What a nice announcement of the Captainsim 707 box version :>> The level of detail is massive and authentic features aboundIf I remember correctly, the level of bugs is also still massive and should one talk about authenticity, if e.g. a complete overhead panel was just copied over from their 727 (nothing but one engine start switch added and some stuff hidden with covers) ?Hasn't Captainsim closed their forum after massive complains about the 707, instead of dealing with it with a second patch ?Or has anybody noticed a second patch ?Mike

Hi Mike,Some people like to live in thier own reality that everything is just fine and dandy ;)

Yeah, seems so ;)I remember, even the beta testers had been shocked about the early release and a quickie patch only repaired it a little.Most annoying product I ever bought.Mike

Hello All,Yep, looks like the second release from CS to Just Flight -- we at least hope that they have fixed the flight model on the 707 -- that might at least be the making for an interesting review.Best to all,Clayhttp://www.dreamfleet2000.com/gfx/images/F...ers/Dopke01.jpgClayton T. Dopke (Clay)Major, USAF (retired)"Drac"

Hi,Just Flight, in my opinion until now, have a good reputation in the addon business.However, with this new "approach" in distributing the Legendary B707, really put their reputation in the lower storage can. :-rollIt also surprises me that Just Flight doesn

Well, I'm not risking any more money finding out. If it IS good and it IS fixed, others will get the benefit. But I just won't risk it. Even with Just flights reputation I think this one waddles, flaps its wings and gobbles.I'm not buying another CS product until CS change, no matter who wants to sell it me.Allcott

>Well, I'm not risking any more money finding out. If it IS>good and it IS fixed, others will get the benefit. But I just>won't risk it. Even with Just flights reputation I think this>one waddles, flaps its wings and gobbles.>>I'm not buying another CS product until CS change, no matter>who wants to sell it me.>>>AllcottWell, Allcott, I have to agree with you on one thing, they need to do the fix's, and if the one for Just Flight IS fixed, then they need to offer it to all their old customers as an update!Best,Clayhttp://www.dreamfleet2000.com/gfx/images/F...ers/Dopke01.jpgClayton T. Dopke (Clay)Major, USAF (retired)"Drac"

It would surprise me very much if the bugs are fixed. That makes me feel very very sorry for the new potential customers. :-(And it feels more and more like we, the previous customers, are "laughed at big time" behind our backs. :-rollFly safe, Staffan AhlbergSweden/Stockholm/ESSAhttp://www.scandicair.com/images/dc9_banner.jpg"I will come and cut your lawn for a high quality DC8-63 system"[/color]My specs are:Dell Dimension 4600 P4/3.0 Ghz1024 Mb DDR333 Dual channel memory (2x256,1x512)128 Mb ATI Radeon 9800 ProOmega 2.5.58DirectX 9.0cW XP Home with SP1E171FPb Flat panel monitor 17"240Gb (2x120) 7200rpm HD

Hi Staffan,>> It would surprise me very much if the bugs are fixedMe too. Why would the fix something for the box version and hold it back for their download customers ? Very unlikely.Mike

Of course it's unlikely, I can't imagine that CS will earn more from a boxed product than a download, so if they had fixed it, they would have announced it all over the place as I'm sure a fixed (if that's what's needed) 707 would sell.Personally, I don't feel too sorry for people who bought it as a download as those people have had every oportunity to look at the many forums that have had this subject openly discussed at length. I do however, feel very sorry for those that may be about to buy a product with alleged flaws/errors/bugs/inaccuracies from a reputable company (Just Flight) either directly or from the shops. Many of these buyers will not have seen or been able to see the many forum posts and are simply going buy on the strength of the fact it says Just Flight on the box.And before anyone gets ###### at me, I don't have the 707 and I haven't said there's anything wrong with it........the comments above are based on common sense and posts I've read on these forums.

Hi Paul,>> I don't feel too sorry for people who bought it as a download as those people have had every oportunity to look at the many forums that have had this subject openly discussed at lengthA paradoxon in itself. To have it discussed in Fora, at least one must buy the download version first :)And how shall download custumers know before, that Captainsim does not support their product as others do. With their 727 they at least did that to some extend.Mike

Good point Mike, so upon reflection, I feel a bit sorry for those that rushed out and bought it before waiting for others to it (back to the paradoxon!), I feel less sorry for those that still bought it after the first week or so and I still feel very sorry for those that will end up buying it in a box.Again, I'm not saying against the product or claiming it has any faults etc. etc.Isn't political correctness a pain in the a*s :-)EDIT: All the aforesaid is assuming the boxed version is the same.

I dunno know Mike. I've never purchased anything from CS. But I've seen lots of discussion about the support issue(s) both here and elsewhere. And, from those discussions, I know that there is no support from CS. So, I think Paul's right - the download folks have had the opportunity to become aware of the situation prior to purchase. Or, did I miss something?Doug

> I dunno know Mike. I've never purchased anything from CS.>But I've seen lots of discussion about the support issue(s)>both here and elsewhere. And, from those discussions, I know>that there is no support from CS. So, I think Paul's right ->the download folks have had the opportunity to become aware of>the situation prior to purchase. Or, did I miss something?>Doug, Nope, you didn't miss anything. Given CS's absolutely top-notch, first-class, top-brick-off-the-chimney, public relations activity you can be absolutely certain that if they had patched it, we'd have heard about it. It would have been splashed all over the front pages of all the websites that accept CS money to advertise sub-standard unsupported packages.Now, what about an official statement from CS PR Support? Where are you now? Helping the customer support department set up the forum I hope?Yeah, right.Allcott

Doug,their 727 was Ok when I bought it 2.5 years ago and it was more or less supported. How shall I have known Captainsim doesn't follow the usual "at-least-two-patches-payware-standard" (*) anymore ? And give it up after a half patch.That almost leads to a discussion, that download buyers are stupid enough to buy a product right after release. In the meantime I tend to agree with that.And feel sorry for both CS 707 download and box version customers.We say in German : "Einige Publisher und Entwickler saegen heftig an dem Ast auf dem sie sitzen". Don't know how to translate that, maybe like that :Some Publishers and Payware developers these days heavily saw on the branch they are sitting on :)Mike(*) some, but rare exceptions from this rule shall exist :D