Brayton and G550flyer, I am sure your both really good pilots and I do not have the background to question you, but IF you guys are right and they got this wrong, how was this missed by multiple type rated pilots that fly this plane for a living such as jack, tom and the other pilots that worked with PMDG on this. Your basically saying that 1. they noticed this and pointed it out but were overruled2. they are incompetent3. did they just not care.or are you two wrong?I hope you two won't be offended by this but I can't confirm Brayton is a 737 pilot, and g550 you sound really professional but you don't fly the 737. I really would like to see the tech team pilots respond to this.

No I'm not offended, you have to have thick skin in my profession. Also I don't pass judgement on PMDG or the tech team. I'm just comparing the NGX to the manual. I'm not asking anyone to take my word/opinion. I have never stated that I am typed in the 737. The item discussed is one that anyone can verify for themselves. Read section 6 of the supplied training manual and have a look at the NGX yourself. The disparity between the NGX and the training manual + videos has nothing to do with my real world flying and experience. I've worked with a developer of a freeware DC-10 and we were able to capture everything from takeoff ground run, distance to climb, time to climb, all the way down to nose pitch up at touchdown caused by the ground spoilers. But I have no clue on the inner workings of PMDG. I can only tell you they make excellent products. If this item was not based on the supplied manuals and rw videos, and was solely based on my pure opinion/speculation, I don't think this topic would have gotten this much traction and attention at all.

I‘m waiting for PMDG to put down a few words.

Hey ladies and gents... I've been working on this for you for many hours, it's not perfect , but I believe it's somewhat what you're looking for.. Start with this for the NGX -800 WITHOUT winglets.. I haven't worked on the winglets model, but I'm sure the numbers are very close... Go into your aircraft.cfg and copy and paste.. Make a copy of your original settings first of course... [Flaps.0]type=1 // ** FLAPS **extending-time=39 // Total seconds span-outboard=0.69 // 0.0 .. 1.0flaps-position.0 = 0.000 // pseudo-degreesflaps-position.1 = 8.888 // 1flaps-position.2 = 18.333 // 2flaps-position.3 = 25.000 // 5flaps-position.4 = 31.111 // 10flaps-position.5 = 33.333 // 15flaps-position.6 = 35.000 // 25flaps-position.7 = 36.666 // 30flaps-position.8 = 40.000 // 40lift_scalar = 0.70drag_scalar = 0.50pitch_scalar= 1.0system_type = 1 [Flaps.1]type=2 // ** CORRECT LIFT**extending-time=14 // Total secondsspan-outboard=0.30 // 0.0 .. 1.0flaps-position.0 = 0.000000 // pseudo-degreesflaps-position.1 = 1.892113 // 1flaps-position.2 = 8.209540 // 2flaps-position.3 = 11.83127 // 5flaps-position.4 = 14.48548 // 10flaps-position.5 = 14.40295 // 15flaps-position.6 = 8.251020 // 25flaps-position.7 = 0.863519 // 30flaps-position.8 = 0.000000 // 40lift_scalar = 0.000drag_scalar = .50pitch_scalar=0.0 [Flaps.2]type=2 // ** CORRECT DRAG **extending-time=20 // Total secondsspan-outboard=0.30 // 0.0 .. 1.0flaps-position.0 = 0.000000 // pseudo-degreesflaps-position.1 = 7.889347 // 1flaps-position.2 = 16.335694 // 2flaps-position.3 = 20.006734 // 5flaps-position.4 = 21.124468 // 10flaps-position.5 = 18.353201 // 15flaps-position.6 = 9.983736 // 25flaps-position.7 = 6.656470 // 30flaps-position.8 = 0.000000 // 40lift_scalar = 0.000drag_scalar = 0.000pitch_scalar= 0.0

Brayton and G550flyer, I am sure your both really good pilots and I do not have the background to question you, but IF you guys are right and they got this wrong, how was this missed by multiple type rated pilots that fly this plane for a living such as jack, tom and the other pilots that worked with PMDG on this. Your basically saying that 1. they noticed this and pointed it out but were overruled 2. they are incompetent 3. did they just not care.. or are you two wrong? I hope you two won't be offended by this but I can't confirm Brayton is a 737 pilot, and g550 you sound really professional but you don't fly the 737. I really would like to see the tech team pilots respond to this. Ok I am not a pilot so I may be wrong here but my airplane body attitude is spot on on approach and reading the charts in the manuals, they mention that these charts were for sea level, -150 fpm at touchdown with CG at forward limit.. so what that tells me is unless your at sea level with your CG at the forward limit then your going to be off even in the real plane.

Not offended at all mikea. This is not a real pilots forum so was not here to prove anything to anyone. I was just frustrated that after waiting for so long, PMDG comes out the new 737 which does not land like the real thing. Thats all. I got ifly737x and FS9 737 and actually use those two more than this one which is a bit of a disappointment since I did really like PMDG 747/737NG. One more thing though that you wrote regarding the rated pilots who helped make it program. You cant tell me that the other rated pilots you were talking about decided Boeing was wrong about what they had in their manuals and came up with own landing attitudes? Boeing clearly states the attitudes in their manuals, so real pilot or virtual pilot, it doesnt matter what anyone of us say. Its what boeing says since they built the aircraft. This isnt the first time PMDG got it wrong. Their 747X for eg had mistakes which I had pointed out to them which they acknowledged.

Hey ladies and gents... I've been working on this for you for many hours, it's not perfect , but I believe it's somewhat what you're looking for.. Start with this for the NGX -800 WITHOUT winglets.. I haven't worked on the winglets model, but I'm sure the numbers are very close... Go into your aircraft.cfg and copy and paste.. Make a copy of your original settings first of course...

What did you actually adjust there Tony? Was it the lift_scalar in flaps.0? I'm not in front of my simming PC at the moment. Three responses... 1) I've adjusted pitch on approach many times for many aircraft, and in my opinion a minor adjustment to the lift-scalar in flaps. 1 is all thats required. [Not flaps.0] That should influence 30 and 40 flaps only. [you don't want to influence takeoff flaps]. flaps.0 will influence all lift from all flaps, including take off flaps. Effectively if you modify flaps.0, you are fixing the pitch on approach while simultaneously breaking the lift from takeoff flaps. You'll be rotating later. If flaps.1 doesn't hit just 30 and 40 flaps, then the lift_scalar in flaps.2 is the section to try. 2) personally, I wouldn't advise any modifications to the aircraft cfg until PMDG have had a chance to fine tune. It's true that any patches should override our tweaks to the cfg, but to be on the safe side, I would say don't introduce any variables at this stage... wait for PMDG. 3) If you are impatient, and believe the evidence that the pitch is wrong to be definintive... then make a backup of the old cfg. I'll experiment later for those that are impatient. But I don't advocate changes at this stage. Martin Wilby

I know that the PMDG organization must be awfully busy with other pressing issues, however, I sure would like to know if someone from the team could provide an explanation as to what PMDG's intentions are in regards to the 'landing attitude' issue that several members have questioned. Regards,jen noulet

I'd also like to hear something from PMDG on this.

There's nothing wrong with tweaking the settings in the aircraft.cfg if you save your current settings.. I worked on the lift and drag of the flaps.. I'm uploading a vid to youtube right now.. Here's the newer tweak of the flaps and slats.. No more floating... [Flaps.0]type=1 // ** FLAPS **extending-time=39 // Total seconds span-outboard=0.69 // 0.0 .. 1.0flaps-position.0 = 0.000 // pseudo-degreesflaps-position.1 = 8.888 // 1flaps-position.2 = 18.333 // 2flaps-position.3 = 25.000 // 5flaps-position.4 = 31.111 // 10flaps-position.5 = 33.333 // 15flaps-position.6 = 35.000 // 25flaps-position.7 = 36.666 // 30flaps-position.8 = 40.000 // 40lift_scalar = 0.65drag_scalar = 0.50pitch_scalar= 1.0system_type = 1 [Flaps.1]type=2 // ** CORRECT LIFT**extending-time=14 // Total secondsspan-outboard=0.30 // 0.0 .. 1.0flaps-position.0 = 0.000000 // pseudo-degreesflaps-position.1 = 1.892113 // 1flaps-position.2 = 8.209540 // 2flaps-position.3 = 11.83127 // 5flaps-position.4 = 14.48548 // 10flaps-position.5 = 14.40295 // 15flaps-position.6 = 8.251020 // 25flaps-position.7 = 0.863519 // 30flaps-position.8 = 0.000000 // 40lift_scalar = -.390drag_scalar = .50pitch_scalar=0.0 [Flaps.2]type=2 // ** CORRECT DRAG **extending-time=20 // Total secondsspan-outboard=0.30 // 0.0 .. 1.0flaps-position.0 = 0.000000 // pseudo-degreesflaps-position.1 = 7.889347 // 1flaps-position.2 = 16.335694 // 2flaps-position.3 = 20.006734 // 5flaps-position.4 = 21.124468 // 10flaps-position.5 = 18.353201 // 15flaps-position.6 = 9.983736 // 25flaps-position.7 = 6.656470 // 30flaps-position.8 = 0.000000 // 40lift_scalar = 0.000drag_scalar = 0.000pitch_scalar= 0.0You don't have to copy and paste everything, just the changes in the lift/drag scalars

There's nothing wrong with tweaking the settings in the aircraft.cfg if you save your current settings.. I worked on the lift and drag of the flaps.. I'm uploading a vid to youtube right now.. Here's the newer tweak of the flaps and slats.. No more floating... [Flaps.0]type=1 // ** FLAPS **extending-time=39 // Total seconds span-outboard=0.69 // 0.0 .. 1.0flaps-position.0 = 0.000 // pseudo-degreesflaps-position.1 = 8.888 // 1flaps-position.2 = 18.333 // 2flaps-position.3 = 25.000 // 5flaps-position.4 = 31.111 // 10flaps-position.5 = 33.333 // 15flaps-position.6 = 35.000 // 25flaps-position.7 = 36.666 // 30flaps-position.8 = 40.000 // 40lift_scalar = 0.65drag_scalar = 0.50pitch_scalar= 1.0system_type = 1 [Flaps.1]type=2 // ** CORRECT LIFT**extending-time=14 // Total secondsspan-outboard=0.30 // 0.0 .. 1.0flaps-position.0 = 0.000000 // pseudo-degreesflaps-position.1 = 1.892113 // 1flaps-position.2 = 8.209540 // 2flaps-position.3 = 11.83127 // 5flaps-position.4 = 14.48548 // 10flaps-position.5 = 14.40295 // 15flaps-position.6 = 8.251020 // 25flaps-position.7 = 0.863519 // 30flaps-position.8 = 0.000000 // 40lift_scalar = -.390drag_scalar = .50pitch_scalar=0.0 [Flaps.2]type=2 // ** CORRECT DRAG **extending-time=20 // Total secondsspan-outboard=0.30 // 0.0 .. 1.0flaps-position.0 = 0.000000 // pseudo-degreesflaps-position.1 = 7.889347 // 1flaps-position.2 = 16.335694 // 2flaps-position.3 = 20.006734 // 5flaps-position.4 = 21.124468 // 10flaps-position.5 = 18.353201 // 15flaps-position.6 = 9.983736 // 25flaps-position.7 = 6.656470 // 30flaps-position.8 = 0.000000 // 40lift_scalar = 0.000drag_scalar = 0.000pitch_scalar= 0.0 You don't have to copy and paste everything, just the changes in the lift/drag scalars

Appreciate, Tony. Looking forward to your vid.Im still waiting for PMDG to put down some words as I've never changed even one value in a made by PMDG aeroplane.

Guys, I have just looked at this. It's not necessary at all to cut and paste the huge blocks Tony has given you, into your cfg's. I'm not sure why he included all that lot, when it's one line you need. Tony's lift_scalar 0f 0.65 is way, way too much. The adjustment is simplicity itself. In the flaps.0 section of the aircraft cfg... Change this line... lift_scalar = 1.0 to lift_scalar = 0.8 This will give you precisely two degrees pitch up on a 3 degree glidesope. It will also give you a much better flare of 4 degrees. Exactly what the manuals say you should have. I'm also not sure why Tony is the one testing, and telling us what we need to do, when ironically, he was the one that was adamant that he didn't have a problem. Martin Wilby

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=z9dQAZ1s6jg Martin, chill... I didn't study lift vs. drag for nothing in flight school..

For future reference, how do I embed vids so they show up on here?

I didn't learn study lift vs. drag for nothing in flight school..

Whats that got to do with it? How can you advocate changes when you've already told us you personally do not see the issue. Are you saying you now do see the issue. I don't need to chill, just curious in regard to the irony. Again, thanks for the 0.65 lift_Scalar, but 0.8 is spot on I'd say. Perhaps you could tell us why you included so much from your cfg? Did you make other chnages in addition to the lift_scalar in flaps.0? If so, why? Would be a shame to encourage others to make dramatic chnages unecessarily. Martin Wilby.

Nice work everybody. I'm curious as to what the lift-scalars were on the old PMDG 737-800 NG as I no longer have it on my new computer set-up. Anybody know what those values were and how they compare with the NGX??..Also, I recall sometime ago in a statement by PMDG concerning the NGX that they worked long and hard in trying to really fine-tune the 'Float' in the NGX since the FSX enviroment was playing havoc with it. I wonder if this impacted the 'Attitude' problem in which we all are well aware of by now??. Thanks again for your inputs.Regards,jen noulet

I deleted everything last night, reinstalled, and the the issue people have spoken of arised, floating and too much of a pitch down attitude on final flying flaps 30 vref +5.. For some reason I like to help others..