777 version 1.5 Launch Today

[ohsirus 241]

So reading this thread the T7 should be considered Lite. Too bad of the price or I would buy just to have in the hangar until something a little more complete comes out and to help out the dev. Oh well guess I can just continue to admire the Youtube videos. 

[mikea76 184]

PMDG is not released yet plus it's a 32bit plane waiting for release on a 6yr old sim.,,,,yawnnn 5-10fps complaints after release :lol:   Plus no EFB and other special graphical enhancements like HDR LIGHTING, WEATHER EFFECTS ON PLANE, ETC. ETC.

 

 

EFB in the VC is not very practical to use.  I rather have a plane that simulates systems properly. The R+P 777 does not do that. 

 

 

Problem with the R+P plane is it is rushed.  It appears to me that a lot of " ahhh close enough get it out the door" was done, I will be willing to bet the 757 will be the same way  since nick from the .org is also involved in that. 

 

As I have said in other threads this is not a FSX vs.  X-plane thing..    I just want to set the record straight so people do go buying this plane expecting PMDG accuracy.  

 

BTW I don't know what your talking about with FPS complaints I get 30 FPS locked with the NGX and the majestic q400 on my I5 at 4.5 with a gtx 670

Hi five-by-five. May I have two questions:

1) I read somewhere that X-plane does not support system simulation as well as FSX right? Or developers now found a way to work around this issue (if it is an issue) for making really hard-core system simulation for x-plane...

2) Is this ramzess 777 a "hard-core" addon (I means we need to really read the manual to get it flies properly, as many systems are simulated as possible (and possibity for failure simulation).? I read somewhere that engine performance is somehow now abit odd (right?) but I think it is not a deal breaker yet as I think the developer will fix that sometimes...

 

 

It has many system errors.  It's about on par with captiansim with a better FMC

[deetee 164]

For $10 upgrading was a no-brainer. I've never really used the 777 in earnest since I got it in February, but took the cargo version out for a ride today. All went reasonably well until it was time for the descent and the Vnav just didn't behave like it should. Switching to VS mode the descent rate resembled nothing to what I set on the MCP. Very weird. More experimentation required I think! Also on a manual landing it was extremely nose heavy for some reason.

[JonRD463 146]

PMDG makes excellent products. Just want to state that at the outset, since as usual, the comparisons are going to be made. Their 777 is likely to be a more complete product, and no one really can deny that. But some things should be taken into consideration. First, they've been around for quite awhile and have put together a development pipeline honed by the foundation of their product library. They've turned flight sim add-on aircraft design into an art AND science. Second, they have a fairly robust group of people working on the products, so their internal QA is a bit more beefy with multiple sets of eyes looking at things every step of the way.

 

R&P are just two people doing the principal work on this. Sure, they probably have a few hand-picked testers available to help, but I'm fairly confident that it's nothing like what PMDG have at their disposal. So, in a side-by-side comparison, the R&P 777 is inferior to PMDG's work.

 

Does that mean we toss it out as rubbish? While I haven't had a lot of time to fly lately, I've always enjoyed my time with the Worldliner. Hitches may have been here and there, but overall, I've been pleased. I see room for improvement, and I get a sense from the developers that they WANT to improve. So that's why I support them.

 

I support their continuing to develop aircraft for X-Plane, building on their previous work, learning from past mistakes, and feeding off the enthusiasm of their happy customers to put out higher standards of quality. I support the building of a community of developers for X-Plane, because I know the MS side of the fence didn't just appear out of nowhere, but grew slowly and methodically out of a love for the hobby and as technologies improved. For the X-Plane side, it translates to a maturing of the platform and the growing of the knowledgebase of add-on developers.

 

Ultimately, we each have to decide for ourselves what's worth investing in. If you're happy with MS's platform, you have a plethora of options and I wish you all the joys you will no doubt get from current and future addons. If you want to take the less certain, but potentially exciting route future X-Plane development presents, then I'm happy to join you.

 

In my opinion, that's really what all this is about.

[Murfman 47]

@ JonRD463,

 

Well said! I couldn't have put it better myself. Also, It is a miracle to me that such small teams as make up the X-Plane addon development community can put out such increasingly excellent work over such a short period of development time (i.e., since the advent of XPX).

[mikea76 184]

PMDG makes excellent products. Just want to state that at the outset, since as usual, the comparisons are going to be made. Their 777 is likely to be a more complete product, and no one really can deny that. But some things should be taken into consideration. First, they've been around for quite awhile and have put together a development pipeline honed by the foundation of their product library. They've turned flight sim add-on aircraft design into an art AND science. Second, they have a fairly robust group of people working on the products, so their internal QA is a bit more beefy with multiple sets of eyes looking at things every step of the way.

 

R&P are just two people doing the principal work on this. Sure, they probably have a few hand-picked testers available to help, but I'm fairly confident that it's nothing like what PMDG have at their disposal. So, in a side-by-side comparison, the R&P 777 is inferior to PMDG's work.

 

Does that mean we toss it out as rubbish? While I haven't had a lot of time to fly lately, I've always enjoyed my time with the Worldliner. Hitches may have been here and there, but overall, I've been pleased. I see room for improvement, and I get a sense from the developers that they WANT to improve. So that's why I support them.

 

I support their continuing to develop aircraft for X-Plane, building on their previous work, learning from past mistakes, and feeding off the enthusiasm of their happy customers to put out higher standards of quality. I support the building of a community of developers for X-Plane, because I know the MS side of the fence didn't just appear out of nowhere, but grew slowly and methodically out of a love for the hobby and as technologies improved. For the X-Plane side, it translates to a maturing of the platform and the growing of the knowledgebase of add-on developers.

 

Ultimately, we each have to decide for ourselves what's worth investing in. If you're happy with MS's platform, you have a plethora of options and I wish you all the joys you will no doubt get from current and future addons. If you want to take the less certain, but potentially exciting route future X-Plane development presents, then I'm happy to join you.

 

In my opinion, that's really what all this is about.

 

I won't speak for others who are critical of the R+P 777 but my reasons have nothing to do with MS or XP,  I like XP quite a bit and I am convinced it is the future and I hope more addon devlopers move to this platform soon so we can enjoy their talents being put to use on a more modern evolving platform..  My issue is that for a premium price point I expected a premium product and I felt that compared to offerings like the NGX this plane is seriously lacking in system accuracy, plus the fact that there is no paint kit and you have to buy liveries kind of peter tishma like if you ask me.  

 

If you don't care about the systems being accurate then it is a decent plane, it does have some good points but the reason I post in these threads is so fellow " hardcore" simmers don't buy this plane expecting to be able to follow the Fcom and have the plane behave like it should.

[sp85 6]

I read somewhere in here that PMDG may be in talk with LR to enhance the XPX engine so that PMDG can develop planes for X-plane. If this ever happens then XPX is a no-brainer for me. The 64 bit is really a huge plus for me...For now I need to stay on the line as I bought X-plane 9 but to be honest not so many hardcore aircraft addons have been released for X-plane 9 as FSX I think...

[Longranger 148]

I read somewhere in here that PMDG may be in talk with LR to enhance the XPX engine so that PMDG can develop planes for X-plane.

Not quite. They are discussing with Laminar possible changes that would help them to adapt their systems to X-Plane. It is not a question if they adapt, they are simply requesting additional features or enhancements like every developer can do as well. They are far from the stage if they wan't to convert one plane, they start to talk about converting all their planes.

http://forum.avsim.net/topic/412418-looks-really-great-but-i-cant-buy-it/#entry2702979

 

If you look at iot precisely they are simply talking about working together with Laminar, which isn't unusual since PMDG has their own in-house development system and sometimes small enhancements in the input processing could simply make the conversion much easier and cheaper. Otherwise they say that they wan't to make jump for FSX users easier: To spell it differently: They hope to give their planes more or less the same user interface that they have in FSX.

[MdMax 233]

So far very stable, all systems function as they are supposed to (LNAV, VNAV, EEC, ...) and it also looks like the assumed temp T/O reduced N1 correctly!

 

+1

 

LNAV having serious problems trying to capture desired track. I couldn't believe what i saw when a simple direct put the plane flying orbits trying to capture route from PPOS to the desired point and never did it. Had to fly HDG mode...

 

Can you describe what you did, and what AIRAC files you are using ? I did not notice a problem for now with a simple direct.

 

I support their continuing to develop aircraft for X-Plane, building on their previous work, learning from past mistakes, and feeding off the enthusiasm of their happy customers to put out higher standards of quality.

 

+1

 

To spell it differently: They hope to give their planes more or less the same user interface that they have in FSX.

FSX user interface ? Will X-Plane users need to learn how to overclock their hardware and edit the fsx.cfg file ? :wink:

[mikea76 184]

Downloaded, first test flight going on right now. The 300ER addition is nice. Sounds are MUCH better than before, however still not quite there yet.

I do not see any visual improvements in VC but the light are improved nicely.

So far very stable, all systems function as they are supposed to (LNAV, VNAV, EEC, ...) and it also looks like the assumed temp T/O reduced N1 correctly!

 

Seems to me like good update for $10.

Last night I download and did a few tests on version 1.5

 

First thing I noticed is the sounds are still WAY overdone, everything sounds like you are right next to it outside the plane For me thats a immersion killer right there. Also I wish there is a option to turn off that ambient airport noise that is also unrealistic.

 

As far as systems go I did not see anything really different, I tried a assumed temp thrust reduction and it went from about 103 N1 to 97 N1 at 60c assumed temp. You should see about a 25 percent thrust reduction at that assumed temp.  I also noticed that I  could not cancel the reduction by hitting the toga button twice like you should be able to

 

I also noticed you can't enter custom waypoints like place bearing distance waypoints. I use these alot in the NGX when on vatsim when I get a crossing restriction like the one I would get a lot from new york center when flying pvd-bwi where they would give me the restriction 25 miles after mxe. On the NGX I could simply create a alongtrack waypoint mxe/+25 and it would make a custom waypoint that the vnav could track.

 

With the R+P 777 and most other addons you would have to go tot he fix page set mxe as a fix and put a 25 mile radius around it then drop down in automation to V/S mode and use the banana to meet your restriction.

[pryoski 84]

Starting from lots of holes in the 3d model (both exterior and interior), some of which have been reported on initial release and still not fixed.

 

LNAV having serious problems trying to capture desired track. I couldn't believe what i saw when a simple direct put the plane flying orbits trying to capture route from PPOS to the desired point and never did it. Had to fly HDG mode...

 

Not to mention "details" like wrong ETO calculation by FMS.

If you believe there are issues with the aircraft that haven't been addressed then you probably should raise them on the ORG forums.

However they should be tabled in a calm and friendly way .. will probably have a better chance of being answered and I don't believe they ban without some provocation.

 

There's also a number of T7 stalwarts on the Org's T7 sub-forum who would be happy to go over your FMC issues Cessna729 and Rob Macdonald come to mind.

 

 

P.S.

Mikea76 .. you can save your volume preferences in the T7 popup menu ... I'm surprised oyu haven't noticed that as it's been there since the previous update.

[mikea76 184]

If you believe there are issues with the aircraft that haven't been addressed then you probably should raise them on the ORG forums.

However they should be tabled in a calm and friendly way .. will probably have a better chance of being answered and I don't believe they ban without some provocation.

 

There's also a number of T7 stalwarts on the Org's T7 sub-forum who would be happy to go over your FMC issues Cessna729 and Rob Macdonald come to mind.

 

 

P.S.

Mikea76 .. you can save your volume preferences in the T7 popup menu ... I'm surprised oyu haven't noticed that as it's been there since the previous update.

 

 

Cool I will check that out.  Will that allow me to get rid of the ambient airport noises?   I probably missed it since I don't really fly this plane much, I check it out after each update to see what has changed.  I may post over at the .org about custom waypoints to see if Phillip has any plans to add this.  That and I need to go look at tables but I noticed that no matter what flap setting the FMC gives 140 for the landing v-speed.  

[pryoski 84]

Not 100% sure (I'll have to wait to check) but I think it does give you a few options. Just remember to save it otherwise you'll be adjusting those bits again.

Regarding the landing v-speed you may have to experiment with weights, however I'm not really qualified to provide any depth here. Cheers!

[mikea76 184]

Not 100% sure (I'll have to wait to check) but I think it does give you a few options. Just remember to save it otherwise you'll be adjusting those bits again.

Regarding the landing v-speed you may have to experiment with weights, however I'm not really qualified to provide any depth here. Cheers!

 

I did another short test flight last night. I was able to get rid of that ambient airport crowd noise in the menu but I also lost the flap sound. I am ok with that because the flap sound is way overdone and not what you should hear in the cockpit anyway.

 

Another weird FMC thing I noticed is that it wont display a ILS approach unless you enter a transition. This is not like the real FMC many times the published transition is not used and your vectored to the ILS, having to enter the transition just makes a mess on the ND.

 

My  opinion of this add-on  

 

This would not be a bad mid level product if it was marketed like the AXE and sold for about 39 bucks, 49 with the 200F but for the PMDG price I paid I expect a lot more,  I expect the taxi light to turn with the nosewheel,  I expect to be able to use assumed temp properly, I expect to be able to override that derate in the same way the real plane would,  I expect realistic sounds and I expect to be able to enter along track waypoints and other custom waypoints and also be able to enter a approach without a transition.

 

Sure the 777 does have custom failures,  but the few failures I have experienced with it could not be solved with the QRH because of inaccuracies. So you have to fly with them off.

 

On the bright side....  

 

I can't wait for a few key add-on's for xp.  It runs so good even with full autogen on my system ( 2500k 4.5 gtx 670 4gb)  FSX could never be that smooth.

[pryoski 84]

Hi Mike, I'm more of a regional flyer myself, so while I really do like the T7, I don't spend much time in it and am definitely not an authority on the plane. If you've got any questions regarding the T7 in XP, my advice is that you air your questions in the dedicated T7 forum  ... Cheers! .