Ariane 737-800 V3.0 feedback request

[Chock 17,769]

Yup, alongside any airline liveries I like I will happily have VC-10s, B707s, B727s, Comets, Caravelles and whatever else I fancy whizzing around my virtual skies. In fact, one of the main reasons I like the 737 is because it is a forty year old design with the front end off a 707 :( Al

[out 769]

Surprisingly PMDG nailed the VC hands down over Ariane. Everything from the color of the panel to the thickness of the window beams is very accurate

Les, I do not have the Ariane 737. But I'm a longtime user of PMDG. So hard to be objective.But what you wrote surprised me a lot. I hope no-one will bash me for what I write, but... the colour?The awful purplish colour of the PMDG cockpit has always been a huge drawback to me. Hope for something totally different in version 2.As far as I've been at the real 737NG flightdeck, plus watching humerous photos, I see no similarity in the real colour to the PMDG one.But that's just about the colour. An intriguing post, anyway.Best regards

[virtualstuff 770]

Feel free to express your opinions and experiences, but please don't stamp all over mine as though they are of no consequence in comparison to your own.Al

It seems as you do too lol and don't know everything so for what it's worth but the FS9 version hasindeed the slow refresh update rate of the display and this has nothing to do with your PC ;-) and performance it's just hard coded...If it doesn't bother you that's a different story but it's the same on all hardware ;-) They solved this perfectly in the FSX X2 version where you can adjust the display update refresh rate yourself.

[Chock 17,769]

When I start prefacing all my posts with: 'here is the Gospel according to Al', then you might have a point. However, I've looked fairly hard in all my posts on this thread and I can't find the bit where I claimed to know everything.I'm merely trying to answer a request by someone for feedback on the Ariane FS9 737 based on personal experiences, and I quite clearly stated in a previous post that: Not everyone would agree with my reasons for that however, so don't take that at purely face valueIf yours is the kind of response I'm going to get for trying to answer somebody's question with an opinion on my experiences, then I'm seriously wondering why I should even bother, so thanks for chipping a little bit more off my faith in human nature.Al

[out 769]

I'm sorry, Al. I think I may have added to spoiling your post.That's because I have always liked PMDG's system complexity but disliked panel graphics, especially on their 737 (much due to the mentioned colour).So I instinctively got tempted to respond here, which I regret now.The objective and personal opinion you gave out here is very professional and I enjoyed readng it.As I mentioned, I am intrigued by your words, as I always wanted to know more about the Ariane boeing (never being a user of it).Now I know much more and thank you for it.Best regards

[Glynn 405]

helloI have both the Ariane BBJ and the PMDGThe gauge refresh rate in the Ariane BBJ is truly horribleThe panel.CFG shows 20 VC sections which is totaly ridiculousNo way will you get a usable gauge refresh rate with this manysections and it matters not a jot what your hardware is.you have 17 fps divided by the numbers of sections so I make thatless than 1 frame per second. IE a slideshow

[virtualstuff 770]

When I start prefacing all my posts with: 'here is the Gospel according to Al', then you might have a point. However, I've looked fairly hard in all my posts on this thread and I can't find the bit where I claimed to know everything.I'm merely trying to answer a request by someone for feedback on the Ariane FS9 737 based on personal experiences, and I quite clearly stated in a previous post that: Not everyone would agree with my reasons for that however, so don't take that at purely face valueIf yours is the kind of response I'm going to get for trying to answer somebody's question with an opinion on my experiences, then I'm seriously wondering why I should even bother, so thanks for chipping a little bit more off my faith in human nature.Al

Again Al this kind of response is far over reacted and wonders me why I in the first place bother to give you the correct information, you madeassumptions that aren't correct either just to get the facts straight.You just picks a little sentence out of the total message just to argue and it seems to win the battle instead of talking and sharing about the other information. The remark made in general is that we all don't have all the knowledge (more a reflective way to our self but it seems difficult for some) as you post proved here including me still learning everyday :-)Then you say "chipping a little bit more off my faith in human nature" With respect but that end sentence is form a spoiled child.But be surprised that some folks floating around here have a bit more understanding of the inners of FS or RL worldexperience and sharing and contributing a lot for over a decade ;-)Maybe it's the language difference and I read something there isn't?Have fun Al.

[Chock 17,769]

Look, let's get something straight here, you quoted something from me that was completely irrelevant to gauges, and wasn't even a comment directed at you but was part of a discussion Les and I got into centering on a misunderstanding of his use of an emote, which was resolved, and that had nothing to do with you at all.Even so, you still went off on some tangent about me not understanding gauge performance when I'd never even said anything about gauges other than to mention that I like the FPS the thing gets and can live with the gauge refresh rate, which is hardly a conclusive appraisal of what I do and do not know about gauges. But not content with doing that, you also kicked over the ashes of that previous misunderstanding earlier in the thread in order to intimate that I don't care about other people opinions, which is plainly not true if you read any of my above posts. That was, as far as I can see, for no other reason than to cause trouble.When I pointed out that I was disappointed that you would do this, I'm then further accused of trying to win some battle (not sure what battle that is, I was trying to help the original poster when you waded in on me). Then I'm apparently being a spoiled child for not sitting there and taking the inaccuracies and insults you doll out at me. And after all that, I'm supposed to 'have fun'? This thread was supposed to be to help someone who asked for feedback, which is why I responded to it and made the effort to take screenshots and post an example of my experiences alongside those of others. But you seem bent on having a go at me for some bizarre reason. Instead of doing that, why don't you direct your efforts towards helping the original poster make a decision based on your feedback, rather than seeing it as an opportunity to pick a completely silly fight, that has nothing to do with either what I said, nor is likely to help the original poster come to a decision?Al

[Dillon 2,198]

Les, I do not have the Ariane 737. But I'm a longtime user of PMDG. So hard to be objective.But what you wrote surprised me a lot. I hope no-one will bash me for what I write, but... the colour?The awful purplish colour of the PMDG cockpit has always been a huge drawback to me. Hope for something totally different in version 2.As far as I've been at the real 737NG flightdeck, plus watching humerous photos, I see no similarity in the real colour to the PMDG one.But that's just about the colour. An intriguing post, anyway.Best regards

I guess I'm sorry to report the PMDG color is what you get in the actual real world 737NG. It looks fine to me especially in the real world aircraft. One thing that will jump out at you in the real bird is how large the displays actually are and how they site back in the panel at an angle. Actually the whole main panel sits in a bit from the autopilot panel. The real thing looks really cool... Ariane's offering looks nothing like that. I flew back home on the 717 and you can really get a feel of the overall commonality of the new aircraft. The big displays add a bit of commonality to the various designs. I just wasn't prepared for how big the displays actually are in person. It's something you really have to see in person to appreciate...

[dallyborr 2]

Simple answer! Go for Ariane!Why? Simple, cause it is "BOEING 737NG"! Everything, from model, flaps, interior...look like and act like real thing. Yes, frame rate in VC is poor, but what else to expect from cockpit where ALL buttons, switches etc WORK, in FS2004. FSX version don't have that kind of problem, i mean FPS. And yes, it is better than every 737 PMDG model.Maybe PMDG was good for his time, but not any more. PMDG don't have real looking VC, Ariane does! Flaps on PMDG are waaaay tooo big, than it should be, Ariane have them as they are in real life. Ariane have problems with gauges refresh rate, PMDG have problems with whole VC, with FPS. Overhead panel in PMDG is just simple 2d texture, there is no 3d buttons, and still it is very poor on FPS...I don't want to start WAR, again, between PMDG fans and Ariane fans. But thats a truth. As i said, PMDG was good for his time, but now Ariane is better. Simple as pie! Maybe PMDG is goin' to make better one, cause they work on new 737NGX, who knows. For now, Ariane 737NG is a REAL DEAL.

[Dillon 2,198]

Simple answer! Go for Ariane!Why? Simple, cause it is "BOEING 737NG"! Everything, from model, flaps, interior...look like and act like real thing. Yes, frame rate in VC is poor, but what else to expect from cockpit where ALL buttons, switches etc WORK, in FS2004. FSX version don't have that kind of problem, i mean FPS. And yes, it is better than every 737 PMDG model.Maybe PMDG was good for his time, but not any more. PMDG don't have real looking VC, Ariane does! Flaps on PMDG are waaaay tooo big, than it should be, Ariane have them as they are in real life. Ariane have problems with gauges refresh rate, PMDG have problems with whole VC, with FPS. Overhead panel in PMDG is just simple 2d texture, there is no 3d buttons, and still it is very poor on FPS...I don't want to start WAR, again, between PMDG fans and Ariane fans. But thats a truth. As i said, PMDG was good for his time, but now Ariane is better. Simple as pie! Maybe PMDG is goin' to make better one, cause they work on new 737NGX, who knows. For now, Ariane 737NG is a REAL DEAL.

The last time I heard something like this was when it was found out the poster worked for Ariane. Your low post count shows you don't post that much here so this is a little suspicious. I don't want to accuse you but even your user name suspiciously calls back to someone that was trying to do this before. I'm familiar with a guy who goes by the name of Bobo that works for Ariane, not sure if this is you. Anyway all of what you wrote above is false 10 times over. As a real pilot myself with actual time sitting in the real bird's cockpit I can hands down tell you PMDG's bird are the most accurate. Ariane has some cool features like the view system but everything from the overly fat looking fuselage to the inaccurate looking VC is totally wrong. The sounds are horrible and the activation/support is the worst around. The price for admission is in the troposphere and the FDE could use some work. There's so much amiss but like I said the only show stopper for me is the gauge performance. After using a computer that can run FS9 like a bat out of hell with all add-ons, it's obvious PMDG nailed it for the most part. People saying otherwise baffles me... Ariane's 737NG didn't show it's warts until I got a computer that could run the hell out of FS9. On lower end machines around the era of FS9's release Ariane was/is the better option (PMDG's bird will not run well in the VC). The only things missing in PMDG's offering was a functioning IRS and bending wings on the external model, everything else is there considering the limitations of Flight Simulator...

[Gavin 99]

I guess I'm sorry to report the PMDG color is what you get in the actual real world 737NG. It looks fine to me especially in the real world aircraft. One thing that will jump out at you in the real bird is how large the displays actually are and how they site back in the panel at an angle. Actually the whole main panel sits in a bit from the autopilot panel. The real thing looks really cool... Ariane's offering looks nothing like that. I flew back home on the 717 and you can really get a feel of the overall commonality of the new aircraft. The big displays add a bit of commonality to the various designs. I just wasn't prepared for how big the displays actually are in person. It's something you really have to see in person to appreciate...

Forgive me if I've misunderstood your point, but what commonality is there between a B717 (MD-95 I think) and a B737? Isn't a B717's instrumentation more similar to an MD-11? No offence intended, just genuinely curious that's all, ok?

[Dillon 2,198]

Forgive me if I've misunderstood your point, but what commonality is there between a B717 (MD-95 I think) and a B737? Isn't a B717's instrumentation more similar to an MD-11? No offence intended, just genuinely curious that's all, ok?

Since we have no 717 modeled correctly in FS9 I can't attest to it's similarity to the MD-11. What I was more speaking of is the clean look of the cockpit in modern aircraft in general. If you look at older generations of 737's and DC9/MD80's you have a cluster of gauges everywhere (the older DC9/MD80 series can appear like a jumbled mess at first sight in the real world). What becomes vary apparent when you look at both the 737NG and the 717 in the real world is you see these big glass panels that make the cockpit look so much cleaner and unclustered with a multitude of gauges. You see the same old window configuration (cockpit windows you look out of) and overall cockpit look with a stream lined main panel (very very clean look). I liken it to looking at a 1983 Cessna 182 with new glass panels installed replacing the old gauges. You have the same old plane with new avionics that make the whole panel look better and cleaner. The overall shape of the cockpit of both the 737NG and the 717 is classic -300 series/DC9 series in appearance with these cool new Avionics that stick out at you. Now we can argue specifics as to what's displayed on the various panels to aircraft but walking into a cold dark 737NG, 744, 717, and even Airbuses in some cases has a common look that's more apparent in the real world (four big glass panels staring at you is four/five big glass panels no matter what aircraft it is). On the newer aircraft flat square glass panels about the same size no matter what jet is the norm these days giving all these aircraft a more clean appearance than the older birds in the air. They all look more modern and similar in person than one would think. FS does a good job but there's something different sitting in the real bird. I would think if your used to glass panels as an airline pilot that would make it that much easier to move around from jet to jet in your company if they all had modern birds... The E-Jets may be a bit different as you actually interact with the glass panels in those birds... Another thing is I don't know what it is but something about the look of the LCD (or whatever it is) screens in person make the glass panels look more like your looking at monitor screens in the cockpit versus gauges (which you are I guess). In all essence that's exactly what it is; In the real world it's pretty cool seeing these screens in person and noticing how large they are in an airliner cockpit... I hope I clarified myself here as even a Cirrus cockpit is a little more exciting to look at versus conventional cockpits...

[Gavin 99]

I hope I clarified myself here

Yes, I see your point. Thanks.

[Benjamin J 751]

@dilloll0 (and others interested):PMDG VC:http://www.avsim.com/pages/0504/pmdg_737ng_review/vc_new.jpgAriane VC:http://img525.imageshack.us/i/737dt2.jpg/Real Boeing 737-800 cockpit:http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_8_4GnCTp578/R7HW...+737-800MMA.jpgI'm looking at these three shots, and beside the differences caused because of airline preferences, I really don't see *such* big differences. Both of them obviously have good parts and lesser parts and I find it very hard to choose. For example, the MCP area of the PMDG looks more convincing than Ariane's, specifically because there is that shadow there. However, I think Ariane did a better job in that, while there is no shadow, the "brown" sort of sides of the MCP panel looks better. then, of course, the Ariane has 3D switches on the overhead, which the PMDG has not. But, in general, I find it hard to really pick one of them as "the best".For the rest, I think activation isn't so bad at all (all you have to do is wait, provided you didn't make any mistakes), and support is actually rather good once you get into the forum. Plus, I actually quite like the sounds. They seem more real than anything that I have heard.What interests me most in this discussion, though, is the fact that some people are completely anti-Ariane, some are pro-Ariane, but just a few are in between. It just leaves me wondering: both parties claim to have had actual pilots for the beta testing... So, does one party have bad pilots? Have they no idea what they are talking about? It confuses me and saddens me every time I see it happen. All my dealings with Ariane have been very pleasant ones, and I don't see the problems people apparently had with them. How have they been for you?Again, I'm not a pilot. All times I was on a Boeing 737, I went as a passenger. I might be completely wrong, but even if I am, so be it. I really enjoy flying the Ariane 737, and currently I'm waiting to see what the PMDG 737NG2.0 is gonna give me. I'll probably buy it in the end, too, but that's still a long way off.