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Sesquashtoo

Setting a key on the keyboard for barometric pressure...

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Has anybody set a key on the keyboard, to set B.P. as we can by pressing the 'B' key for both FSX and P3D?

 

That certainly would speed things up in flight....

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I don't know of any "switch" that sets baro pressure other than a couple of plug-ins that will set 29.92 for above FL180, but they are unique to the aircraft and not X-Plane.

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Has anybody set a key on the keyboard, to set B.P. as we can by pressing the 'B' key for both FSX and P3D?

How does that even work?  Does the setting go up or down when you press the "B" Key?

 

X-Plane has command(s) that you can assign to any key(s) or button(s) for setting the baro.  There is one for increasing the baro and another for decreasing the baro.  See the X-Plane manual for how to assign keys and buttons.

 

The associated commands are:

 

sim/instruments/barometer_down 

sim/instruments/barometer_up 
sim/instruments/barometer_copilot_down 
sim/instruments/barometer_copilot_up 
 
You can also "sync" the baro to standard by assigning a button/key to:
 
sim/instruments/barometer_2992

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How does that even work?  Does the setting go up or down when you press the "B" Key?

 

X-Plane has command(s) that you can assign to any key(s) or button(s) for setting the baro.  There is one for increasing the baro and another for decreasing the baro.  See the X-Plane manual for how to assign keys and buttons.

 

The associated commands are:

 

sim/instruments/barometer_down 

sim/instruments/barometer_up 
sim/instruments/barometer_copilot_down 
sim/instruments/barometer_copilot_up 
 
You can also "sync" the baro to standard by assigning a button/key to:
 
sim/instruments/barometer_2992

 

True, but that only adjusts the roll numbers to what you need, after hearing A.T.C's proclamation.  I was hoping that in flight, you could just 'cheat' and press one button to bring in the current real-time B.P.  That is one feature of FSX and P3D that I really appreciate, especially when you are busy in the cockpit, dealing with A.T.C. descending through transition altitude, and have no co-pilot to do the grunt work.... :)  This would be a nice feature for any XPX update...or beyond.  Assign B.P. update to current, with the press of let's say 'B' and assign the brakes to another....  Hey Laminar...Ben...how 'bout it?

 

Ses

I don't know of any "switch" that sets baro pressure other than a couple of plug-ins that will set 29.92 for above FL180, but they are unique to the aircraft and not X-Plane.

You are most correct, there is no setting that will bring in the current B.P. from any weather 'grab'. Not like the 'B' key in Microsoft-based.  

 

Man..as I stated, would the be a great convenience feature for a busy cockpit, in-flight.

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True, but that only adjusts the roll numbers to what you need.  I was hoping that in flight, you could just 'cheat' and press one button to bring in the current B.P.

It would have been easier if you had said that to begin with ! :

 

This would be a nice feature for any XPX update...or beyond.  Assign B.P. update to current, with the press of let's say 'B' and assign the brakes to another....  Hey Laminar...Ben...how 'bout it?

I'm pretty sure they will not be changing the current assignment for the "B" Key.

 

Why don't you submit a feature request to Laminar?

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It would have been easier if you had said that to begin with ! :

 

I believe that I did...pressing the 'B' key inside both FSX and P3D will set your B.P. to the live current, without you having to manually scroll it in. :)

 

I'm pretty sure they will not be changing the current assignment for the "B" Key.

 

Why don't you submit a feature request to Laminar?

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I believe that I did...pressing the 'B' key inside both FSX and P3D will set your B.P. to the live current, without you having to manually scroll it in. :)
No, you actually didn't.

 

Your originally stated:

 

 


Has anybody set a key on the keyboard, to set B.P. as we can by pressing the 'B' key for both FSX and P3D?
All you said was that you wanted to set BP, there was nothing in there about wanting the baro set to "current".  And, considering this is an X-Plane forum, not everyone would know (including me) what the "B" key in FSX/P3D does.  That's why I initially asked... "How does that even work?  Does the setting go up or down when you press the "B" Key?".  I think most people would typically think of setting the baro as "adjusting" the values, not necessarily setting it to "current".  So, although you cleared this up in a later post, I stand by my statement that ... "It would have been easier if you had said that to begin with ! :"

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... often wished for the same Ses, very handy to set the current barometric pressure with a single keystroke as in FSX.

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... often wished for the same Ses, very handy to set the current barometric pressure with a single keystroke as in FSX.

Yes sir...that is the one feature/ assigned keystroke I really miss with using XP.  It is a great, and super convenient one. All they would have to do...is use Shift-. for brake application,and make 'b' for the live, current baro. Most of us then would have BARO continuity across our XP and M.S. platforms. There are certainly plenty of us, that have both platforms in one config or another.

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I am going to play the devils advocate here and say that - even though I used the function when "playing" MSFS - am opposed to having that.

 

I think part of flying a simulator is actually simulating what it really is to fly an airplane, as far as possible. This includes the "hardship" that pilots have to go through, like setting the altimeter upon passing the transition level on descent.

 

In the real world, a lot of effort is spent on getting this process right. The consequnces of setting the wrong value is potentially fatal, and the procedures associated with obtaining the value, verifying it, setting it, then comparing it then verifying it AGAIN (on a non-precision approach with the tower frequency) is probably more involved than what most simulator pilots think.

 

So for me this "B" key falls into the category of "flying with crutches". It´s a shortcut around "what real pilots do". I guess we all use the sim differently, and having the option to use these aids couldn´t really hurt - I wouldn´t have to use them, right?

 

Now if Laminar adds it, I could assure you that it wouldn´t replace the brakes-B key by default- they would make it a new command that any user could set up with key/joystick button any way you like it. The brakes aren´t "hardwired" to V and B, either, it´s all completely customizable.

 

Jan

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I think part of flying a simulator is actually simulating what it really is to fly an airplane, as far as possible. This includes the "hardship" that pilots have to go through, like setting the altimeter upon passing the transition level on descent.

 

Well, while I agree I also disagree. Everyone can play the game their own way and simulate the aircraft's system to the degree they are comfortable. 

 

That being said, I don't think such feature would be used by many, ergo I really don't think it should replace the defualt brake assignment (b for brakes is much more logical).

But as others said, an email to the Laminar requesting such feature wouldn't hurt. 

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Well, while I agree I also disagree. Everyone can play the game their own way and simulate the aircraft's system to the degree they are comfortable. 

 

That being said, I don't think such feature would be used by many, ergo I really don't think it should replace the defualt brake assignment (b for brakes is much more logical).

But as others said, an email to the Laminar requesting such feature wouldn't hurt. 

 

This is an interesting discussion about game design!

 

We have heard that argument often: It´s good to let the player decide how "hard" the game is - so no one gets frustrated. But here is also a downside to this. The harder a game is, the higher the feeling of achievement when you master it.

 

Let me give you an example: Imagine you take up archery. But it´s too hard to hit the target at 50 yards, so you just move it to 5 yards. You hit all your shots, you are a great archer.

 

Now some people are like that, they like to "pretend" they are good and have mastered archery (or flying an airplane). These people seek instant gratification.

 

Some people aren´t like that, they want to really master and learn something, they have a high frustration tolerance.

 

And then there are those in the middle (like me) - They are too tempted by the possibility of moving the target closer to resist They "autosave" all the time if they can and they use the B key to set the altimeter, whishing they couldn´t!

 

In other words: It´s not easy to restrain yourself from using an "easy mode" if there is one, but it takes away the feeling of achievement, almost like a bad conscience (except for those who really don´t have a problem with that emotion :wink: ).

 

So I think sometimes it´s for the better to "force" people to do it the right and hard way, they will be happy and thankful for it later on.

 

Otherwise you wouldn´t be using X-Plane, but MS Flight or some other arcade flying game.

 

I think it´s odd to say "I am a flight simulator pilot, but I don´t like to simulate flight! Why don´t we have a "fly me around" button? I think it´s too tedious to manipulate the controls!"

And yes, I know there are people that like to sit in the passenger seat and look out the window at the wing (while "flying" a flight-simulator!?!), and to each his own. But please Laminar, don´t take a second of your time implementing a feature that caters to softcore features, while so many hardcore features are still missing.

 

Jan

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Hello Jan!

 

Some good points obviously, and I agree on the general notion that the addons or the base simulator itself should be as relistic as possible.

 

What I advocate though, is that not "correct" or "better" way of playing. If someone is content doing things certain way, why would we ostracize? Giving someone an option isn't bad either. If you seek instant gloryfication, and you are catered, so what? 

 

Also, there are limitations to what we can do. Real cockpits are designed to be ergonomic and easy to operate, while majority of us have normal sized screen, joystick and keyboards. 

When operating A330, during approach phase I must admit it's sometimes hard to keep up with the demands. I choose to do it anyway, because that's the way that gives me the most enjoyment and, as you mentioned, the feeling of achievement. But if someone would like to take some shortcuts to compensate, I don't think it's a bad thing. It's just the way they want to play the game, and if Laminar wanted to implement those shortcuts, I wouldn't mind, even though I wouldn't use them myself. 

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Hello Jan!

 

Some good points obviously, and I agree on the general notion that the addons or the base simulator itself should be as relistic as possible.

 

What I advocate though, is that not "correct" or "better" way of playing. If someone is content doing things certain way, why would we ostracize? Giving someone an option isn't bad either. If you seek instant gloryfication, and you are catered, so what? 

 

Also, there are limitations to what we can do. Real cockpits are designed to be ergonomic and easy to operate, while majority of us have normal sized screen, joystick and keyboards. 

When operating A330, during approach phase I must admit it's sometimes hard to keep up with the demands. I choose to do it anyway, because that's the way that gives me the most enjoyment and, as you mentioned, the feeling of achievement. But if someone would like to take some shortcuts to compensate, I don't think it's a bad thing. It's just the way they want to play the game, and if Laminar wanted to implement those shortcuts, I wouldn't mind, even though I wouldn't use them myself. 

Lena...I'll just state that there are a lot more people that love to use the 'B' key auto-dial-in of live/current B.P. than will actually admit to within the forums that this feature is enabled.

 

I have no problem with it...and I do not consider it a 'soft' setting.  There are also two pilots in a commercial cockpit whereby one will change up all the autopilot and baro settings, as needed, and either the captain or the first concentrates on flight control input.  I use the M.S.  B key baro update as my first officer, so have no qualms whatsoever, to use it...and do not consider as some here on this thread have stated...is a side-step of true cockpit, real-world procedure.

 

As you say, each to their own..and would love to have this as a choice...by Laminar.  For those that wish to spin the knob...they can. For those that wish to press an auto-update, the same way that there is already a direct-to 29.92 (for transitions)....in most modern cockpits...all the better.

 

 In fact...I see an auto-update to current B.P. tech happening anyway, via Baro sensor, sooner than later....

 

Let's see Laminar work this into the mix...and let the user decide in what manner, Baro is updated.... :)

 

Cheers,

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Hi Lena,

 

I guess my general fear is that X-Plane is moving from the hardcore FLIGHT simulation platform that I grew to love to a more "general user" game, the temptation of the easy money and the huge userbase that FSX enjoys.

 

I have seen the same effect in the development of our 737 (which I know you are aware of ;-)). I am steering the team to make this as realistic as possible. But realistic is hard, sometimes! So I have to fight the urge within our team to cater to the "noob user" by adding (unrealistc) aids, that makes it easier to operate the aircraft, so that every joe bloe can feel like an expert 737 Captain... Things like "helping messages" when you enter wrong stuff in the FMS, pop up screens, autoinserting values, etc. Yes, I see the point about ergonomics and the missing Copilot, but the "dummy mode" has to be carefully evaluated.

 

Because thats what the majority of the flightsim user base is - layman that want to feel like pilots, but don´t want to put in the effort. This in turn creates pressure on the developers to make games for this group, they are the majority and they pay the most money! So this leaves the "hardcore" simulation pilots in a defensive posture, and soon game developers have you flying through the sky over Hawaii chasing floating coins, because most users think that might be cool...

 

If you want to know what I am talking about, look at the official X-Plane "Questions and answers" page: questions.x-plane.com

 

Most of these questions are leaving me with my mouth agape. How do these people even start their computer to post these questions, it seems that some would have a hard time to even operate a power switch...Now imagine someone like that trying to fly a 737 and then posting his "wishlist" of features. Autoinstall, Autostartup, Autotaxiout. Autotakeoff,...

 

This is why I stopped trying to "convert" FSX user to X-Plane. Only few of them have the "right stuff" to enjoy X-Plane for what it is, the majority just want to fly around and don´t care a bit how to really operate an aircraft, they look for the "B" key, wonder why "S" doesn´t change the views,they can´t watch AI airplanes land and take-off on real airline schedules for hours (while they should be doing homework), the joystick doesn´t work "right away", whats up with the seasons and why is the Statue of Liberty missing? :P Please stay with FSX/Prepared, the scenery is so much better and then there is OrbX!  :smile:

 

Jan

 

PS: In an Airbus you can "preset" your altimeter during cruise-flight, then only push in the altitude setting knob when passing the TL. Maybe also in more modern Boeings, not sure.

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Hi Lena,

 

I guess my general fear is that X-Plane is moving from the hardcore FLIGHT simulation platform that I grew to love to a more "general user" game, the temptation of the easy money and the huge userbase that FSX enjoys.

 

I have seen the same effect in the development of our 737 (which I know you are aware of ;-)). I am steering the team to make this as realistic as possible. But realistic is hard, sometimes! So I have to fight the urge within our team to cater to the "noob user" by adding (unrealistc) aids, that makes it easier to operate the aircraft, so that every joe bloe can feel like an expert 737 Captain... Things like "helping messages" when you enter wrong stuff in the FMS, pop up screens, autoinserting values, etc. Yes, I see the point about ergonomics and the missing Copilot, but the "dummy mode" has to be carefully evaluated.

 

Because thats what the majority of the flightsim user base is - layman that want to feel like pilots, but don´t want to put in the effort. This in turn creates pressure on the developers to make games for this group, they are the majority and they pay the most money! So this leaves the "hardcore" simulation pilots in a defensive posture, and soon game developers have you flying through the sky over Hawaii chasing floating coins, because most users think that might be cool...

 

If you want to know what I am talking about, look at the official X-Plane "Questions and answers" page: questions.x-plane.com

 

Most of these questions are leaving me with my mouth agape. How do these people even start their computer to post these questions, it seems that some would have a hard time to even operate a power switch...Now imagine someone like that trying to fly a 737 and then posting his "wishlist" of features. Autoinstall, Autostartup, Autotaxiout. Autotakeoff,...

 

This is why I stopped trying to "convert" FSX user to X-Plane. Only few of them have the "right stuff" to enjoy X-Plane for what it is, the majority just want to fly around and don´t care a bit how to really operate an aircraft, they look for the "B" key, wonder why "S" doesn´t change the views,they can´t watch AI airplanes land and take-off on real airline schedules for hours (while they should be doing homework), the joystick doesn´t work "right away", whats up with the seasons and why is the Statue of Liberty missing? :P Please stay with FSX/Prepared, the scenery is so much better and then there is OrbX!  :smile:

 

Jan

 

PS: In an Airbus you can "preset" your altimeter during cruise-flight, then only push in the altitude setting knob when passing the TL. Maybe also in more modern Boeings, not sure.

 

 

"Seriously, Jan?"  Flight simulation is only for the hard-core?  What the heck does that mean?....  What you are doing on a computer IS NOT REAL. by any means... Pressing keys...shift-C this or that to simulate a real-world cockpit action and/or function...is not real...so in that regard, how a user defines their level of involvement within the hobby...is all that matters.

 

If you want to sit in a multi-million dollar flight simulator cockpit...sure...that's another discussion, but to say some users could be 'noob's, being defined as such, by being parsed by your personal expectations/definitions...is somewhat...straining it. There are no noobs...there are flight simulation users.

 

Jan, you used the term in your post; 'to each his own'...yet your comments lean heavily as I see it...to 'each his own'---- only if their usage aligns to your personal needs, requirements, and flight simulation expectations.

 

Yes...if Laminar gave me a one key press, auto-update of current B.P. you bet your life, I'd avail myself of it...and be able to carry on another pressing function of flight control enroute.  Yes sir!  Just I as I do in FSX, P3D, and FS9...of which all of them, I do not consider a flight 'game', whilst X Plane as per your pervue,--- is for 'serious' application of flight simulation!

 

 I kept reading in the background harmony, ah... platform elitism.  

 

Cheers,

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Hi Sesquashtoo,

 

Hmm, I guess I am guilty as charged on the account of platform elitism. I try hard to conceal it, but it obviously doesn´t work. :wink:

 

But hey, if you found out that setting the altimeter is challenging because there are so many things to do in a short timeframe (approach), then you have already learned something with X-Plane that you haven´t learned with FSX: Flying is all about managing the workload, proper preparation and expecting the unexpected. You can learn how to land an airplane in 2 hours, but thats not why flying is hard.

 

I think you might be right, maybe my views are a bit old-fashioned, I love to convey about flying, it´s challenges and why I think mastering these challenges can be rewarding. I wish I could teach everybody about that, because it is something I love so much myself and want to share it.

 

But maybe that is not for everyone, and I should stop trying to convince people to do it "my way", I have to admit that.

 

So good luck with the B key, it´s probably a simple addition and Austin might just sneak that in for the next update. I will just see that we disable that function for our plane :Devil: .

 

No offense, Jan

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Hi Sesquashtoo,

 

Hmm, I guess I am guilty as charged on the account of platform elitism. I try hard to conceal it, but it obviously doesn´t work. :wink:

 

But hey, if you found out that setting the altimeter is challenging because there are so many things to do in a short timeframe (approach), then you have already learned something with X-Plane that you haven´t learned with FSX: Flying is all about managing the workload, proper preparation and expecting the unexpected. You can learn how to land an airplane in 2 hours, but thats not why flying is hard.

 

I think you might be right, maybe my views are a bit old-fashioned, I love to convey about flying, it´s challenges and why I think mastering these challenges can be rewarding. I wish I could teach everybody about that, because it is something I love so much myself and want to share it.

 

But maybe that is not for everyone, and I should stop trying to convince people to do it "my way", I have to admit that.

 

So good luck with the B key, it´s probably a simple addition and Austin might just sneak that in for the next update. I will just see that we disable that function for our plane :Devil: .

 

No offense, Jan

Jan...about disabling that 'B' key function...you made me laugh in a very good way...for the golden rule is...the person with the gold, makes the rules..LOLOLOL!

 

Good go!

 

I don't look for in-cockpit shortcuts beyond the B.P. 'B' key of the M.S. based platforms...and personally plan my actions out 15 miles ahead of when needed or anticipated...but I do still look at the constantly updated B.P, as schlepping it off, to my First Officer...:)   He's getting paid...let him handle it! :)))))

 

No offense taken, nor I hope you...from me.

 

Cheers,

 

Mitch

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No offense taken, nor I hope you...from me.

 

Cheers,

 

Mitch

 

Never ever :smile: . We are stuck in this geeky hobby together, and we are generally pulling in the same direction! And what fun would this be if we always agreed on everything?

 

All the best, Jan

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No offense, Jan

 

I don't think anyone took any offense. Your opinion is as valid and as legit as everyone's else! 

I just think it's not a bad thing to cater shortcuts to the people that want to use them, given it does not hurt the "hardcore" simmer per se. 

 

I guess my views are just less authoritarian on that matter and I don't feel the need to force people to feel like they achieved something  :P

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"I just think it's not a bad thing to cater shortcuts to the people that want to use them, given it does not hurt the "hardcore" simmer per se."

 

There we go! Well said Lena. But I did enjoy the civalized debate! Thank you for that.

 

JJ

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As far as I'm concerned, most home computer setups do not have full panels with all switches and knobs, and the flow from left hand to right hand just doesn't work, anywhere close to real time..................if you must always rotate "screen" knobs and switches by "mouse".  In this case, shortcuts work!   I too, liked the B key.

 

For the record, I never flew airliners, and never had a full time co-pilot. Just higher performance singles and aerobatic aircraft. Worked on many panels, including layout, for the best possible work flow.   I can appreciate the idea of keeping everything as realistic as possible, but keyboards, mouses, and a few additional switches on our home aviation  sticks and yokes, don't translate to what we can do in real time, without a pause button. Besides, I always found it much easier to look at, and set the real altimeter, than many of the ones on a computer screen. In fact, years ago, I brought an altimeter into the house, just to compare visuals................since the screen version just seemed tougher to get the actual numbers.  

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I used this shortcut a lot in FSX, but in X-Plane I've never needed to. The reason is that I very rarely use real weather or fly above 10,000ft.

 

One thing I frequently notice about FSX/P3D users coming over to try X-Plane is that very few seem to have the patience to read the instructions or learn how to install addons/scenery. They see the interface, new keyboard shortcuts, etc and find it too complicated, complain they hate it and then disappear back to FSX. It always makes me wonder how such users ever sat down and learned to use the FMC or GPS in the first place. If I spend $60 on a piece of software or a game, I'd absolutely spend the time trying to learn how to use it. 

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I'll pay for and appreciate as much realism as the developers can provide in aircraft, scenery and the platform itself whilst acknowledging that it's a simulator at the end of the day. The better the simulation though, the more impressed we'll all be I think it's fair to say.

Catering for the mass market is easier and probably more profitable but I think it's important for developers to push for better. Janov is right to take pride in his work imo. The impulse to dumb things down for the masses should be resisted for the sake of the masses.

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If XP would have a working ATC, we would not have to discuss that. I don't use ATC because it's broken. Before flight I use FSRGW to download static weather and I take notes of departure and arrival weather. Easy, to change the barometic setting in the sim. But isn't that another cheat? Nothing wrong about a "b" key. It does not make you a worse sim pilot.

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