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Ralf Maylin

Seasonal textures, an example

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Just a quick shot from the hip, a few minutes edit of the "USA_trees_East" textures. I know, the trees don't have leaves in winter. But as said, a few minutes edit...

 

Default texture, good for spring and summer

USA_trees_East.jpg?psid=1

 

 

 

 

Fall

USA_trees_East_fall.jpg?psid=1

 

 

 

Winter

USA_trees_East_winter.jpg?psid=1

 

 

 

Winter, snow covered

USA_trees_East_snow.jpg?psid=1

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No, sorry, really, thats not how winter trees should look like (your trees are just some light grey) .... but I have (even if its almost unknown) really - hand - winterized versions of the current trees already (history: XP10 uses the same textures which I and Albert introduced for our XP9 forest add-ons ... and at that time I once did the work of winterizing them). And it took me many days to do it ...

 

You can find them here (and just need to rename them to match XP10 names ... but they have - at least until now - the exact same layout -they are in the Europe 9.1.1 and USA 9.1.3 sets):

http://www.alpilotx....rest-downloads/

 

With those, your example texture looks like this (and even my version is far from ideal! As for example I didn't really "remove" the foliage from the deciduous trees. Thats why I see, that this task is nothing you can simply automate - at least from my point of view):

 


Andras Fabian / Alpilotx

Visit www.alpilotx.net, a site about X-plane scenery

You can see some landscape and other photographs from me here:

http://www.flickr.co...s/weathermaker/

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That was not meant to be perfect. Evn your different, better looking snow textures create a kind of pattern that can be pasted to a layer on top. And my fall textures are probably to red and they miss some yellow dots. I just wanted to show that it can be done. By an amateur paint slinger like me, just give me time to check in sim and rework them until they fit. LR could do them btw, or source it out for a few bucks.

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I did not say, that it can't be done. Just that if you want to have it some quality, you need to do it - mostly - by hand, because the automatic version is - for my taste - too far from "good enough".


Andras Fabian / Alpilotx

Visit www.alpilotx.net, a site about X-plane scenery

You can see some landscape and other photographs from me here:

http://www.flickr.co...s/weathermaker/

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Understood. It's a balance of quality and availability. I would prefer a basic grey tree over a green one, when Austin blows his nice snow over the runway.

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Or for now, you take my trees (at least if you want the really snowy ones ... at least up to 10.20 they are definitely compatible). But other than that, I think we agree.


Andras Fabian / Alpilotx

Visit www.alpilotx.net, a site about X-plane scenery

You can see some landscape and other photographs from me here:

http://www.flickr.co...s/weathermaker/

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Interesting post. As you can see, LR should rely more on external resources. A lot of man power can be found around the world for that kind of job. As a graphic designer I know that for sure. It took me 5 min to merge two files found in previous posts and makes this custom winter tree set.

 

USA_trees_East_winterA.jpg

 

It would be interesting to experiment with ground textures as well.

Alan

+

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Great discussion on this guys, very informative. I could post this in either thread, it doesn't matter, I see the same thing happening in both. This isn't meant to de-rail, just to bring an "all to familiar" observation to light, for those around us, that somehow can't see it

 

To the knowledgeable few, and please don't have a hissy fit, would it be too hard to implement the "FSX" approach to seasonal textures? They are good enough as far as I'm concerned, perhaps a middle ground between none (not good), to Marco's suggestion (the ultimate), which seems to be a few "versions" of Xplane away at best, if at all.

 

Surely if "FSX" can have seasonal textures, Xplane can as well. Decisions are once again being made with "team / resource / developer", size, as being the limiting factor? This is what has to change to "complete" all aspects of Xplane.

 

I know it's a simple thing to say, and rationalize in my own mind, but it is the limiting factor with all things Xplane. I'm for any improvement, any way it can come. I see and hear both sides of the story, we the end users have visions, that are always "rejected" because of resource limitations.

 

I think most users would at least be happy, if in the interim, with seasonal changes like we see in FSX, maybe I'm wrong, but to me it would be better than nothing, and would give LR a chance to catch up for version 11-12, whatever, or even by then it could be sourced out?

 

I only post this because I see the same thing happening, the same outcome, Marco and Ralf are making some great suggestions. Their getting "squashed / negated" for all the same old reasons. Instead of someone within LR coming here and saying "guys that's a great idea, one we'll surely have implemented by version 11(?), all I see is "this" or "that" can't be done, and the same reasons given, the ones that are always given, human resources.

 

Andras, we all hear and understand your position, and respect it, but it needs to change for Xplane to succeed. Please come up with some way to implement what these gentleman are suggesting, and before version (you choose), there all great suggestions. To continually give reasons why it can't be done, or realized, in the "very" near future, is not "great".

 

Please, let's come up with a solution, now (not a year(s) from now).

 

Glen

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Or they could save some effort if not money and just use speed-tree........... Microsoft Flight used it to very good effect.

 

http://www.speedtree.com/video-game-development.php


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To Glen (and Alan)

 

I think, I told most of what I can tell on this "seasons" topic in the other thread:

http://forum.avsim.n...seasonsweather/

 

And sorry, but I think you didn't understand my position in that thread if you say this:

Their getting "squashed / negated" for all the same old reasons. Instead of someone within LR coming here and saying "guys that's a great idea, one we'll surely have implemented by version 11(?), all I see is "this" or "that" can't be done, and the same reasons given, the ones that are always given, human resources.

I didn't negate in any ways. I did explicitly state, that the "procedural" idea is good (and wasn't entirely new to me) and might be the way to go in the future. But what I tried to describe in a lengthy way is (the same I told here), that there is - to my understanding, of course - no magic bullet (because of the many reasons I listed), and either way it needs quite a bit of manpower for the implementation (namely, artists). AND - at least halfway - well done artwork needs more work than many seem to believe here (even though I rarely do that myself, I heard a lot - internally - about the "challenges" of ground texture etc. creation)

 

Finally, Alan, I am one of those "external resources" ... there are more of us than you might think (but less than many might hope :P ). And before Glen bugs me : NO, I can't change that.

 

And Glen, I am not the one who makes the business decisions! Nor I am from the artist team. With respect to the seasons topic, I can only bring in ideas, when its time to bring in ideas ... but as I am neither coding the rendering engine, nor create - at least in no substantial amount - textures, its unlikely that I will be the one who needs (or can) to implement this feature.


Andras Fabian / Alpilotx

Visit www.alpilotx.net, a site about X-plane scenery

You can see some landscape and other photographs from me here:

http://www.flickr.co...s/weathermaker/

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Thanks Andras,

 

Guess we need someone who "can" invoke / implement change to join in the discussions. These guys are offering viable solutions, ones that "are" present in other simulators, why not Xplane? And, please don't tell me it's a resource / manpower issue, we don't want to hear that any more, from here (today) forward.

 

Think outside the current box (resource limitations), how are the suggestions these gentlemen are making going to get implemented into Xplane, and not years from now. FSX / DCS have it now (seasonal textures), Xplane should as well. Find a way to get it done. (open statement, not directed at you Andras)

 

With respect....

 

Glen

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Glen, I think - I really think - that its not so much the lack of ideas on Laminars side (eve though, new refreshing ideas are always welcome - as long as they already had a "reality check" and are really thought out ... which is sometimes missing around here), but really the resource / manpower issue which hinders it to being implemented now (or why it hasn't already been implemented). Not wanting to hear or accept that simple fact (in respect how it was in the past, and how it is now), even if its "not great" is a little bit like denying reality ... and how that might or might not change in the future is NOT in my hand (and for that reason, I will not discuss it). Depending on how this last aspect evolves, the seasons feature - either in the procedural, the classic FSX, or some entirely different way - will come sooner or later.


Andras Fabian / Alpilotx

Visit www.alpilotx.net, a site about X-plane scenery

You can see some landscape and other photographs from me here:

http://www.flickr.co...s/weathermaker/

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Andras-with all respect-there always seems a good reason why something many have been taking for granted on other sims for years can't be done-usually coming down to lack of manpower, and this really hasn't changed since I have owned xplane way back.

 

Recently it was announced a pr. Person was hired. I hope a huge part of this person's duties are to recruit former third party developers from other sims,Develop new sources, and that the platform is/will be open enough for them to develop. That sorta ends the lack of man power thing. Aerofloy fs already announced they will be following this approach..


Geofa

WANTED DEAD OR ALIVE-the best Flight Sim!

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Andras, fair enough, I'm not asking "you" to change the world.

 

The only one who can change Xplanes world is Austin, and he is the only one who is "denying reality". The reality is, Xplane's development model needs to change to reach it's full potential, we all know that, it's fact.

 

I'm not going to discuss this any more in this post, these guys have great ideas, they deserve to be brought to the table, and implemented.

 

Sorry guys, if I had the financial resources I'd do what I could to have your ideas come to life, they deserve it, but I don't, I only have a voice. Austin has the financial resources (he'd rather spend some of it fighting a lawsuit, ok), and or the ability to open Xplane to outside sources, he chooses not to.

 

Good luck.....

 

Glen

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