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Tutorial problem - SINGLE CH even though both APs are set

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IMO the easiest point to miss is having both radios set for the ILS freq.....

Cheers, Graham McAllister - Melbourne, Australia

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Some points:

 

-EVERY SINGLE NGX CAN AUTOLAND. People will tell you you need to activate fail operational option. THIS IS NOT TRUE, DO NOT BELIEVE THEM. These people do not understand what are they talking about.

 

-Connect second AP unit when APP mode is active. You can also do this before G/S capture, but APP needs to be active.

 

-It is normal to get SINGLE CH annunciation after full ILS capture on autoland. This indicates that while both AP channels are armed, only one is active so far. Self-check and activation sequence will commence at about 1500ft, and you will then have CMD (or LAND2 or LAND3) annunciation shown shortly - only panic if this is not shown after passing 800ft.

 

-Notice that FLARE is armed. (ROLLOUT too on fail op option)

 

-also make sure both radios are set.for the ILS frequency and course. While the 737 is perfectly capable of landing on single radio signal, you need to have both radios set so that there is fallback if one of them fails in critical moment.

 

 

Autoland in the 737 almost as it should be done (this was unscripted and late nght, but it worked OK, just some minor methodical errors):

 

Notice that this is with the FAIL PASSIVE option, which is what an overwhelming majority of the NGs have.

hi good video see that you got the blue fog like i had found out i had the dx10 preview selected in the fsx once i unselected this i got the white fog back again as it should be

I7-8700k,Corsair h1101 cooler ,Asus Strix Gaming Intel Z370 S11 motherboard, Corsair 32gb ramDD4,, gtx 1080ti Card,  RM850 power supply

 

Peter kelberg

For a dual or single channel approach you press APP and NOT VOR/LOC when you are on a localiser intercept heading. Both localiser frequencies in the active and inbound course selected on both sides of the MCP.

(please note: APP light goes out when the Localiser/g/s ahas been intercepted)

 

In a dual channel approach Channel I is shown in the FMA until 1500 feet radio altitude, AFTER 1500 RA the second autopilot is engaged and channel 1 is replaced by FLARE and is shown as armed below the G/S in the pitch annunciator but only when the second autopilot is engaged.

 

You can engage the second autopilot anywhere from 1500 RA to 800 RA, but after 800 RA the second autopilot cannot be angaged and you cannot fly a dual channel approach.

 

If by 1500 RA and before 800 RA channel 1 is not shown and FLARE has not armed in under G/S, then re check both localiser frequencies and inbound course selctors on both sides, and re engage the second autopilot before reaching 800 RA.

If flare is not armed by 800 RA then you can only fly a single channel approach.

 

At 350 RA G/S is replaced by 'FLARE' and 'FLARE' is annunciated. By then aircraft performs the autoland feature, at 400 RA the autopilot commands a pitch up trim flare menouvre, and at 50 feet RA flare begins and RETARD is annunciated.

 

If by 350 RA G/S has not been replaced by 'FLARE' then the autopilot will Automatically disengage and Go Around is immediately required if visual of the field is not obtained.

 

 

What is important is that the second autopilot has to be enaged at or before 1500 radio altitude with Channel 1 removed and Flare armed below G/S before reaching 800 RA. Otherwise only 1 autopilot can be engaged and yu can only fly a single channel approach.

Weird.... :huh:

 

Here is what I have setup when performing CATII/III autolands:

 

Pilot and Co-Pilot radios NAV radios set to same frequencies

MINS knob on RADIO, set to 100

APP light on, CMD A and B on

HGS set to runway length and altitude, mode switched to PRI Axxx ARM (CAT III Autoland armed)

Flaps armed

Barometer set to arriving airports weather data

...and the other stuff needed when on autopilot.... :P

 

I normally land at -64 to -81 FPM on autopilot.

 

What I don't get about the video, the guy disengages the autopilot as soon as he touch down. When I perform an autoland, I don't turn off anything; the most I do is cut throttle when IDLE appears, and began reversing thrust once my rear wheels touch down. The autothrottle arm switch disengages when I cut throttle, and when I shut off the engines, the A/P warning will sound.

 

Also I see that many NGX pilots do not fully utilize their Center MFD or their Lower MFD. Why is that?

 

Here is my operational setup of my 737 7/8/900...

2012-7-13_13-14-25-980.jpg

Rodney E. Jacobs

Weird.... :huh:

 

Here is what I have setup when performing CATII/III autolands:

 

Pilot and Co-Pilot radios NAV radios set to same frequencies

MINS knob on RADIO, set to 100

APP light on, CMD A and B on

HGS set to runway length and altitude, mode switched to PRI Axxx ARM (CAT III Autoland armed)

Flaps armed

Barometer set to arriving airports weather data

...and the other stuff needed when on autopilot.... :P

 

I normally land at -64 to -81 FPM on autopilot.

 

What I don't get about the video, the guy disengages the autopilot as soon as he touch down. When I perform an autoland, I don't turn off anything; the most I do is cut throttle when IDLE appears, and began reversing thrust once my rear wheels touch down. The autothrottle arm switch disengages when I cut throttle, and when I shut off the engines, the A/P warning will sound.

 

Also I see that many NGX pilots do not fully utilize their Center MFD or their Lower MFD. Why is that?

 

Here is my operational setup of my 737 7/8/900...

2012-7-13_13-14-25-980.jpg

 

 

The thrust automatically retards during touchdown, hence the 'RETARD' annunciation in the FMA during rollout.

 

The auto throttle automatically disengages after touch down, HOWEVER the autopilot must be disengaged during rollout.

PRI Axxx ARM (CAT III Autoland armed)

 

It means that AIII HUD mode armed (just AIII indication of HUD). It can be on CAT I, II or III, doesn't matter. You may not use HUD at all.

 

What I don't get about the video, the guy disengages the autopilot as soon as he touch down.

 

Because it's FAIL-PASSIVE autopilot. It does autoland (flare and main landing gear touchdown), but it's NOT tracking runway centerline after touchdown.

In FCTM5.26-5.29 you can find all the differences between fail-passive and fail-op autopilots.

 

is cut throttle when IDLE appears

 

IIRC that's an airbus feature. Because Airbus thrust levers can be moved manually only. Boeing retards them at 27' RA, and A/T disengages two seconds after touchdown.

 

Also I see that many NGX pilots do not fully utilize their Center MFD or their Lower MFD. Why is that?

 

You are using old side-by-side upper DU, most airlines using upper/lower option with compact display feature. This helps you to keep heads-up. Lower display mostly used on ground.

You are using old side-by-side upper DU, most airlines using upper/lower option with compact display feature. This helps you to keep heads-up. Lower display mostly used on ground.

IIRC this combination is not even possible with real NGs. If you have PFD/ND, you get over/under EIS, with condensed display as another option.

 

There is nothing nominally important to be shown on lower panel, and you can bring it up at any time anyway bu pressing a button.

 

Because it's FAIL-PASSIVE autopilot. It does autoland (flare and main landing gear touchdown), but it's NOT tracking runway centerline after touchdown.

In FCTM5.26-5.29 you can find all the differences between fail-passive and fail-op autopilots.

 

Exactly. 95%+ NGs are delivered with two-channel autoland capable autopilot (FAIL PASSIVE), which is unable to track the centerline after touchdown, simply because it is unable to control rudder directly. Therefore the aircraft is at risk of drifting off from the runway, especially with a crosswind, but different conditions under left/right gear leg would suffice.

 

Therefore you have to disconnect AP after TD and start tracking the centerline immediately. That is one of the reasons why no standart 737 is rated under CAT IIIb - unless it has a HUGS for improved crew visibility, or a third channel to keep the centerline automatically.

--Peter Fabian 
RTFM.jpg

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