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piperarrow41

No Turbulence?

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I am not getting any turbulence with the real weather downloads.  On a warm and windy day like today I would be getting bounced all over the place in a real GA plane.  Is there a setting that I am missing to activate turbulence, or does Opus just not model it accurately?

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Of course it models everything accurately, very accurately indeed (silly comment). All DHM, including the intelligent turbulence effects are associated with Live Camera views. You must enable LC, configure at least one default virtual cockpit view for your aircraft with DHM enabled. Please read the LC manual, you will find a guide there.

 

Stephen

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Hi Stephen,

 

Is there any way to make Opus generated turbulence effect the plane itself? Reason why I ask is that I tried Opus and saw only "head" movement due to turbulence but no effect on plane (ASI, VSI, attitude, etc.). Perhaps I was doing something wrong.

 

Aleks

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The OpusFSX Live Weather Engine downloads all METARs from Met stations all over its 800 x 800 mile weather map along with megabytes of GRIB forecast data for the upper atmospheric conditions. It then maintains nearly one million meteorological parameters to define the weather and all turbulent air masses from the ground upward to FL420 and beyond. The LWE models all forms of turbulence from possible rotor effects, thermal effects, wind shears, and even clear air turbulence determined from calculated gradients in the ambient conditions. The LWE is responsible for determining the location and severity of all turbulence effects and supervises these effects through the Live Camera DHM.

 

The DHM, including all high and low frequency turbulent motions is ALL based entirely on captured real-life, 3D accelerometer data, recorded on board real life aircraft, mostly on board our own light aircraft and a B737-800. This accelerometer data is used as the basis for all head movements and associated phase shifted aircraft motions (bumps). This results in a very realistic, intelligently controlled turbulent motion, in addition to the other taxiing, takeoff, landing, and vibrational motions. All recorded at 20ms resolution.

 

We have recieved a great deal of praise from many RW experienced GA pilots and experienced airline captains. We have also used our own extensive 17 year experience of touring around Europe to develop the most realistic and intelligently controlled turbulent effects available on the sim. The combination of the LWE and LC with its recorded DHM effects provides an ideal partnership to transform the sim experience. Not just our opinion.

 

So in answer to your question, yes we have modelled most forms of turbulence and combined this with recorded RW turbulent motions. Just enable the recommended LWE options, configure your VC cameras with DHM effects, and fly.

 

Stephen

 

Please refer to the LC manual. Yes. You enable the Bump Aircraft option within DHM. There are other options which can also be used. But we recommend setting the Bump Aircraft option.

 

Stephen

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I have enabled the DHM effect on many of the aircraft I fly and it works great.  However, after setting up the view in Opus, I find myself having to fine tune it within FSX using the ctrl/shift/backspace keys and it won't, the camera is locked.  Is there a way to enable the DHM within Opus and still have the ability to adjust the view within FSX using the keys I mentioned.  I'd rather not have to toggle between the two programs each time I want to adjust the pilots seat.

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The FSX turbulence effects are not, in our experienced opinion, very realistic. But if you want them then you must enable the FSX turbulence and thermal motions (it will have little if no impact on the Opus realism or effects) and also tick the Opus Wing Flex option. Then you will have it all.

Stephen

Just configure all the views you need and feel free to use the hat switch for panning. But DHM continuously adjusts the XYZ eye point positions without any adverse effect on the FSX performance. You cannot have two sources of control for the single eye point but you can integrate TrackIR if you want to look around the cockpit.

Stephen

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Ok, I have those checked.  But, is there a way to enable the DHM effect and still be able to fine tune the pilots view point within FSX instead of having the toggle between the two programs and trail and error it? 

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Why the trial and error, just configure or fine tune your VC camera view in the Cameras dialog and save it. You cannot alter the XYZ within FSX as that will be at odds with the DHM updates. Microsoft did not provide any means to read the current eye point position so you cannot adjust the XYZ within FSX. You must configure your required camera views and fine tune them with the arrow keys in the Cameras dialog.

 

If you want to look around then we recommend the standard hat switch panning or the use of TrackIR. I just have a number of views configured to allow me to move my head position for panel views, MCP, Overhead, throttles etc.. In the jest, I find that with the hat switch is more than enough. I occasionally will use TrackIR in the Lancair or SF260 for instance.

 

We do not provide direct interface with the keyboard or mouse because the program is designed to be non-invasive and hence not have any adverse effect on the sims performance.

 

Stephen

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For those of us who do not use the Opus camera effects at all, is there anyway for us to get turbulence in our weather while using Opus?

 

I prefer to use the "other" camera addon for FSX, but I like using Opus for weather only and I really miss having some light-moderate turb affecting my plane during the summer months.

 

For other users like myself who don't use your camera system, it would be nice if you would consider adding turbulence to the weather as an option at least.

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No, it is tied into Live Camera and supervised by the Live Weather Engine to give the utmost realism and intelligent control.

 

We will never do anything else because the effects are all real, using captured 3D accelerometer data which needs Live Camera's DHM for the replay, and they are intelligently controlled for maximum realism which needs the Live Weather Engine which knows the exact meteorological conditions surrounding your aircraft along with all the ambient gradients affecting the turbulent air.

 

Anything else would not be realistic enough for us to bother with.

 

Sorry but the interface is designed to enhance the realism and immersion in the simulator by marrying the LC DHM with the RW weather of the LWE.

 

Stephen

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Stephen, a discussion regarding turbulence effects in Opus is also going on over here -> http://forum.avsim.net/topic/407011-fs-global-real-weather-and-opus/page-4#entry2702557

 

I answered over there and also referred to the Opus documentation that if you have the Bump aircraft option checked the aircraft indeed will be affected by the turbulence rather than just being "eye candy".

 

Just wanted to confirm with you I understood this and what the Opus documentation says on the subject correctly that the aircraft indeed will be "physically" moved in the air by the turbulence rather than it being a camera effect?

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You keep pushing the "realism" aspect...but what I do not understand (because you never discuss it) is how does your turbulence (which I thought was only a camera effect, but I must be wrong here) then actually effect the plane and it's handling?

 

In other words, if I fly hands-off through heavy turbulence in a C172 using the Opus cameras will the plane itself lose the ability to fly itself straight and level...or will it stay/return to normal flight on it's own?

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That's correct (WebMaximus) you set the Bump Aircraft option in the DHM dialog. You can also set the Enable Wing Flex option in the Weather Preferences dialog and combine this with enabling the Turbulence and Thermal Effects within FSX. I don't bother with the last part but always have Bump Aircraft set.

 

So configure DHM for all your camera views you wish to show effects including turbulence. Then set Bump Aircraft option in the DHM to let the turbulence 'bump' the aircraft, just as in the real world. Also if you want the wing flex whilst passing through cloud layers then turn the FSX Turbulence and Thermal Effects on (to get FSX to flex the wings and rattle the instrument needles) and Enable the Wing Flex option in the Weather Preferences dialog to get the LWE to include wing flex turbulence levels in the cloud layers.

 

All of this is described in the documentation. I have no idea why people think when I say realistic I mean pretend after all I've been flying through this sort of muck for over 17 years all over Europe so you would think I know what turbulence is. And anyone reading our Facebook would know we've just battled through 'severe' turbulence on our way back from Venice.

 

Stephen

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In other words, if I fly hands-off through heavy turbulence in a C172 using the Opus cameras will the plane itself lose the ability to fly itself straight and level...or will it stay/return to normal flight on it's own?

 

I'm sorry, you said I was correct...but I was actually asking a question there, lol. Which one is it?

 

BTW - I do have turbulence enabled within FSX at all times...but I still don't get any turbulence when using Opus's weather. Am I doing something wrong there?

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I wasn't talking to you but the above post sent to me who asked if it was the Bump Aircraft option that was needed. Sorry I should have mentioned a name or refered to the actual post.

 

I have edited and added to the above post. I will edit it again to mention the person concerned.

 

Stephen

 

Yes you are. For a start you should read the manual. If you want to enable the FSX effects in addition to Opus then you must do everything I have mentioned above. That is set the Enable Wing Flex option in the Opus Weather Preferences dialog. FSX needs turbulence levels setting in the weather data for its effects.

 

The Opus effects are controlled by the LWE.

 

Stephen

 

Just read the manual it is all described there so there is no real reason to keep asking the same question.

 

Configure Live Camera views, VC views are best. Turn ON Bump Aircraft with all your Enabled DHM effects (the DHM and Bump Aircraft settings are associated with camera views).

 

Enable Wing Flex in the Opus Weather Preferences dialog and enable the FSX turbulence and thermal effects to match this setting.

 

The the Opus LWE will supervise all the Opus effects and FSX will do the other sim stuff.

 

Stephen

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Ok, I'm getting a little confused here, so let me just ask this one more time and I'll take it from there:

 

Do the Opus "turbulence effects" actually effect the handling of the aircraft itself causing it to either lose/gain altitude and/or heading and thereby increasing pilot workload?

 

...or is your effect only a visual one?

 

Sorry for any confusion with back & forth postings :-)

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YES of course they do if you enable the Bump Aircraft option in the DHM dialog !

 

I thought it was all very clear in my previous posts. YES ... but you have to enable the aircraft effects in addition to the pure DHM head movements. The two are coordinated but enabled separately within the Cameras and DHM dialogs.

 

The SAME 3D accelerometer data, both low and high frequency recorded turbulence data, is used to create the pure DHM and BUMP the aircraft.

 

Other FSX controlled effects require data in the injected weather, which again you must enable.

 

Stephen

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Ok Stephen...is there any way to have turbulence impact on my plane without using your cam system though? In other words...can the bumping aircraft be enabled somehow without using the DHM cams?

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Hope that is clear now. The two parts were separated because we developed and included the head movements first ... Wanted to get people using the recorded DHM data. Then in a beta development cycle, we added the Bump Aircraft option to complete the effects and allow people the choice ... Some severe turbulence can upset auto pilots which some users do not want, hence you still have control over both.

 

You need Live Cameras to get the RW DHM effects, true head movements based on the recorded 3D accelerometer data.

 

You need DHM to get Bump Aircraft, it uses the same DHM data and is coordinated, with suitable phase shift, with the head movements.

 

You need to Enable Wing Flex to inject turbulence data with the weather and get some of the additional FSX effects (wing flex, exaggerated needle flutter etc.), so obviously this option will need the FSX turbulence effects enabled. They do not really interfere with the Opus ones.

 

I think that just about covers everything.

 

Stephen

 

Once again ... Please refer to my answer above to the same question.

 

No there isn't.

 

You need the above to use the Opus effects. That is BOTH Live Camera + DHM + Bump Aircraft and the Live Weather Engine to supervise everything and make it intelligently controlled and based on RW meteorological conditions ... for all the same reasons as I explained at the top of this topic.

 

Stephen

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Shucks, Ok...thanks for that detailed info...was just hoping to get turb back without switching away from my ezdok setup is all. So I guess that's not going to happen right now. At least I understand your thought process for how it all ended up working this way...again thanks for taking the time.

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LOL, reminds of Red Dwarf.

 

"Everybodies dead Dave, everybodies dead, everybodies dead Dave"

 

Dave (same name coincidentally) your question has already been answered further up from Stephen in post #10

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All you can do is rely on FSX turbulence or some other camera Addon. Neither of which will be as realistic or as intelligently controlled as LC and the LWE. No Addon could ever know the meteorological conditions well enough to accurately model the turbulence. The LWE maintains nearly one million meteorological parameters to give a very detailed and accurate RW picture of the conditions affecting your flight.

 

If you want RW accurate and intelligently controlled turbulence then you must use both LC and LWE in collaboration. These were the main two reasons why we developed OpusFSX in the first place ... To bring realism to a new level in the sim with RW weather and RW effects.

 

Stephen

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Stephen, I have to say, that while I am a strong supporter of Opus RW I am nevertheless extremely disappointed at having to effectively uninstall Ezdok and reconfigure everything to have a turbulence effect. I actually like Ezdok and want to continue using it, but in doing so Opus RW eliminates any turbulence. I am confused as to why I cannot simply have your weather engine inject the weather and allow Ezdok to run my cameras. I understand that Opus has been designed in a particular way that requires RW and camera views to be somehow linked, but I nevertheless feel it's a mistake. As I said, I am a strong user and supporter of Opus, but nevertheless I'm disappointed with this particular aspect of the software. (constructive criticism ^_^ )

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Thanks for the thorough explanation Stephen, much appreciated and with all this said I guess there's no need for a testflight using a GA aircraft anymore.

 

What I will do though after this explanation is enabling FSX turbulence and wingflex in Opus since I often feel during approaches in bad weather there's not as much of I challenge due to the weather and turbulence as I would imagine there would be IRL flying in similar conditions. Will be very interesting to see if it makes any noticeable differece!

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Please read post 10 above.

 

Live Camera has to be in total control of the views in order to match the DHM head movements with the Bump Aircraft motions. THERE IS NO OTHER WAY.

 

It is not a design choice, it is essential !

 

I'm sorry but you can only have one program in control of the eye point (head movements) and that program must obviously be in control of the camera views. I am not interested in anything other than max realism and for that the replayed 20ms accelerometer data must coordinate both the head movements with the actual aircraft's phase shifted motions. Both are needed to present these RW realistic effects within the sim. Without this there is NO realism and NO RW turbulence effects. The effect would be totally ruined and the recorded 3D accelerometer data wasted. Of course the effects must also be supervised by the LWE which knows the exact meteorological conditions and is therefore able to intelligently control BOTH the head movements and the aircraft motions. The Live Camera interface software is responsible for replaying the various DHM effects data, superimposing the effects, and controlling both the head movements and aircraft motions. This was and still is our aim. To bring maximum realism in both weather and the accompanying turbulence effects, both inside and outside the cockpit. Its the only reason I fly the sim.

 

Stephen

 

Of course, there is always the possibility of giving users more control over the severity of the aircraft motions, the amount or level of the Bump Aircraft motions. I might add a slider control for those who wish to alter the Bump Aircraft scaling.

Stephen :-)

 

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