Flight Simulator and Real World Logo's

[Guest]

No. PSS have ALWAYS sold their liveries separate because they believe people should pay only for what they're actually using.If you don't like that and would rather pay for a hundred liveries that you'll never use, be my guest and buy from someone else.And ALL PSS asks is that you don't compete with them when creating liveries. If you want to make one they did don't distribute it.If you make one they didn't make, you can distribute it.Don't like that, don't buy from them.You do indeed sound like a spoiled brat who is whining that he doesn't get a free cookie.

[Trans_27 Pilot Chase 59]

>>You do indeed sound like a spoiled brat who is whining that he doesn't get a free cookie.May i reccomend next time you make a comment similar to that one, you really need to be able to back it up. This is one reason i hate taking part of post's that your involved with. You always seem to find a way to belittle some one in some sort of way.Second, i dont think he is #### like a spoiled brat because he didnt get a cookie, im aggrivated with the fact that pss will not allow you to repaint that aircraft freely and post your artwork as you please.>>PSS have ALWAYS sold their liveries separate because they believe people should pay only for what they're actually using.Who ever said they had to paint every airline and i pay for them? Why not do like PMDG and paint a single paint, then allow others to build on that model as they please?Like i said, before you jump on me, OR others for that matter, be able to back it up.

[Farlis 2,289]

>Microsoft only uses ficticious airlines for its stock>aircraft and AI.>>Maybe we should ask ourselves why?Not hard to figure out. You need a license if you want to reproduce and sell any form of actual artwork.

[Guest ogeva]

Do you really belive that when buying PMDG or LDS you paid for hundreds of repaint you never used? What about the fact that you have more than one base pack in the PMDG products? PSS are not cheap at all compared to others when considering this fact, and that's without allowing the community to repaint freely.I really do not understand your passion as a consumer to defend so fiercly a developer policy that is screwing you...As to your other remark, it's not worth wasting keystrokes on.http://online.vatsimindicators.net/825051/142.png

[SQUAWKIDENT 3]

Unless PSS has specific permission to reproduce the brand logo's from the airlines concerned it is an abuse of trademark rights. Charging people for these unofficial repaints makes the situation even more serious.

[Guest vas_yan]

"Unless PSS has specific permission to reproduce the brand logo's from the airlines concerned it is an abuse of trademark rights. Charging people for these unofficial repaints makes the situation even more serious".You have just branded every repainter out there as outlaw. :-wave

[Farlis 2,289]

>"Unless PSS has specific permission to reproduce the brand>logo's from the airlines concerned it is an abuse of trademark>rights. Charging people for these unofficial repaints makes>the situation even more serious".>>You have just branded every repainter out there as outlaw. >:-wave No he didn't. It's only a copyright infringement if you sell it for profit.

[Guest vas_yan]

He said so..."Charging ... makes the situation even more serious". i.e. even not charging is bad.

[SQUAWKIDENT 3]

Unfortunately it doesn't make any difference whether you are charging for the product or not with regards to trademark infringement (there is - as far as I am aware - no defence in law making it a lesser offence).It's obvious that the majority of airlines don't mind people repainting their trademarks onto MSFS models. If they did all those repainters would have heard about it by now. However CHARGING people to buy their trademarks as an addon livery would be frowned at especially if the permission of the trademark owner was not sought before selling the product for personal gain.Let's just hope PSS have got the permission of each trademark owner before offering their repaints for sale to us all!RegardsAdamFS9.1Win XPPrescott 3.20 GHz - 2GB RAMAsus ATi Radeon X800 Pro TD 256MBOmega Radeon ATI Drivers19" CRT 1600x1200 @ 100hzAudiophile 24/96 AudioUK JAR PPL/IMC

[Guest vas_yan]

"Let's just hope PSS have got the permission of each trademark owner before offering their repaints for sale to us all!"Or else? What should this community do?a. Rat on PSS (What good would that do? It would just draw unwanted attention)?b. Make the repaint anyway (i.e. "steal" from the "thief" and, possibly, from the rightful owner)?Don't get me wrong, I am just trying to make the point that maybe we should think a little about the impact (or rather lack thereof) of such petty things in our lives and just give the issue a rest.

[SQUAWKIDENT 3]

I agree it would be better to forget the whole thing. Unfortunately there appears to be some ill feeling regarding PSS selling repaints of their aircraft rather than offering them as free downloads like the majority of other companies producing MSFS addons.That alone appears to have sparked a debate elsewhere!RegardsAdam

[Mike_CFII_MEL 789]

Hello,I don't think its petty. When will the greed end?. If we as a community accept this practice then what additonal charges are going to be next?.You state: "Rat on PSS (What good would that do? It would just draw unwanted attention)?"I think it will do some good for the community, it will keep companies from charging for repaints for which they do not own copyright.You state: "I am just trying to make the point that maybe we should think a little about the impact".I am thinking about the impact, as well as the future of Flight Simulation, and the rising cost to remain in this hobby.

[Guest IanP]

"I don't think its petty. When will the greed end?. If we as a community accept this practice then what additonal charges are going to be next?."I have to correct you here. PSS's business model has not changed since FS2000 - with their original B777-200, interestingly. This isn't some new "trick" to "con" people out of more money, it is the business model they adopted then and it hasn't changed since.The "rising cost to remain in this hobby" is, I'm afraid, not down to "greed", it's down to the growth in the size of the hobby. I had to pay

[Tom Allensworth 1,532]

"Perhaps someone from the Avsim library staff could compare the numbers of files uploaded per month back then compared to what are uploaded now. I think you'll find that's gone up, too."Don't have to do anything quite so complicated as that. We have a stat that is updated daily, which can be found here:http://library.avsim.net/viewstats.php?Graph=growthEDIT: and you can see from the graph (if you put on your best set of X4 magnifying glasses), that the uploads have actually accelerated over time, starting from 1999.

[Guest rwdriver]

Hey everyone:Cathay Pacific Virtual went through the issue with Cathay Pacific. Somewhere on there web site they have posted the letter from their attorney that stopped the pursuit by CX. Essentially they maintained that since there could be no reasonable confusion between a virtual airline and the real airline in terms of the purchase of tickets, the use of the trademarked logo was fair use.It's a pretty compelling arguement and, more importantly, was effective in stopping their harrassment.