before buying. If you want to get it early and then if the the developer has not released it to a quality you're expecting, feel free to shout and whine, but you can also save yourself the trouble by not jumping in too early.

 

Eh, nah. In my opinion, it's not (a tad different).

I have my kids to who I say that every cent is worth. So to them €1 is as much worth as to me say €10, or let's go higher, to me €100 is as much worth as €100,000 to Jeff Bezos. Just making a point.

What I want to say, everything is a tad different league, but when it comes to pricing and league, proportionally it's all the same. What the financial software is worth to that mb-company, is what an software addon for an airplane is worth to me in my own personal cubicle.

[lwt1971]

4 minutes ago, mpo910 said:

If a company goes this way of "thinking" your revenue WILL reduce....or better explained.....you could easely make MORE revenue when the quality is matched and expectatiosn where set not to high (marketing leveling)

Yup as I said initially, the market ultimately speaks... and it's what ultimately adjusts and determines the release and development practices of the developer. I don't have the aircraft yet, but I see a number of users who're happy with the ini A350 as it currently stands with the service packs, and also a number of users who're not happy. It'll all pan in the next few weeks/months for us and ini to get a fuller picture I guess 🤷‍♂️
 

Edited March 10 by lwt1971

[Simon_C]

7 minutes ago, lwt1971 said:

All I am saying is to save oneself the pain

I don't know where you got the impression that I was in pain 😄

8 minutes ago, lwt1971 said:

especially if your tolerance for bugs is low.

My tolerance for bugs is very high, if I adopt early. Which I did. And I tolerate every bug in the A350.

I do not tolerate advertised but missing or not working features. And these are not bugs.

 

[mpo910]

18 minutes ago, Simon_C said:

call it early access, call it beta, but be fair. With ini-A350-release, it was vice-versa. It was called complete. The greatest addon for MSFS ever or something along the lines.

thats what I mean.....leveled marketing and set expectations not to high.....and I see to many issues wich never should have reached "us customers". 

They have a quality issue as I see it...

And now they pay the price:

Enormous pressure on the devs who need to fix asap....(they released the first 2 updates in just one week! and the bug-fix list was huge.....is that ALL tested well? hmmmmm....

Customer support already written several times they slept less and monitor support forums almost 24/7!!! Due the issues.....thats as shame they need to work this way BECAUSE the delivery was not good (that COULD raise stress-level within the inibuilds company as well.....FULLY home made issues and NOT needed at all)

etc...etc.

Edited March 10 by mpo910