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to all AS2004/PMDG 737 users.....

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I have both AS 2004 and the PMDG. I am aware that there are problems with the two pieces of software while running at the same time. I try to fly with AS2004, but majority of the time, witness it screw up my final approach. This can be my only explanation for why I am having manual landing problems. I seem to have the plane being "blown" all over the place when not having autopilot engaged. I wish that AS2004 would work better with PMDG. The weather can be breathtaking at times, but what good is it when as soon as you click AP off on final, you can barely control the plane? My question is who has success using both? If you do, what settings do you use and what are your steps before starting FS9 and taking flight? Thanks, I appreciate it. Brad

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Hi BradCould you be a bit more specific with 'have the plane being "blown" all over the place' please?If the Autopilot is able to land the plane under a specific weather condition you should be able to do so as well (most of the time ;-)).I'm using AS2004 almost all the time and have never had problems till now. It can happen that you have a certain wind change on final. But that can happen in real as well. Sometimes it's better to approch a bit fast and have some additional performance reserve.But if you think there is a problem with AS2004 just discribe what happened on your final and I will try to solve the problem... ;-)Waiting for your answer... ;-)CheersMartin

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Brad,I was having this very issue when I initally installed AS2004 and it happened on two flights that I made: one with the Fanda Dash8 and the other with the 737NG, the former flown manually and the latter on autopilot. In both instances I got a sudden, and major, change of wind direction and speed, which caused the dash8 to go well into a stall (15kts in the red) and the 737NG to not quite stall but dance its way 100ft to the left of the runway for a very ugly autoland.After this second occurence, and despite the fact that there were no other aircraft within cooee of my plane (ie. nothing remotely close - for all you non-Aussies out there), I turned OFF wake turbulence in AS2004 and I haven't seen the problem since. What prompted me to do this was the similarity with the few similar experiences I had with aircraft behaviour with AS WXRE, FS2002 and wake turbulence (although in these cases other aircraft were close enough to cause such an effect - naughty me!).Anyway, something for you to try if you want.Gary

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Thanks for your post Gary - I am tossing up whether to purchase AS2004, you may have tipped me over the edge!Oh and steady on with cooee stuff, you'll have us all doing Skippy impersonations next :-)ScottYBTL

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This is interesting. I made a similar post on the main forum in another connection and basically got the response that there was no problem using the NG and A/S. However, I think there is - my experience is very much the same. All goes fine with the flight but problems occur on approach, usually below 3000ft. These issues happen when trying to make an autoland. The precursor to the prob is the plane begins to wobble left and right on the glidepath. Without warning, A/P 2 disconnects and there is a surge in airspeed and the plane begins a steep climb - kindof performs its own go around. In one post, Damian says he doesn't think this is possible. Well it happens.I've looked closely at my A/S options to ensure that I have virtually no more than a gentle breeze at destination and wake turbulence is off - that was a killer.I've been using one route to experiment with various options and only get the problem with A/S. However, just when I was about to give up on A/S, I tried the same flight again today with today's weather and got a perfect landing! All conditions/options were exactly the same as yesterday, when I did get the problem, other than the wx file.The only issue on this flight was that once or twice I got the default ATC telling me to expedite descent to a level I was already at. The baro setting was OK, so maybe there's another prob here.I'm gonna keep on trying to see what comes from using different wx files.Bud

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As an aside, the development of AS2004 is ongoing. Damian will beat this winds issue to death until everyone is satisfied, and he has already uncovered a number of details with respect to how FS9 handles winds and is working hard on overcoming these obstacles. From the AS forum, it seems most people, PMDG users included, are very happy with how AS2004 with the alpha version of the maintainance release is handling winds and visibility, and things will only get better in the coming weeks and months...Best,sg

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Hi,I have been using the PMDG 737NG and AS2004 since the very first day AS2004 was released, and so far I am pretty happy with the results. Much much better than FSMeteo or Activesky2002 which both gave me headache with FS9.Just follow the standard guidelines in the Product Manual, expecially for setting up the flight plan forecast before you start the flight and it should work fine.Regards

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when on final, with AP engaged, the plane handles quite well. In fact, it tracks the localizer and glideslope perfectely. Problems start when I disconnect the AP. I seem to loose control of the plane. The nose will tend to swing right, and I need to apply full opposite rudder and stick to TRY to get her back to center. The only thing I can do is switch back to AP and do an autoland...which is no fun. I am in landing configuration too. Flaps up at 200, intercept localizer flap 5 speed 180, glideslope alive gear, flap 15 and vref speed, glideslope capture landing flaps. No matter what i get the same result, and it has been like this since AS2004 has been installed. Im stumped!Brad

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SG,[sorry for this PMDG off-topic posting]the development may be ongoing - but until now it wasn't able to solve the main problem of AS with FS9: the famous wind shifts, which may leed to fatal results, when flying with real weather.Even the update does not seem to solve this major problem (see http://forums.avsim.net/dcboard.php?az=sho...0&mesg_id=7350)Just say it, as it is: a serious issue, which has not beed solved until now - different to the promises, which were made by Damian and other people.yes, hopefully Damian will be able to beat this issue to death - and hopefully he'll need less than 'months' for this - in this case I'll switch to AS immediately :) But a lot of people already bought AS with wrong ideas in their mind about what's already solved...

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I agree with Hans here. With no disrepect towards AS. There IS an issue that does not always rear it's ugly head but is real enough. In fact PMDG have stated that one should NOT use AS or any add-on weather program unless one excepts these limitations. This AFDS sometimes gets sent too much info causing erratic behavior not limited to IAS reading 0 which leads to the Alpha kicking (thinks that you are stalling) ;(. This is a real issue and like Hans stated, I hope it does get resolved so everyone can use AS with PMDG without potential problems.[h4]Best Wishes,Randy J. Smithhttp://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/betaimg.jpg

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Hi, I second this! I have never had any problems with the combo of 737NG and AS2004 on approach. I have, however, every once in a while a few dramatic wind shifts, but with AS those are far fewer than without.Thanks,Boaz

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RandyIn a way, it is helpful that someone has, at last, come out and agreed that there is a problem. I know that there is, but up 'til now all I've had are the responses along the lines 'well I use the two together and have had no problems'. Not too helpful.Given the importance of these two programs to flying in FS9, might I suggest that the stricture of PMDG in the manual presents effectively a choice - either fly the best plane but not in the best weather environment, or fly in the best environment but not in the best plane.Would it not be in the general interests of all of us who wwould like both, that the two developers be encouraged to get together and sort out a solution. Surely better than just hoping.Bud

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Bud,I'm not sure, if I understood you completely, but this problem is not PMDG related - it's just a problem of the external weather programs and will happen with every bird, you're flying.In case of running the 737NG this sometimes will have more effects (for our baby behaves more real than others), but the issue will occur with every other plane, too.HansJuergen

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HansActually I didn't get much in the way of problems when I tried the default 737 with AS, mind you that was two flights only and it's the only default plane I tried for comparison purposes. In fact probs don't always occur for me with the NG and AS either.The point I'm trying to make is that I don't think it matters if the issues are wholly AS-related, it is in everybody's interest that these two great programs work together consistently. Surely the best way of facilitating this is if the two developers get together.Bud

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Bud,of course you would be right, if this issue would be also PMDG related.>> I don't think it matters if the issues are wholly AS-related>Well, it is... and that's the problem. The wind shift problem is an FS9 issue with all real weather programs like ActiveSky or FSMeteo. Of course you can say, it's also FS9-related, and the best way would be, to bringt the developers of FS9 and AS/FSMETEO together :)HansJuergen

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Hello HansI'm not actually talking about the wind shift issue. The problem which most troubles me is the one I posted earlier. I wouldn't say it is frequent, but on approach, there are times when just before landing, there is a surge in power and the plane takes off on its very own go around. If I understand Randy's post correctly, this is caused by the info which is being fed into the autoflight components of the plane.If I disconnect the AP at around 6000ft let's say, and complete the landing process by hand there are no problems whatsoever - other than my dodgy pilot skills. However, on occasion, when I've tried an autoland, the above prob has reared up and hit me - maybe two out of ten flights.I have got something of a work around, but it provides a not very realistic landing scenario. Seems to work tho', although I have to say the continuing possibility of being hit by the old surge does add a bit of tension to the landing process - so maybe not a bad thing!!Bud

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Bud,For what it is worth, I have had this "surge" as you describe happen to me also during an autoland. I have made about 5 flights since I installed AS2004.Steve Canham

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Bud,ok - I got it now (slowly, but surely)> this is caused by the info which is being fed into the> autoflight components of the plane.yes, but this is the same thing than wind shifts in cruise (btw: my plane was destroyed more than once just by the cruise wind shifts) - faulty data cause a faulty behaviour. A suddenly decreased IAS (perhaps caused again by a strange wind shift, this time in approach instead of cruise ?) causes the alpha protection to come in place.I don't feel, that this should be changed by ignoring such substantial information, it should be fixed, where the problem is located: in the FS9 control of AS (resp. FSMETEO) ...HansJ

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Hello HansI absolutely agree, it has to be fixed. I simply think that the best and quickest way to do that is for PMDG to work with HiFi.Bud

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Steve,Scary when it happens, isn't it. Don't know how you reacted to it, I found the best way to deal with it is to treat it as a go around, get vectors for a re-entry and then to land manually. Sure adds interest to your flights !!CheersBud

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