>Hi>>I want to thank all that have tried to answer my questions.>>I am however a little offended by some of you that have tried>to put >>a sinister light behind this post but will try to explain.>>I did not create this account so know nothing about names and>>>profiles as it was my son who set this up.>>As I hold the purse strings I thought after talking with my>son that >>it might be a good idea to try to get all the facts behind>both of >>these models before spending this much money on a game.>>I thought it might be a good Father/Son thing that we could>learn >>together and wanted some forthright answers.That is all it>was.>>SamuelOk Pete, whatever.....You must be sailing close to the wind, Youve been on the inner marker for a while now...........http://www.arianedesign.com/catalogue.aspI say go for[h1][centre]PMDG[/h1][/centre]Jason

Gilly,I would only believe it when I see it. Did this beta tester actually use the PMDG version? Personally I am awfully suspicious regarding anything from P.T., since I once bought something from him where the box definitely did not agree with the actual content. Needless to say that it promised more than was on the CD.My experience with PMDG is just the opposite: excellent quality, magnificent customer support, extremely open and continuously striving for perfection. Their 737NG is without doubt the most complex and complete aircraft I have ever seen for FS.My two eurocents,Henri

I hear it...KA-chink.Padlock coming. Everyone duck.

>There is a third choice. Turns out that Dreamfleet is also>going to be doing an NG after their present projects. (727,>737-200, 737-300, 737-400, 737-500, ATR). Given the length of>time they take however, I wouldn't look for that NG until>maybe we're into the second year of FS2006 at least. Just>check their forums where Lou himself said that we need to be>"VERY PATIENT" for that NG.>>Do a search on the forums here and you'll see why a lot of>people want to stay away from Ariane and Bobo/Peter>Tishma/whatever other alias he goes by.>>"And where PMDG lead, others will follow.." :)

Yeah this beta tester also use PMDG 737. Ariane will be more advance, more systems and correct systems. I have a big 737 manual here and when I mirror the PMDG with that manual, many "advance" thing's are not correct. Not a very big problem in normal simming, but they are there.The Ariane beta team is using that manual for testing the systems that can be set correct in FS, and they are correct. I'm talking about hyd, elec, air, irs and fmc systems.I know that the FS communitie love's PMDG but in myn opinion is that not always objective.Only thing what I want to say, is that you can't walk around the upcoming Ariane.Best regards.--------------------GillyNetherlands

Gilly...Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Pretty much what your tester friend has said is what the Ariane site is attempting to say. Thus, in the absence of the product being in the hands of the user, it serves as nothing more than an advertisement by a beta tester already invested in the product. We lend more truth to anecdotal reports from forum regulars having used and paid for their products. I am sure a true comparison will come, but right now PMDG is the only player in this market. -John

after that chat I think the Ariane 737NG is going to be beter then PMDG Give me a BREAK Gill, you certianly have no idea what you are talking about it's almost FUNNY. As for this so-called Beta tester I would like to direct ALL folks to this thread on another forum where it is stated that there will NOT BE ALT INTV and SPD INTV and VNAV ALT. I can IMAGINE how many other *items* will be not there. All you see are pretty pictures and no HEART. It's all hype where is the list of items? Why the big secret? Let's not be taken by this crapola. Now how in the world can that be more advanced? He gives me the run around too just read it and see.http://www.fsnordic.net/discussion/index.php?board=16;action=display;threadid=23715 Of course with NO FORUM to hear issues after release I cannot even believe anyone would do business with such a crook as Peter *the* threat Tisma. But hey don't say we did not warn you! What does Avsim think of this Araine bunch? Avsim are a great judge of companies trying to swindle the comunity so lets all have a read once again straight from Avsimhttp://www.avsim.com/pages/0902/pt_again.html I would like to quote a friend and who flys the real 800-900. "PMDG737-800 is the ultimate civvy sim. Good enough to use to train for real world 737NG operations. Brad Marsh - Virgin Blue 800 Pilot All I have to say concerning their AFDS-FMS is DO NOT MAKE ME LAUGH[h4]Best Wishes,Randy J. Smithhttp://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/forum/betaimg.jpgAMD 64 3200+ | ASUS KV8 DELUXE | GFORCE 5700 ULTRA @535/1000 | Maxtor 6Y080M0 SATA 80 GIG | 512 DDR 400 | Windows Xp Pro | Windows Xp Pro 64 |

PMDG PMDG PMDG and yes, PMDGDo yourself a big favor, avoid "he who's name cannot be spoken - Harry Potter, "____fill in ur favorite Potter title___"Randy Jura, KPDX

Well, the only thing I can think of that PMDG doesn't have is the IRS system modelled. And they are looking into that for a future update. And we all know PMDG's experience with promised updates.....so far, they've always delivered. Is Ariane going to be doing that? I will say one thing...and this is personal. No matter how good Ariane's NG is, no matter if it actually makes me breakfast in the morning, I will NEVER support anything that P.T. is involved in.But that's just me. To each his own. I have chosen MY own.And its PMDG.

RandyAeroplane Boy asked something, and I give him the advise to not ignore the upcomming Ariane.Almost everybody know PMDG and they making very good addon's. Ariane have a bad history and is a very close group, I don't even know who Ariane is. Today I had a chat with a Ariane beta tester and I only share what he told me.And that there are systems not correct within the PMDG you can't deny- Bleed Air pressure- HYD system A and B- Full autoland only on CMD A- Dual autoland when on only 1 gen powering the busses- Fire trikker engine shutt off ??- G/S before LOC ???And these thing I also shared with a KLM 737NG pilot.--------------------GillyNetherlands

Well let me state a few words about the IRS system. No one says that the IRS is not missed, I think all agree on that point. Should it be there? Well I think it should have been but is it really a point of limiting this simulation? Let me give you an example from one of the greatest airline sims of all time namely PIC 767 PIC is great even though it does not have Engine Out information on the FMC. Engine out training is something real pilots need but does that take away from the thousands of flights PIC has enjoyed from hard core simmers? What about TCAS? The way PIC flys compared to the real world 767 is pretty darn close. So certainly people do not pass it by for such things. PMDG 737 NG dies not have IRS panels or function but real pilots will certainly use the GPS position for their IRS. The list of items simulated on the PMDG are incredible. SOme of the first in FS are1] True CWS simulated unlike anything ever done2] Accurate VNAV modes not seen like Speed Intervention and Altitude intervention and Vnav Alt modes.3] True VNAV performance in all phases of flight according to Boeing FPPMs and idle descents. Of course we DO have Engine out data and many other FMS items not modelled on any other FMC. The list is really a long one, so to me and many folks that I know the missing IRS while desired does not limit the learning and realsim brought to us by this incredible aircraft simulation. [h4]Best Wishes,Randy J. Smithhttp://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/forum/betaimg.jpgAMD 64 3200+ | ASUS KV8 DELUXE | GFORCE 5700 ULTRA @535/1000 | Maxtor 6Y080M0 SATA 80 GIG | 512 DDR 400 | Windows Xp Pro | Windows Xp Pro 64 |

- Full autoland only on CMD A- G/S before LOC ??? I see you are mistaken here Gill, let me see if I can help you out.1] Our Pilots who DO fly the NG stated that the real NG will certainly LAND on single channel mode! Now sure we all know the FMA does not say FLARE but according to BOEING who were contacted regarding this very issue it will auoland on single channel. a: It is not certifed to do so but can.b: Pilots cannot try this in the real world and reading the AOMS etc it will state that one must land manually but that does not rule out that it can! Like I said this is from a Captain on the team who talks with Boeing and I do know he knows what he is talking about.As for G/S before LOC, you are not aware that this is a real option on the NG? SOme Ngs have this inhibited and some DO NOT. Please get your facts straight before you produce things that you think you are correct about.As to the rest of your list, are you expecting a CBT? Who in the world looks at every little item like that except of course people like ME. But what I find interesting is that all real world pilots who fly the NG say how much IS there and DONE RIGHT but it seems like this type of argument only comes from certain simmers like you Gill.[h4]Best Wishes,Randy J. Smithhttp://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/forum/betaimg.jpgAMD 64 3200+ | ASUS KV8 DELUXE | GFORCE 5700 ULTRA @535/1000 | Maxtor 6Y080M0 SATA 80 GIG | 512 DDR 400 | Windows Xp Pro | Windows Xp Pro 64 |

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAH!! Loved that one.

I am locking this thread as it has come to the end of being useful. Aidihttp://www.avsim.com/pages/0100/avsim_sig.jpg

That autoland feature is something i didn't know. G/S before LOC when that is a airliner option, then it's maybe something for the style menu. My Transavia and KLM source have told me that a 737 does no G/S before LOC, so they have that option. Strange thing is you only react on those 2 thing's.One thing I would say before go the wrong direction in this thread. The PMDG addon is more then great, and I only fly this bird from day 1. But we cant say it's 100% perfect always. I only have wanted to say to the thread starter; also look to the Ariane and who is the best we see after Ariane releases the 737.--------------------GillyNetherlands