1 hour ago, Litjan said:

I totally believe you. I also know several companies where the goal is to sell inferior products at an inflated price to gullible customers and you get FIRED if you don´t play along.

I stand by the point I was making. Banning the complete use of AI on a forum is a complete overreaction.  There are gullible customers everywhere. We wouldn't ban everything because of that.

1 hour ago, Litjan said:

There is a strong tendency to offload work to machines - it makes sense in an economical way and we have done it for millenia. Especially if someone feels that work is tedious - as is "thinking" for many people these days. 

By logic the I'm hearing we should ban the internet and send everyone back to the public libraries. I wonder how much scores dropped with the creation of computers and the web.

I get it, a lot of people are scared of new technology that they do not fully understand yet. 

When used correctly, it is not as scary as people think.

Edited September 17, 2025Sep 17 by brinx

34 minutes ago, brinx said:

I get it, a lot of people are scared of new technology that they do not fully understand yet. 

A lot do understand it thats what scares them.

Should we be scared of AI!? 🤯

 

Another aspect: I frequent this and other fora to converse with fellow enthusiasts - not with ChatGPT.

If those that provide these forums (and cherish the traffic) want me to keep doing that, they should have an interest to providing for an atmosphere that is engaging. 

Reading what other people prompted ChatGPT to say is not.

43 minutes ago, Litjan said:

Another aspect: I frequent this and other fora to converse with fellow enthusiasts - not with ChatGPT.

If those that provide these forums (and cherish the traffic) want me to keep doing that, they should have an interest to providing for an atmosphere that is engaging. 

Reading what other people prompted ChatGPT to say is not.

I see your point, and I actually sympathise with it, because although the theoretical details of Artificial Intelligence as a branch of Computer Science & Philosophy always attracted me, at the very same time I always made those who assisted my classes back in the mid nineties very aware of the unbeatable limitations put to formal systems, algorithms, and thus, AI itself... 

At the same time I keep using it everyday because at work, with various branches of Earth Sciences and in particular the one I'm more close to - meteorology - using more and more the "power" of AI, I have to agree that it brings advantages, and just as everything in life, we just have to keep the control, whatever that means...

But the true power comes mainly, IMHO, from the advances in computing power and natural language processing. Both are unfortunately areas I never embraced that much, although I was being "forced" to go the Natural Language Processing road in my previous works, 30+ years ago...

I keep using Copilot, and that's the only AI engine I actually use, although I have visited a few more, and indeed it has, 90% of the time, provided me really good search and synthesis for building the answers to my queries, in areas as diverse as Linux administration, networking, cybersecurity, ..., aviation, soaring, flight simulation, ..., dealing with two cats at home, ..., law, ... 🙂

Just read what, in one second, Copilot "told me" when I asked:

Q: What can you tell me about Austin Meyer?

 

A: Austin Meyer is a fascinating figure in both aviation and tech circles—he’s the creator of X-Plane, one of the most advanced flight simulators available today, and the founder of Laminar Research, the company behind it.

✈️ Aviation Innovator

• Meyer is a pilot himself, which heavily influences the realism of X-Plane. He developed the simulator using blade element theory, a physics-based approach that calculates flight dynamics from the shape of aircraft surfaces rather than relying on lookup tables.

• He’s also the developer of Xavion, an app designed to assist pilots during emergencies by calculating gliding paths and backup instrument data.

💡 Tech Creator & Entrepreneur

• Beyond flight sims, Meyer has created apps like Control Pad (for managing X-Plane settings remotely) and Stradale, a driving simulator with physics modeled after real sports cars.

• He’s invested in electric aviation, supporting companies like Beta Technologies, which are developing electric aircraft.

🎥 Filmmaker & Advocate

• Meyer has also produced documentaries, including one on patent trolling, a legal issue he personally faced when he was sued over Xavion. His film “The Patent Scam” explores how patent abuse affects innovators and small businesses.

🧠 Personality & Philosophy

• He’s known for being outspoken, curious, and deeply analytical. His blog and interviews often dive into everything from rocket science to media bias, and he’s not shy about challenging conventional thinking.

If you’re into flight simulation, aviation tech, or just love stories of independent creators pushing boundaries, Austin Meyer is definitely someone worth following.

 

Edited September 17, 2025Sep 17 by jcomm

6 hours ago, Litjan said:

I think humanity will follow the evolutionary pattern it has shown before. Advances in medicine made people less resilient, advances in machinery made people less physically strong, and advances in AI will make people more dumb.

 

4 hours ago, brinx said:

I get it, a lot of people are scared of new technology that they do not fully understand yet. 

When used correctly, it is not as scary as people think.

 

I think both are valid points of view and I'm about halfway between them.

I think Litjan is right: modern technology relieved us of the need to exercise, to be strong, etc. and yet, over-using pretty much any technology has long term negative consequences on the well-being of the individual person.

Now AI could relieve us (at least partially) of the need to think, but what consequences will it bring?

Exercising can produce pleaurable endorphines; being strong and muscular can be good for self-esteem; and both can improve our long term health, so a lot of people fortunately still do these things.

But for most people, mental effort is just tedious and with little reward, so it's easy to over-use AI. Infact, I'm already over-using it myself.

So I think the key is "when used correctly", just like most other modern technologies.

P.S.: Ironically, I used ChatGPT's help to write this reply, but only asking it to translate some expressions of which I was not sure, since english is not my first language. 🙂

Edited September 17, 2025Sep 17 by Murmur

I think at this point AI is a tool - just like a car or a gun or a smartphone. Use it responsibly and know it´s limitations and it can be a great asset. Use it outside of it´s design scope and it can be detrimental.

I realize that LLMs are already a great asset, and most of the time their response is correct - just like talking to a human "expert" on some subject. But is it always correct? If a human tells us something, we are aware of the limitation, wrong memory, false deduction, maybe even a hidden agenda. If you ask a person "what is 3456 times 34221" and you get a quick answer - you will likely doubt it´s accuracy. But if you type it into a calculator and hit "enter" - you will likely believe whatever it puts out.

People are already relying on ChatGPT like they would on a pocket calculator - we had one guy in "the other forum" who - by his own admittance - worked in vain with ChatGPT for a few days to get help on a very specific X-Plane problem. The answer was never "I don´t know" or "I don´t have enough data to give you solid advice".

1 hour ago, Murmur said:

P.S.: Ironically, I used ChatGPT's help to write this reply, but only asking it to translate some expressions of which I was not sure, since english is not my first language. 🙂

🤣

Well, I agree.

I sometimes find myself daydreaming some sort of Gödel response to the widespread belief that AI is THE FUTURE... 😁, just as he crashed the state of affairs regarding the power of 2nd order Logic and the idea at the core of Principia Mathematica.

In the meantime I follow with interest some of it's applications in weather forecast. ECMWF is celebrating it's 50 years of existence, and they are well into use of AI tools and techniques...

In aviation there's already a lot being done too, and in our leisure time field, flight simulation, I look fwd into more and better AI based ATC robots...

Edited September 17, 2025Sep 17 by jcomm

5 hours ago, jcomm said:

But the true power comes mainly, IMHO, from the advances in computing power and natural language processing.

Maybe it's the natural language part that scares them. It's like black magic.

I fail to understand why the information from a google search is okay, whereas the information from ChatGPT/CoPilot is not. Users tell you to do a google search all the time. Your top google results may even be same source for CoPilot. Google search is just a keywords base search, whereas CoPilot allows you to use natural language to do the search. Its more precise because it understands natural language and exactly what you are asking.

Now if someone on the forum wants to know the name of a configuration to change in Xplane/MSFS, you can do a google search and spend a few minutes searching through pages and multiple websites. Or you can use CoPilot and get the information back in 2 seconds thanks to natural language. Many times, I look at the source for CoPilot and it literally pulls the information right out of the documentation. I see no reason why posting such information should be banned on any forum. Might as well ban the posting of any information taken from search engines.

Google recently won a case where the U.S. government accused them of being a monopoly in the area of search. Google won the case because the judge believes that AI-Driven searches like chat ChatGPT and Copilot will disrupt Google's search dominance anyway. The judge understood that it is just the next evolution/revolution in the way we find information on the web. No different than the revolution of the web in the 90's that eliminated the need to sit in a library researching. 

People had the same fear with search too, a.k.a.  the "Google Effect". "It's going to make us mentally lazy." "People are just going to skim information". A few decades later and I think we're doing okay. At minimum, we had enough smart humans left in the world to bring us AI.

 

 

Difference between Google and ChatGPT.

Google tells you which website to look at - which are (at least they used to) made by a humans, much like a book or sign. It is then up to the user to assess the validity of the information he just gleaned, and there are secondary indications that allow you to at least somewhat guess who truthful the represented information is. Much like when reading a book on a certain subject (fact or fiction, who is it written by, etc.).

ChatGPT pretends to tell you the truth. The regular secondary indicators that will tell you how trustworthy a source is are missing, the information is portrayed as facts - even if it was made up.

Granted, an intelligent user will take ChatGPT´s information with the necessary grain of salt, but a large portion of it´s potential user will fall into the "AI told me, and it sounded so convincing, it must be true, after all it knows the whole internet, right?" trap.

1 hour ago, brinx said:

Maybe it's the natural language part that scares them. It's like black magic.

I don't know who is "them". I for once am not scared by AI, I just think that, as any new technology, it will have good and bad effects, and it is up to us to use it in a way to minimize the bad ones.

1 hour ago, brinx said:

I fail to understand why the information from a google search is okay, whereas the information from ChatGPT/CoPilot is not.

Infact that is an appropriate use of AI (provided you know how to best use it and what are its limitations, just like the same is true when doing Google searches).

1 hour ago, brinx said:

Many times, I look at the source for CoPilot and it literally pulls the information right out of the documentation. I see no reason why posting such information should be banned on any forum. Might as well ban the posting of any information taken from search engines.

Maybe outright banning it isn't necessary, but I agree with Litjan that reading forum posts made up mostly of AI content isn't great. Just as it wouldn't be great to read forums posts consisting mostly of pasted Google searches. Maybe someone will make a "Let me prompt AI for you" website just like the already existing "Let me Google it for you" website.

1 hour ago, brinx said:

People had the same fear with search too, a.k.a.  the "Google Effect". "It's going to make us mentally lazy." "People are just going to skim information". A few decades later and I think we're doing okay. At minimum, we had enough smart humans left in the world to bring us AI.

I think the potential impacts (mostly for the best) of AI will be orders of magnitude bigger than not only Google, but most other technological advances in the history of mankind. Today's LLMs are just toys compared to what we'll probably see. So it's reasonable to discuss the implications of a new disrupting tech on humankind.

E.g., smartphones/constant connectivity/social medias have been incredibly useful technologies, and yet their misuse can (and has) produced dramatic consequences on many people.

41 minutes ago, Litjan said:

Difference between Google and ChatGPT.

Google tells you which website to look at - which are (at least they used to) made by a humans, much like a book or sign. It is then up to the user to assess the validity of the information he just gleaned, and there are secondary indications that allow you to at least somewhat guess who truthful the represented information is. Much like when reading a book on a certain subject (fact or fiction, who is it written by, etc.).

ChatGPT pretends to tell you the truth. The regular secondary indicators that will tell you how trustworthy a source is are missing, the information is portrayed as facts - even if it was made up.

Here is a snippet from a copilot search. The sources are clearly listed. Users can dive deeper if they want.  You can go to the individual sources. 

You can use the old-school approach of spending several minutes googling and searching through many sites, aggregating the results to get what you need, or you can get the result at your fingertip within 2 seconds via AI.   Natural language makes it easy to find precisely what you need quickly. The efficiency is why many companies now "require" the use of AI whether it is search or coding. As I mentioned earlier, you'll even get fired for not using it. 

On 9/16/2025 at 6:47 AM, jcomm said:

Reflection Detail Low Reflections are CPU-heavy and offer limited visual gain at 1080p.

And how well did changing this particular setting go in 12.3?

I have immediate family who are forced to use LLM in their web development jobs. They both love it. Allows you to skip the mundane coding tasks but must be baby-sat. You're essentially dealing with the coding skill level of the average young teenager at best.

I recently worked through a xp plugin-coding issue with a fellow user. He was convinced that the ai result was correct when it wasn't. It took me a long while to pull him in the right direction but after that, he did actually use it effectively to solve a few more sub problems with minimal editing of the resulting code.

These search engine companies really should also be putting model %-confidence levels into the result in addition to the links to sources. I think that would be a wake up call for the average user.

@blingthinger, yes and that's something you easily notice when the subjects are inside our network of interests and knowledge.

But, otoh I've successfuly used Copilot in tasks ranging from finding the correct syntax of commands I didn't use for a long time to law and regulaments, or even on finding interesting info about some diseases, etc...

On 9/16/2025 at 10:14 PM, brinx said:

I know several companies where using AI is mandatory and several where you get FIRED if you don't use AI to complement your job.  It can increase productivity tremendously, saving time and money. Outright banning anything AI is an overreaction IMO from these forums. If you know how to use it properly, it can become an invaluable source.

Company-specific, locally run AI models is totally acceptable as it can be trained on very specific information and is used by people who at least bring a minimal qualification to the table to interpret the results. It's also an asset to accelerate mundane, repetitive tasks or provide knowledge management.

Where things get hairy is when the broad populace starts to outsource their nowadays already fairly questionable ability to interpret, associate and question to an AI or content algorithm that was trained on pretty much all the junk dumped into the world wide web during the past thirty years. Not to mention the atrocious environmental record of the datacenters running everything.

 

23 hours ago, jcomm said:

No no no!!!! My rig is GREATZZZZ!!!!

Then why do you need optimized settings, hmmmmmmmmm...? 😉

 

8 hours ago, Murmur said:

P.S.: Ironically, I used ChatGPT's help to write this reply, but only asking it to translate some expressions of which I was not sure, since english is not my first language. 🙂

Try DeepL. It works quite well for quick translations.