Hi,I, like many others I imagine, have noticed the price increase in payware over the last months, now I totally understand that as time goes on the addons become more and more complex, thus increasing the amount of time need to create these addons, hence the price increasing.What I am finding a little hard now is that there is no way to "test" out these addons before I buy them, if the addon is only a few pounds I can prehaps take the risk, but take the Feelthere CRJ, now I am not picking on them personally I am just using it as an example.To me Feelthere are an unknown quantity, there addon looks very nice, and I would like to buy it, BUT, at $35 can I, and many others, afford to take the "risk" on something, that I may not like, something that may not run very well on my system, or something that I just dont like.On Wilcos (the people who publish the addon) website, the writing states at the bottom, NO REFUND OFFERED, so this means I have absoloutly no come back if for some reason it is not what I expected (actually this is not the case in the UK, as it is against UK law to refuse a refund if the product is "of unmerchatable quality).Now the soloution, developers MUST look at a way of people being able to test these addons before buying them, otherwise its a leap of faith, although developers that I know, i.e. realair simulations I have no hesitation, as I know the quality of there work, but still there may be people who dont and would like to try them out.I think that developers will say that trial versions lead to piracy, this maybe true, but I also think offering expensive addons with no come back and no trial also leads to piracy, is customer A going to pay $35 for something they have no idea on other than a few screenshots, or are they going to get it from P2P networks, and try it that way?.I certainly hope that there will be a way to trial these addons, but untill that time I am going to have to pass up on the expensive, unknown addons.I would like to know what other simmers thinkCheersDan.

Hi Dan,A trail version like you suggest is a good idea. I don't think that trail versions lead to more piracy, dependened on how the security is build in. There are more than enough methods to criple software.If the only protection is a keycode then it will lead to priracy, but if the software is also cripled in other ways, I don't think it will be a problem for the developer.As far as I know (I'm not a lawer) in Holland there is a law that goods purchased via TV/Internet etc can be returned within 2 weeks without questions asked. Specifically with regard to the reasons you mentioned. Since Holland and Belgium (Wilco) and a lot of other European countries, share the same laws, I think Wilco can't make the 'No-Refund' claim.I can imaging they try, let's face it: Nobody starts a lawsuite for 35 Euri.But there's always the possibility to tell your creditcard company to transfer the money back. That is: it will be put on a temp account untill the matter has been solved.

The price is a bit high for new addons, but given the ever increasing complexity of the addons it's what one would expect. A couple of years ago, an aircraft only needed a low detail exterior model (high detail models caused low performance), a 2d panel, and maybe custom sounds. Today you get a "simulator inside the simulator" with a complete "Virtual Cockpit" where everything is clickable and looks exactly like the real thing, custom sounds, an extremely detailed exterior model with every detail, right down to the fuel cap being animated, and a flight model test-flown by real pilots of that aircraft and tweaked for hours upon hours.Still, I think $30+ for an addon aircraft or airport scenery is a bit expensive. New games sell for just a little more and they take years to develop by a big team of artists, programmers, musicians etc. They contain extremely detailed characters, "scenery", a plot, music, sounds, thousands of textures...Of course the market for addons is much smaller than for action games so that's understandable.It's very hard to make a trial version of something for FS, because the format FS uses for aircraft and sceneries is very "open" and not at all made for those tasks. For example, you can program the gagues so that they stop working after 7 days or something, but someone will figure out how to "unlock" the gauges again. As far as I know, there isn't much that can be done about the actual flight model to have it stop working after a specified time.With sceneries it should be easier. With airport sceneries, you can stamp "DEMO" all ovet the scenery I suppose...I think that for things like Megascenery or Switzerland Professional, they could release a small part of the scenery for free for people to try - maybe one airport and the surroundings - big enough to take off and take a good look at the scenery but small enough to make people want more. That is what they did for the UK VFR Scenery for X-Plane - you can download the Isle of Wight for free, then buy the rest of the scenery if you want mroe. A great decision.After you have bought some addons, you come to learn what you can expect from that developer. There are certain developers that I turst will always release high quality stuff, and others that I know usually don't release as good products. When buying something from a new company for the first time, I try to read forum posts and reviews and look at the Screen Shots Forum to try and form an opinion. I also read up on the download policy, any copy protection etc. to make sure I can reinstall the addon as many times as I like without being treated like a thief.Microsoft could implement some kind of DRM (Digital Rights Management) for addon aircraft and sceneries, but that would essentially kill Freeware and scare many FS users away.

Hi Jimmi"After you have bought some addons, you come to learn what you can expect from that developer. There are certain developers that I turst will always release high quality stuff, and others that I know usually don't release as good products. When buying something from a new company for the first time, I try to read forum posts and reviews and look at the Screen Shots Forum to try and form an opinion. I also read up on the download policy, any copy protection etc. to make sure I can reinstall the addon as many times as I like without being treated like a thief."That is exactly my point, once you know a developer you get a feel for there work, but if you are new to a developer then there are unknown to you.The problem with reviews, screenshot etc, is that they are subject to another persons idea if whats good and whats not, there is no substitute to trying it out on your own hardware, in your own surroundings.CheersDan.

Don't run out and buy addons the moment they are released. Wait and see what people say on the forums. Especially with the more complex addons. Also read the product's official forums. A little bit of research can tell you a lot more than a demo which lasts a few minutes. If you don't like what is being charged for addons, then don't buy them.

>>>>>If you don't like what is being charged for addons, then don't buy them.<<<<

I guess ultimately the market will decide. If it was pmdg or captain sim selling the wilco plane I'd buy it in a flash because it's an aircraft I'd love to have in my hangar and I'd know that it would be quality through and through. I'd buy it day one. In this case, I'll wait a month or 2 and and watch these boards and see what the feedback is, and based on that decide what I'm doing. At $35, it's certainly not a snap purchase...billg

I bought my FS9 copy when it was first out for 45 GBP and to fly a plane in it I have to pay even more than half that FS costs .. I can't see why just a small add-on should cost so much ..

>I bought my FS9 copy when it was first out for 45 GBP and to>fly a plane in it I have to pay even more than half that FS>costs .. I can't see why just a small add-on should cost so>much .. If you have to ask that then you haven't flown one of the better ones....the PMDG 737NG for instance.The PMDG 737NG is probably more complicated then all of FS2004. lol

One thing I have found out is that the product will be released without any TCAS. I can't understand why developers continue to do this. Given the unpredictable nature of FS ATC, at the very least, these high priced addons should have some sort of "situational awareness" TCAS which doesn't have to be as complex as Lee's TCAS or the upcomming PMDG one. But something that gives you an idea of the position of the other AI airplanes around you. For the price, this should have been included.The developers at FeelThere are suggesting that people download freeware TCAS guages and install it into the panel.....amazing. The developer is even saying that the included cockpit sounds more than makes up for the ommission of the TCAS...http://www.iemit.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=313I beg to differ though.....although the omission of a TCAS wouldn't prevent me from making the purchase, I think that in general, all developers should include one with high priced payware addons.

From what I heard coding TCAS gauges (the more advanced ones) is quite difficult and takes a lot of development time.Also, in your post over there you mention something about 50 CDN for a panel...Are you suggesting that the FeelThere CRJ is going to be "nothing more" then a panel?

While I agree that the prices seem to be a bit higher lately and that Wilco was a bad choice for Feelthere, I don't feel that trial offers should be made. How many have payware aircraft that just sit in the hanger after a few flights? Not that you dislike it, but for one reason or another, you just prefer flying another. If you were able to install a flyable trial, many would probably not purchase. The best thing if $30 is to steep for your blood is to wait for the reviews and check the forums, you will get all the info you need in time.Regards, MichaelKDFWhttp://www.calvirair.com/mcpics/PBTMCa.jpgCalVirAir International VACougar Mountain Helicopters & Aviation[link:www.cgrmtnhelos.com]Cougar Mountain Helicopters

>>>>>Also, in your post over there you mention something about 50 CDN for a panel...Are you suggesting that the FeelThere CRJ is going to be "nothing more" then a panel?<<

No demo, no sale. That simple.A good example of this is FS Navigator. I have tried it a couple of times in the past because I could. That ability to try led to a hard sale.There is probably only one company left that I would buy blind and that is PMDG. Heck, I don't even trust Microsoft anymore when it comes to getting the shaft. :-lolNow this does not mean that the software is not great, it just means that the odds of me keying in my credit card number on a web site that I know nothing about is rather small.I understand the premise that electronic downloads make it so the developer doesn't really have much recourse when you don't want it after the fact. They need to have some kind of time limited version if they want my business.There will always be those who go out and find pirate versions just as there will always be those who upload the full version to the pirate sites in the first place. That is a given.By not having a demo, the only people you are actually hurting are the honest people who would actually buy the product. It does not stop the folks who get it under the table, they would not pay for it in the first place. Basically, you are hurting the wrong segment of the market, those who actually pay for things.

>>>>>I understand the premise that electronic downloads make it so the developer doesn't really have much recourse when you don't want it after the fact.<<<<