I was just wondering how far out from an airport will a STAR approach be assigned. Does this happen before the descent phase of flight? I was also wondering how far out from an airport you can get ATIS information. I know that with using Radar Contact you won't be able to find out which runway is in use until you are within 75nm from the airport. Do pilots get this information from other sources besides ATIS? I've noticed in a 737-400 youtube video the crew began the Approach briefing before beginning the descent. With FS2Crew, in that briefing, the STAR,IAP and runway condition are all discussed.Thanks,Chris Porter

Hi Chris, Yes, the approach briefing is normally done several miles before Top of decent. Depending on the traffic, route & weather ATC would probably interupt constantly if waited to long. The stars questions I can't say with confidence and others should be around soon to give you a much better hand with that. I do know that stars can be huge, 100's of miles huge. Radar contact is much better at the range than the whopping 33 miles default ATC is but more often than not and from what I've read ATC will usually vector you regardless of star in the heavies at bigger airports. From my DVD's and watching my latest 777 vid, the pilot mentions he put it in what he expects from the weather forcasts and his own experience from landing at the airport before of course. The winds as you know are the deciding factor and can change while on approach. I fly real weather and currently with default ATC if any (have voice recognition ATC but my flying time has been very late and don't wanna wake the roommate). I am right on my guess most of the time, but definitely not always. I always program a second route also that I can switch to if need be.

Sometimes and a lot of times, the pilot or dispatcher will file a STAR and or SID in their flight plan. Also depending on weather and traffic at a given time, ATC may give an amended flight plan and give another STAR in lieu of the originally filed one. The ones that ATC gives as amended flight plans are usually parallel with the originally filed one. As for the runways and how the pilots know is based off of past experience from flying into the airport but also off of pre-flight weather reports. then they just confirm the in use runways using the ATIS. Most STARs have a point as which it tells you on the chart to "expect radar vectors after XXX way point or prior to XXX way point." Sometimes it will even tell you which heading to depart off of a certain heading and ATC will take you from there to the correct runway and line you up for the approach.

In the US at most major airports, the STAR is selected based on the direction from which you are arriving rather than the landing runway. Except along the coasts, most locations will have four STARS (or more if some are RNAV for turbojets) where one is from each corner of an imaginary box with each corner of the box being about 40nm from the airport. This is where you will be going from Center to terminal approach, at about 10000. Locations vary, but few places have STARs that are runway specific like KLAX does.

Thanks for the comments. I don't usually put a STAR into my flight plan (I'll probably change that) but do have one preselected based on where I am coming from so that I can input those points into the FMC as I get closer to the arrival airport. Unfortunately (and I understand why) Radar Contact doesn't assign one to you but you can request an approach (in general, not a specific one) after being told which runway to expect (I wonder why you can't request a STAR before reaching TOD).I don't fly online using real world weather but I do go online to get weather information for each departure/arrival airport and manually input that into default weather and then while I am en-route I can use that wind information to predict which runway to expect. I pull up the charts for that runway and have it readily available so that when I am cleared for that runway all I have to do is select it from the FMC. My initial question of finding landing information before reaching range of ATIS (75nm) I asked because I was wondering if the flight crew could place a call to dispatch or somewhere before reaching TOD to get that information in preparation of going over the approach briefing, which according to FS2Crew (a great program by the way), is to be done before beginning the descent into your arrival airport. If anyone has anything else to add I appreciate it. Thanks again for the those who have already replied.Chris Porter

Thanks for the comments. If anyone has anything else to add I appreciate it. Thanks again for the those who have already replied.Chris Porter

Chris,In addition to the other info already given, here are a few more thoughts.Assuming that you're talking about airline flying, then the vast majority of flight plans will include a STAR if one is available. As mentioned, the particular procedure that is filed will be based largely upon the direction from which you arrive, and less frequently as a result of things like deferred aircraft equipment or published ATC reroutes. For instance, if your FMS or GPS is deferred, you might not be able to fly the normal RNAV STAR, so dispatch will file one that doesn't require RNAV. Something you don't have access to in FSX (maybe there's an addon for this, I don't know), is datalinked weather. The crew can go to a menu in the FMS and request the destination METAR/TAF and often, the current ATIS, as well. Based on this information, as well as the fact that most crews fly to the same dozen airports over and over, they're able to put to together a likely course of action based upon that particular airport's way of doing things. For instance, heading to PHL, you might know that the winds favor the 27's, but ATC will likely ask you if you can accept 35. If you know this ahead of time, you can accept or reject request without delay. The only time the crews typically ACARS dispatch for the airport weather is if they want to change alternates (in order to hold longer), are diverting to the alternate and are too busy to get the datalinked weather, or when they're headed for a destination that's hard IFR and they want a running score on the RVR trends. It's far more common for crews to ask for the enroute weather picture than anything else.The approach briefing is done during the descent, and is based on the information above. Unlike in FSX, you won't usually know what runway you're going to be assigned until you're talking to Approach. Even then, sometimes they'll only tell you to "expect" 18L, but then when you get to the final controller, they'll assign you 18R, or even 27. There's a lot of finger gymnastics involved for the PNF when this happens late in the game. Some airports are notorious for doing the late runway swap. Just search the ASRS* database online for the LAX CIVET or SEAVU arrivals.For guys who are ahead of the jet, and have reason to suspect that they're going to get shafted by ATC, it's not uncommon to get a secondary flight plan loaded into the FMS that includes the likeliest runway alternative to the one they're expecting. Then it's a lot easier the get the box programmed if ATC pulls the trigger.As a final aside, it's possible to get a tactical reroute from ATC once you're already in the air, and it's possible that it would include a change to the filed STAR. Typically this happens when there's lots of thunderstorms around, and you're already carrying a lot of extra fuel in case you have to deviate (not divert) around big lines of thunderstorms. But that typically only happens to the unlucky few who happened to be enroute when ATC decided to implement a SWAP** program. From then on, the reroutes are published (and mandatory), so they're taken into account prior to departure...at least when things work like they're supposed to.* ASRS - Aviation Safety Reporting System - http://akama.arc.nasa.gov/ASRSDBOnline/Que...px?server=ASRSO** Severe Weather Action Plan - http://www.fly.faa.gov/PLAYBOOK/pbindex.htmlAnd a quick pic of the datalinked ATIS (photo courtesy of: Me)

I think everybody did a great job answering I only have this to add. In Canada (real world) a STAR is required in the flight plan where a STAR is available. I find too many Controllers on VATSIM wait too long to give you a descent. I think sometimes they are trying to intentionally wait to the last possible second to give you the descent, like there was some penalty in giving it to you sooner or reflective on how good they are if they give it to you at just the right time. The intent of the STAR is to relieve Controller work load in that he doesn

Parts of this thread relate to this subject.http://forums1.avsim.net/index.php?showtopic=280705

If you don't have it, you might want to consider getting FS Flight Keeper. There are lots of good reasons to buy it, but the chief one, if you fly airliners in FS, is that it allows you to add ACARS capability to your cockpits, thus it fills in a big gap that is missing from many FS airliners, by giving them something the airline pilots usually have access to.With the FSFK ACARS panel installed, you can key in any ICAO code you like and get a weather report for that locale, as well as all the other relevant airport information. FSFK is not the only program that can do that, but it is one of the few that will allow you to do it from the cockpit without alt=tabbing out to another program or having the information on a second monitor, so it tends to let you keep the suspension of disbelief when flying in FS.Personally, FSFK's ACARS is the first thing that goes into all my FS airliner cockpits when I install them, as it makes their operational capability much more realistic.Al

Is it reading weather active in FS or real world. I'd be looking for whatever is being generated in FS since I use archived weather to sync to the Zulu time of the flight. (Active Sky)

If you don't have it, you might want to consider getting FS Flight Keeper. There are lots of good reasons to buy it, but the chief one, if you fly airliners in FS, is that it allows you to add ACARS capability to your cockpits, thus it fills in a big gap that is missing from many FS airliners, by giving them something the airline pilots usually have access to.With the FSFK ACARS panel installed, you can key in any ICAO code you like and get a weather report for that locale, as well as all the other relevant airport information. FSFK is not the only program that can do that, but it is one of the few that will allow you to do it from the cockpit without alt=tabbing out to another program or having the information on a second monitor, so it tends to let you keep the suspension of disbelief when flying in FS.Personally, FSFK's ACARS is the first thing that goes into all my FS airliner cockpits when I install them, as it makes their operational capability much more realistic.Al

Thanks again everybody for your input. I will put it to use. FS Flight Keeper looks very handy as well. Thanks for the suggestion. I will make it a priority come birthday/Christmas time.Chris Porter