RealAir Lancair is out!

[Great Ozzie 101]

I'm also aware of the difference in the use of carb heat between Lycoming and Continental engines, due to placement of the carburetor. The Lyc pulls air through the oil heated sump, to which the carb is mounted, and the Continental doesn't.

 

Yes this is true... Lycoming induction pipes run thru (are integral with) the oil sump. But the heat from the sump warms the carb (as it is bolted to the sump) and it's at the butterfly valve that "carb icing" usually starts. What also matters with some Lycomings is the type of carb and where the fuel is injected (placement of the discharge nozzle and the concomitant vaporization / temp loss that occurs). Maybe current Pipers don't call for carb heat on landing... but I have an 80s Piper WarriorII manual that does call for Carb Heat as part of the normal procedure for landing *if required i.e. suspected (one major reason why one should always check the specific plane's AFM).

 

I have hundreds of hours in Warriors... always applied Carb Heat when the throttle went to idle (and "cleared" the engine for every 360° of power-off descent). Learned to fly in Indiana during the summer (+90°F humid days)... Winter... Summer... I have never experienced carb ice. Also, Carb Heat ALWAYS came off before the application of full power. Our university SOP at the time was to ALWAYS use carb heat before pulling power to idle.

 

I am also aware of Lycoming's Service Instruction on the "Use of Carburetor Heat Control"... that it states: "In making a landing approach, the carburetor heat is generally in the “Full Cold” position. However, if icing conditions are suspected, apply “Full Heat”. But this same Service Instruction also states: "Under certain moist atmospheric conditions (generally at a relative humidity of 50% or greater) and at temperatures of 20° to 90°F it is possible for ice to form in the induction system."

 

Back to our game...

 

Larry, you will see "Carb Ice" and even Icing effects with certain aircraft. A few days ago I was flying in the DH.88 Comet over Norway and lost power (also had to apply Pitot Heat). It also happened over Northern Africa (was either there or over Italy)... again, just a few days ago in the Comet... visible precip / near freezing temps both times.

 

It will happen in the Baron (of course, as mentioned the Baron is injected). "Real" Baron has an alternate air door that functions automatically if there is an induction blockage, but our (FSX) Baron requires one to hit the "H" key (watch the switches it flips).

 

Oh I know... you want to experience it Larry? Go fly the Innsbruck Approach Mission. If following instructions (gear & approach flaps out) be prepared to drop like a rock for part of the "descent"... that or apply "Carb Heat".

 

If the temperature is in the right range (usually 0 to 10C) AND there is enough moisture in the air then you are likely to get carb icing conditions.

 

For FSX I think that is pretty much right Andy... near freezing and (for me usually) some kind of visible precip.

 

I guess it's a good thing that the carb heat bind works in the background. It's a minimal impact to realism.

 

Agreed... either make it part of a preflight item or forget about it until needed... either way no big deal.

[tttocs 301]

Even fuel injected engines can suffer from ice buildup in the air intake venturi.

 

Agreed - however...

 

So, using H to toggle on "Carb Heat" isn't at all unrealistic with a fuel-injected engine!

 

I think that's a bit of a stretch. The key difference is in this sentence from early in your AOPA article quote: "However, when conditions are favorable for structural ice, fuelinjected engines can lose power and even fail if the air filter and intake passages are blocked by ice." Carb icing is a very specific phenomenon which can occur in conditions where structural icing wouldn't. In extremely humid conditions, it can occur in some remarkably warm temperatures in fact. I don't think FSX is outrageously aggressive in modeling this behaviour, but I do seem to experience it in conditions where structural icing wouldn't yet be in the equation.

 

Honestly, this is just one of those FSX anomolies - one that can be offputting the first time you experience it and can't figure out what's happening, but an absolute non-issue once you know what's going on.

 

Scott

[ryanbatc 12,876]

Sorry - don't mean to be humorless, but I interpreted the "hehe" incorrectly. Heh, heh. :-)

 

Scott

 

Which is perfectly normal... Sometimes I'm amazed we can even carry out conversations on a forum.... impossible to read the nonverbal when you're staring at a screen!

[tttocs 301]

Getting back on topic: finally had a chance to go through the docs and do more than just a few quick test flights. Oh, my, my, my... Flying the Lancair into Orbx' new KJAC is about as good as it gets short of doing it for real. Sheer brilliance all the way 'round!

 

Slippery little booger. :-)

 

Scott

[n4gix 4,947]

I think that's a bit of a stretch. The key difference is in this sentence from early in your AOPA article quote: "However, when conditions are favorable for structural ice, fuelinjected engines can lose power and even fail if the air filter and intake passages are blocked by ice."

 

The point I attempted to make is that the H (carb heat) control is "realistic" only in the sense that it is the functional equivalent of taking some other action, such as an Alt Air source, in those cases where icing does block the air intake...

 

Regardless of whether carburated or fuel-injected, some action must be taken. In some a/c the first line of action may well be automatic, in other a/c manual intervention must be taken.

 

Whether FS9/X models icing effects realistically across all engine types is another question entirely... :Nerd:

[LAdamson 240]

I have hundreds of hours in Warriors... always applied Carb Heat when the throttle went to idle (and "cleared" the engine for every 360° of power-off descent). Learned to fly in Indiana during the summer (+90°F humid days)... Winter... Summer... I have never experienced carb ice. Also, Carb Heat ALWAYS came off before the application of full power. Our university SOP at the time was to ALWAYS use carb heat before pulling power to idle.

 

Late getting back on this. But of interest.

 

I also flew the Piper Warriors (carb), but more time in the Archer (carb), and then the Arrow which was fuel injected. In my area of flight, we're at 4200-4600' elevation to start with, and low desert type humidity. Not one Piper "check list" that I used, ever specified using carb heat for landing........unless you think you need it. And that is more along the lines of Lycoming's engine manuals. These planes were late 70's and early 80's. There is always the thought of risk, of leaving carb heat "on", and loosing available power on a go-around at high altitude, versus the low risk of carb ice on a Lyc in lower humidity conditions. Since your rental aircraft were back east & higher humidity, I can see the reasoning. Of course, the older Cessna's called for carb heat, here also.

 

For the RV, I used the same thought pattern, since I flew Pipers much more than Cessnas; and the fact that the engine is a Lycoming with the carb bolted to the warm oil sump. Other RV builders have done much the same. If they principally flew Cessnas, then carb heat becomes part of the landing checklist. If they flew Pipers, then much of the time it doesn't. Even if they're all Lycs, which most are. My Lycoming engine manual say's not to, unless I feel that the conditions warrant it.

 

L.Adamson

[maclore 0]

Just my 2 cents worth. Woudn't the obvious fix here be for RealAir to set the Alternate Air knob to just turn on/off carb heat? Then we could all be happy when we fly into IMC with cold temperatures. Otherwise, I have zero issues with this addon. It is my current favorite out of a rather large "hanger". :Drooling:

[yankeegolf3 51]

hello,

 

Does the lancair work in shared cockpit mode?

 

THX

[tttocs 301]

Woudn't the obvious fix here be for RealAir to set the Alternate Air knob to just turn on/off carb heat?

 

That wouldn't be my choice - see my previous comments about the difference between induction system icing and carb icing.

 

Scott

[Aerazur 0]

hello,

 

Does the lancair work in shared cockpit mode?

 

THX

 

Yes it seems, I had a session with a friend yesterday, all is going well. We'll have a longer nav today, I'll let you know.

[robert young 2,897]

Yes it seems, I had a session with a friend yesterday, all is going well. We'll have a longer nav today, I'll let you know.

 

Good to hear shared cockpit is working. We we unsure because of the multiple effects and other custom features. If anyone has any multiplayer feedback we would welcome any reports.

 

Rob - RealAir

[SolelunaTristan 1]

Hi Guys,

 

can´t wait for the Paintkit....so i made already some previews of 2 paints wich i had planned to do.

Dont worry about the Reg-Numbers, there will be none when i offer them for downloading.

 

Red/Black

 

 

 

Blue/Grey

 

 

 

Tristan

[HercFan 1]

I'll take the red and black to go please...

 

Love them. Can't wait to see the master painters have fun once the pk is out.

[Ken_Stallings 2]

I just purchased this aircraft and I am very impressed! Across the board excellent in all measures! The flight dynamics is very well done. The systems work flawlessly and the sounds are outstanding. So many details are done in a highly accurate and realistic manner that it is hard to adequately list them. As a pilot, I focus first on how the plane flies and in my judgment despite never flying an actual Lancair Legacy, I must conclude that for a single engine high performance aircraft, this one flies in every way that I would anticipate with perhaps a small squabble that it does not model yaw in a climb due to p-effect and torque. But, that is a very minor observation and was made without knowing first hand whether this effect actually appears on the real airplane.

 

The way the RealAir models shakes and vibrations and places them seamlessly with sounds to replicate stall characteristics is something I wish all design groups would do. Having a high horsepower engine on such a small airframe should produce noticeable vibrations even at idle and you get that! Also, when using the brake, you get a slight brake squeak, which can also be normal. The impression I got is that it is a small airframe and so sounds are louder than in many other aircraft that added extra weight for sound absorbing interiors. I would imagine that with this airplane that a high quality set of ANR headsets are an absolute must and RealAir certainly provided that impression!

 

In the pattern and on final approach through touchdown I found nothing that seemed unrealistic. Also, the amount of p-effect and torque on intial takeoff roll seemed exactly what I would expect. Perhaps a bit more twitchiness during normal cruise flight might better replicate how I might expect such a small airframe to react to turbulence, but again that is only a guess.

 

If RealAir used a real world Legacy owner to evalute and offer feedback on the aircraft's flight characteristics, and it can be said that my two nit-picky observations are off the mark, then I would say the FDE for this aircraft is perfect.

 

The way that the avionics all work is flawless. I couldn't ask for a better presentation from the standpoint of exterior and interior modeling, nor could I ask for a better functionality of avionics in the VC.

 

As I wrote over at SOH, if you are sitting on the fence about purchasing this airplane, then I heartily recommend you take the plunge and get it. I think you will be very impressed!

 

Ken Stallings

[Ken_Stallings 2]

Yep I'd like to know what is "ALT AIR" for too!?

 

Alternate air is a standby source of static air pressure that can be used when ice freezes over your static air ports on the side of the fuselage. Static air pressure is used by your altimeter to record your altitude. So, if you ice up, you pull the alternate air knob and this closes off the static air pressure from the static ports and uses the alternate source, which in most cases is simply the air pressure inside the cockpit.

 

Ken