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PeterDa

Winds aloft predictions for lat/long waypoints

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No response over on the HiFi forum, therefore trying here: I generate flightplans in Aivlasoft EFB, and export them to Active Sky Next and to a PMDG 777 route. This works fine, however: the WX file that ASN injects into the ...\fsx\PMDG\WX folder shows lat/long waypoints as WPT01 etc, while the 777 FMC shows them in the lat/long format. This means that they are not recognised when importing winds aloft predictions (a significant issue on long transoceanic flights). Any suggestions welcome.

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Any suggestions welcome.

 

My bet is that the waypoints are being translated by ASN somehow.  I'm not sure about that, but that would be my guess since they're showing up fine on the LEGS/RTE pages.  If it's ASN, then that's something to talk to HiFi about.  I use exports via PFPX, and have yet to run into similar issues.

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Kyle, do you export via PFPX, then load into ASN, or do you not bother loading into ASN. The reason I ask is that doesn't ASN automatically save the weather plan into the PMDG folder when you load it. If that is the case then does ASN not over write the file. If that is the case the 777 will load the weather plan from ASN either way.

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My bet is that the waypoints are being translated by ASN somehow.  I'm not sure about that, but that would be my guess since they're showing up fine on the LEGS/RTE pages.  If it's ASN, then that's something to talk to HiFi about.  I use exports via PFPX, and have yet to run into similar issues.

Hello Kyle,

Thank you; I was a bit too hasty with HiFi; now responded in in discussion over there.

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The reason I ask is that doesn't ASN automatically save the weather plan into the PMDG folder when you load it. If that is the case then does ASN not over write the file.

 

When the flight plan/route is loaded into ASN it overwrites the PFPX file in the PMDG Weather folder. You need to export the PFPX files again. After the export the PMDG weather folder will contain PFPX winds aloft and not ASN winds aloft. The way to avoid this is to not start ASN until you have imported the wind data into the FMC in the 777. The problem with not starting ASN first is that several times I have found METAR data in PFPX wrong when compared to ASN or AWC-ADDS. PFPX had the correct METAR time but previous day. Starting ASN first corrected the METAR in PFPX.

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ASN or any weather program should be loaded before PFPX because PFPX loads the weather when it loads. If you do not then PFPX will read the last weather file that will be the last time you flew. You need the latest weather to plan the flight which they would do in real life, you can then export the 777 weather file with PFPX along with the route.

 

Then you have to load the route you have just created in ASN, which will then overwrite the PFPX created weather file automatically, I have tested this. So the weather you load into the 777 will be the ASN created file.

 

What Kyle said was that he loads the PFPX weather plan in the 777 FMC. So my question was whether he bothers loading the flight plan in ASN, whether he has found a way to stop ASN saving the planned weather file or whether he actually knew the ASN automatically saves the weather.

 

Just for information, the reason that PFPX is able to save the weather is so that people who do not own ASN, maybe uses another weather engine or the PFPX real world option, can use the PMDG 777 feature. You do not have to use this option if you ASN as it saves the file for you. Now if there is a discrepancy between PFPX and ASN, I would rather go with ASN as this is the program that injects the weather into FSX.

 

Michael, if you are loading PFPX, planning your route, loading ASN, importing your route, then resaving your route and not re-planning your route, then your route is being planned with the wrong weather and your fuel calculations will be wrong. You have to have the correct weather to start.

 

Also note that the planned weather is just a prediction based on the information at that time. Weather can change over a few hour flight. It's just like watching the weather man on TV, seeing good weather, planning a day out and then it raining all day.

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So my question was whether he bothers loading the flight plan in ASN

 

 

If you don't load the flight plan into ASN there won't be any ATIS information on 122.025 since ASN doesn't know where the A/C is going. I use the ATIS on 122.025 to see what the variation is from the RW ATIS at AWC-ADDS so I can take it into account when trying to determine what is the correct runway to use. Two example would be KJFK which adds 13 degrees to the wind direction and KLAX which subtracts 12 degrees from the wind direction

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I don't use Active Sky ATIS, never done on in ASN or AS2012. The thought of one ATIS channel does all put's me off a bit, when I can tune into ATIS on the airport channel. Add that I can look at the latest ATIS on EFB for the departure airport or arrival airport, or if I want to, I can always pull the weather up on ASN itself by typing in the airport.

 

ASN has extra things for people who do not have the extra's like PFPX. It can even plan your flight if you want but if you have another flight planner then you probably would not use it, If you have FS Build or something that does not export PMDG 777 weather files then you would have to load the plan to get the file to load into the FMC. As you have the option to export the weather from PFPX, then you don't need to load the plan into ASN, it will load the weather relative to the location of your aircraft. If I fly VFR, I don't have a flight plan, can still contact ATIS and still get weather and go wherever I want. 

 

So my question still stands.

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 As you have the option to export the weather from PFPX, then you don't need to load the plan into ASN, it will load the weather relative to the location of your aircraft. If I fly VFR, I don't have a flight plan, can still contact ATIS and still get weather and go wherever I want. 

 

 

A couple of weeks ago I asked HiFi about the advantage of loading a flight plan in ASN and here is their answer:

 

There is a spcicific advantage in wx depiction when using a flight plan and it's related to the destination airport weather. The way fsx weather is created is based on areas of about 10x10nm (what we call "cells"). Now depending on the specific destination airport there may be 2 weather stations inside a single cell. Say now that in your destination (e.g. KLAX) you have overcast conditions and in a close weather station the metar reports scattered clouds. ASN has to know that your actual destination is KLAX, otherwise it will interpolate between these 2 stations and the end result in depiction will most possibly be broken clouds. Not exactly what you expected. 

This will become apparent if you attempt to use fsx manual weather and attempt to set the weather only to KLAX (without using ASN or any engine). So, in (not so) rare cases, you may not get accurate results in your destination airport unless ASN actually knows which one it is. It all depends on the density of airports/wx stations close to your destination. So, best strategy is to almost always load a fp to ASN (or load it to FSX and check the autoload feature of ASN). 

 

If you want obviously to fly low and VFR without a specific destination in mind, then this becomes much less of an issue. But, in general it's almost always recommended to use a fp.

 

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ASN supports waypoints in this format

 

N55W050

 

That's why I build the plan created from PFPX into FSBuild then import that into ASN. FSBuild accepts N55W050 (example)

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A couple of weeks ago I asked HiFi about the advantage of loading a flight plan in ASN and here is their answer:

 

 

Can you provide a link to that quote from HiFi. I would be interested in reading the whole thread. The quote is very informative and useful.

 

Thank you

Michael Cubine

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Kyle, do you export via PFPX, then load into ASN, or do you not bother loading into ASN. The reason I ask is that doesn't ASN automatically save the weather plan into the PMDG folder when you load it. If that is the case then does ASN not over write the file. If that is the case the 777 will load the weather plan from ASN either way.

 

I leave ASN completely out of the loop.  I load the program, and then manage everything with PFPX.  I look at them as comparisons of real world entities:

 

ASN: Mother Nature.  I don't tell it where I'm going or what I'm doing (and if you could in the real world, it wouldn't care anyway).

PFPX: Flight planning suites that read what Mother Nature is doing and attempt to make sense of it.  That's what data goes into the FMC in the end anyway (real world).

 

I feel like people make this way harder than it needs to be.

 

 

 

Can you provide a link to that quote from HiFi. I would be interested in reading the whole thread. The quote is very informative and useful.

 

It's in their manual, actually (or at least it was with ASE and AS2012).

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Thank you Kyle, this is what I do and it all seems to run OK. I used it when I used FSBuild as that did not export the weather file, but now I have PFPX and that gives me the file then why not use that, after all that is my dispatcher and it would be them that gives me my weather report.

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after all that is my dispatcher and it would be them that gives me my weather report.

 

Bingo.

 

Too many simmers think that aviation has everything down to a science, where all programs talk to each other, weights are perfect, and weather is 100% on with the paperwork.  Introducing variance in your sim environment only increases the realism in many cases.  This is one of them.

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