Question for all the pi##ed 3PD about Flight...

[Dillon 2,198]

Speaking as a 3rd party add-on maker. FSX market is dwindling, and rapidly. Not only that, but the few that are left over are super picky. Not only that, but almost every popular aircraft has been covered 3 times over. The most difficult thing right now is FINDING A PROJECT TO DO. 3rd party's were hoping Flight would be there next cash cow. Seems the farmer that owns that cow is tired of us milking it for free.

This is the idiotic baffoon statement I was referring to above. :( :Monkey:This one is beyond words to describe. Again show me a fully rendered Airbus on the level of PMDG's NGX. We have never had an Airbus done right in any version of FS and when it comes to GA aircraft again the options out there are limitless... The surface hasn't even been scratched in FSX. FS9 by contrast has way more GA options and still it's laughable what's flying in the real world versus what's been done virtually. When you say the market is dwindling where is it going, to X-Plane? Sorry to tell you, X-Plane has a few more versions before it ever could think about replacing FSX or FS9 and even then it would take 3PD to make it happen. There's no doubt it will happen though if MS keeps screwing around... Speaking of FSX, it has a long way to go add-on market wise and to add insult to injury so does FS9 as iFly proved. If your checking I know more than a few payware developers let alone freeware guys that are laughing at what you wrote here.Wow... Edited February 15, 2012 by Dillon

[dmaher 0]

I think this thread was about why 3rd party developers are so angry about MS Flight...

:) You mean "pi##ed 3PD"...not all 3PD...not all 3PD are angry or upset... :)

[xplanery 250]

This is the idiotic baffoon statement I was referring to above. :( :Monkey:This one is beyond words to describe. Again show me a fully rendered Airbus on the level of PMDG's NGX. We have never had an Airbus done right in any version of FS and when it comes to GA aircraft again the options out there are limitless...

Thats true. Almost whole Airbus family is lacking very high quality addons although there is lots of demand for them. Probably its just fly by wire modeling which has kept many devs away, thankfully flightsimlabs is finally doing A320 at least. Its not hard to find a project to do at all. Edited February 15, 2012 by FScamp

[Dillon 2,198]

Thats true. Almost whole Airbus family is lacking very high quality addons although there is lots of demand for them. Probably its just fly by wire modeling which has kept many devs away, thankfully flightsimlabs is finally doing A320 at least. Its not hard to find a project to do at all.

I'd like to see a well modeled DC10. I guess this guy thinks the CLS DC10 is the best we can do... :LMAO:Raise your hand if you would like to see a TBM800 fully rendered in FS... :( Edited February 15, 2012 by Dillon

[frankla 44]

The thing is MS hasn't said Flight won't support jets.In fact IMO a broader audience will be looking for jets.GA for an extended amount of time becomes a very hardcore sim activity - to support your real GA flying for instance.Otherwise I think the fascination with GA fades.Flight survives on users wanting things, like jets, and then providing them.What the free base package intends to do is plant that idea, 'hey if my Flight had X it would be even better.'

How would you have jets without large connected geographical areas? Seriously I am scratching my head here. What would you do with a jet if you only have Hawaii and say St. Marten?

[Glynn 405]

What would you do with a jet if you only have Hawaii and say St. Marten?

Circuits :(

[frankla 44]

Circuits :(

:( Touch and goes why didn't I think of it?

[Gibbage 199]

This is the idiotic baffoon statement I was referring to above. :( :Monkey:This one is beyond words to describe. Again show me a fully rendered Airbus on the level of PMDG's NGX. We have never had an Airbus done right in any version of FS and when it comes to GA aircraft again the options out there are limitless... The surface hasn't even been scratched in FSX. FS9 by contrast has way more GA options and still it's laughable what's flying in the real world versus what's been done virtually. When you say the market is dwindling where is it going, to X-Plane? Sorry to tell you, X-Plane has a few more versions before it ever could think about replacing FSX or FS9 and even then it would take 3PD to make it happen. There's no doubt it will happen though if MS keeps screwing around... Speaking of FSX, it has a long way to go add-on market wise and to add insult to injury so does FS9 as iFly proved. If your checking I know more than a few payware developers let alone freeware guys that are laughing at what you wrote here.Wow...

There is a reason you dont see a lot of big iron done to the level of PMDG's NGX. It takes time, it takes money, and it takes man power. All 3 of those are in very short supply. If you think its so easy, go do one yourself. How many 3rd party projects have you been involved in to tell me what is what? Wow...

[Dillon 2,198]

There is a reason you dont see a lot of big iron done to the level of PMDG's NGX. It takes time, it takes money, and it takes man power. All 3 of those are in very short supply. If you think its so easy, go do one yourself. How many 3rd party projects have you been involved in to tell me what is what?Wow...

You just said above that every popular aircraft was done 3 times over and the market for FSX is dead because there's nothing left to do. Now your trying to make a point that doesn't make since especially considering your previous statements... :Monkey:If anything you don't understand what it takes to create add-ons that's why you think Microsoft is just going to come into this arena and take over everything. Kill off all 3rd Party Developers and do everything in the DLC. It's obvious who's clueless and it's not me. I don't know about you personally but your glowing ideas of Microsoft and the scope of the DLC is beyond hilarious. :LMAO:I'll name a few projects I've been involved in and/or worked on over the years:Feelthere 737, Airbus series 1 & 2, and other projectsDreamfleet - Most of all their projectsFSX user discovery team for MicrosoftiFlyCountless freeware projects for people like Shez, Colin Lowe, and others.There's a long list in which I feel I don't need to go over everything with you. Who have you worked with? :( Edited February 16, 2012 by Dillon

[Tom Allensworth 1,532]

This is the idiotic baffoon statement I was referring to above.

Take a very deep breath Dillion. Satements like that are going to polarize... don't go there.

[Guest jahman]

My first post in the flight forum...was going to start a new topic and still may, but this post is exactly where I have a problem...You say "we are upset and we are being left behind. Accept that."OK, I accept it! Are you happy now? I fully understand where you are coming from too, and I still accept it. Now it's your (plural, as you used 'we') turn to finally accept it.

No, you're not getting it: You are getting a new flight simulator for your type of flying (GA), whereas we (we, because there are many of us folks flying complex airliners worldwide), are not. That's a big difference!

We all know that Flight will not have heavy iron, at least for the forseeable future, possibly never will. Accept it! I don't understand why you (plural) all say the same things over and over and OVER again. No 24K airports, no SDK, atc, ai, real weather, etc. Accept these facts already and move on.

Easy for you to say, you're getting a new flight simulator. "We" are not.

I too would like to see some/many of these things, but for the time being, I accept the fact that they are not incuded in the initial build, and I am very curious to see what Flight looks like in two weeks and two years, if it's still around.Now our goals in flight sim are different. I like GA, you like heavies. That's fine. But I'll say this, when all the new heavy iron comes out, the PMDG's, the new 737, etc. I don't feel left behind.

Of course you don't feel left behind! Why would you? In FSX you do have great GA aircraft to fly, and now you also have a new GA simulator in Flight. Life's great (for you). Wht would you feel you're being left behind?

Although they sound like fantastic products, it's just not my cup of tea. I fly low and slow over Orbx scenery, and some megascenery, in RealAir scouts, SF260, the both Dukes, Twin Otter and Pilatus mostly. Throw in some REX and few other niceties, and I'm in flight sim heaven. My passion for aviation increased the more I got into FSX, which I love. Went to the airport last year, trained in and got my Sport Pilots license in a Cessna SkyCatcher and I'm out at the airport 3 times a week, flying, hanging out and enjoying the whole deal that aviation is offering me. I'm a GA pilot flying an LSA. (Got the Flight1 Skycatcher the day it came out along with FTX NZ) Awesome stuff no doubt. So, besides being a great sim, FSX spurred my interest in aviation so much that I went out and got a pilot's license. I will always love FSX for that, and for what it is. In FSX, I always wanted to get into FS Passengers or air hauler, but it really wasn't set up for GA. I didn't feel left behind or upset, it just wasn't made for me. I did get invloved with FS economy and it is a blast.

FS Passengers, Air Hauler and FS Economy honestly are secondary aspects of GA flying. The primary aspect of GA flying is of course having the GA aircraft to fly in, and in FSX you certainly have excellent GA aircraft. And with Flight you have a new simulator geared towards GA aircraft. So you're all set. Good for you.

You ask "us" to accept that Flight is not for you. Now it's your turn, accept the fact that flight is not for you and stop feeling left out or left behind. Every one of the planes you fly in FSX is a phenomenal simulation in itself, I don't begrudge you from enjoying it or feel bad that I don't. It is what it is. Accept it and move on.

You evidently didn't understand a word I wrote in my previous post: "We" are not just "feeling" we were left behind. We actually "are" being left behind, that bothers us, and that's what you need to accept. Why is that so hard for you to do?Cheers,- jahman.

[Arwen 289]

Jahman, I don't believe that Flight was designed to be only be a "simulator geared towards GA aircraft." It was designed for more than that.I've stated over and over on this forum that Flight is not finished yet (and I keep getting accused of being way too optimistic).What will be released in a few weeks is just the Free Core Simulator Platform, along with one large island (4,028 square miles of land), and a couple of small GA aircraft.Plus the first DLC that users can purchase (the Hawaiian Adventure Pack and a few more small GA sircraft).But that is meant to be just the beginning. We are all getting a new flight simulator. We are just not getting it all at once.I've also stated that Flight is going to surprise some people (in a good way). And I still believe that to be true.

Edited February 16, 2012 by Arwen

[N2056 33]

If anything you don't understand what it takes to create add-ons that's why you think Microsoft is just going to come into this arena and take over everything. Kill off all 3rd Party Developers and do everything in the DLC. It's obvious who's clueless and it's not me. I don't know about you personally but your glowing ideas of Microsoft and the scope of the DLC is beyond hilarious.

Considering he was a member of Aces I'd say he's not as clueless as you think. He's already put out a few independant titles for FSX that are very well done. What have you created?

[Guest jahman]

Jahman, I don't believe that Flight was designed to be only be a "simulator geared towards GA aircraft." It was designed for more than that.

Arwen, I am only describing what Flight seens like it will be on the 29th, given the lack of any information at all from MS (Thanks, MS!).As you know, I do hope in the future Flight will offer more, but at this point we really have no information to go on, and the general coments coming from the Executive Producer of Flight in his interviews are not encouraging.Cheers,- jahman.

[Attila 2]

I don't think we need to make this a VFR vs liners debate. I think all of us are in this together, except the very few who are happy with their new race car and the one track they can use it on. After they know every tree and every waterfall and every quirk of the few planes they can fly, what will they do? They will complain to MS just the same, because they have run out of content. It doesn't matter how fast MS will put stuff out, because it will never be fast enough.If MS puts out content too fast, some people will not buy everything. So it is in MS's interest to slow DLC release until they are satisfied that they won't sell many more of the currently available DLC. It will be a fine balance of people asking for more content and MS maximizing profits.At the end we are all going to be in the same boat, not having what we really want.