Best KLAX for p3dv4?

[virtuali 4,421]

47 minutes ago, Mitch24 said:

Lol! You expect us as customers to go off of a video that the developer made on his own system to judge performance lol

So, you can decide the video posted by Louis_KMIA is valid proof, when it show low fps, but ALL the others (the one posted Avidean, the one by Youtube user Chewwy94 and the one I just posted), cannot be trusted, just because they are not confirming your opinion ?

But that's really besides the point. See, when having a Trial version, there's no need for arguing, since everybody can the scenery works on THEIR system, by just downloading and installing it. That's why your vested accusation of having "faked" the video in some way, doesn't make any sense.

The only think it's probably different on my system, is that I don't have 3rd party weather engine installed, I used it with a default airplane, the surrounding scenery is the default one.

But that's precisely my point: if we are judging the performance of the airport , it should be tested with no other addons, otherwise you'll never know which one is causing performance problems. And of course, my previous screenshot of Aerosoft EDDF, which indicated a lower fps than KLAX, was made under the same conditions: default airplane, no weather engine, default scenery outside. 

But all the other videos posted here (NOT by me), were full of addons, and yet it still worked very well.

 

47 minutes ago, Mitch24 said:

How about you stop replying here and take this time to go back into your office and fix the performance issue. You know, with all of this time spent defending it, you could of probably solved it! 😂

How about trying to understand that bad fps at an airport, are not always a "problem" of the airport itself but, more usually, a combination of settings, AI, airplane, and all the other sceneries around ?

FSDT KLAX, considering all the following:

- The area it resides in (even the default scenery is not very light there)

- The potential number of AI it can attract (4 parallel runways and lots of flights going there)

- The typical 3rd party airplanes which will be used there

PERFORMS VERY WELL, and we already gave more proof that it was really necessary.

[virtuali 4,421]

3 hours ago, honanhal said:

If the problem is on my end, I’m all ears for how to fix it.

 

It's difficult to know, without knowing more about your system and your settings. The airplane used, the kind of AI used, and the number of AI. Your autogen or scenery complexity settings might be important.

KLAX can attract lots of AI, and the L.A. area itself can be very heavy on performance, even with  the default KLAX, if used with high Autogen settings and high Scenery Complexity settings.

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 but it’s a fact that its performance isn’t excellent like my other FSDT sceneries.

Well, since I think I should know something about FSDT sceneries and how they are made, I'd say KLAX is one of the fast ones, maybe KIAH and KLAS are a bit faster but, they are taking advantage of being in a much fps-friendly area and are not able to generate as many AI.

[Mitch24 194]

3 hours ago, honanhal said:

FPS drop when panning over terminals is exactly what I see as well. I don’t use Orbx SoCal, so I’m not sure what other scenery’s bad optimization bringing it down we’re talking about here.

I live with the performance issues and it’s by no means a horribly performing scenery overall, but it’s a fact that its performance isn’t excellent like my other FSDT sceneries.

If the problem is on my end, I’m all ears for how to fix it.

James

Lol don't bother, he's in his own little fantasy world with his sceneries.  Just let him think it 😂

[virtuali 4,421]

1 hour ago, Mitch24 said:

Lol don't bother, he's in his own little fantasy world with his sceneries.  Just let him think it 😂

I understand it must be hard for you, after multiple videos, from different users proving you repeatedly wrong...

What's the reason of you suggesting not to bother ? Are you worried that maybe, he'll try something, and eventually realize what was the real cause of his low fps at KLAX, proving you wrong again, if all those video showing good fps weren't enough ? Don't let the facts get in the way of a good story, right ?

[virtuali 4,421]

2 hours ago, virtuali said:

Lol! You expect us as customers to go off of a video that the developer made on his own system to judge performance lol

Fine, let's see what do you make of this.

I'm just moving from KLAX to EDDF, in the same session so, clearly, the system it's the same and the settings are the same. The fact is, KLAX is not any slower (I'd say it's a bit faster), than a similarly big airport from another developer, which is newer and specifically made for P3D4.

And no, I assure you I haven't developed in the last 30 minutes a software which automatically speeds up the cpu on FSDT sceneries (let's hope nobody will take this madness idea as a suggestion), just to make the video...

 

 

 

Edited May 12, 2018 by virtuali

[BlueStar 323]

2 hours ago, Mitch24 said:

Lol don't bother, he's in his own little fantasy world with his sceneries.  Just let him think it 😂

Although I don't have KLAX, I do have several FSDT sceneries along with sceneries from most of the other major developers including the new KSFO/KSLC/EDDF/KBOS/KMIA/KSDF/ORBX and I haven't notice a lot of difference in any of them when it comes to performance.  Each developer has their own style, but the performance is similar and certainly not a deal breaker. I'm just glad they are out there. 🙂

[Dyno152 51]

4 hours ago, Mitch24 said:

Lol don't bother, he's in his own little fantasy world with his sceneries.  Just let him think it 😂

I am able to run FSDT LAX with ORBX Socal, PMDG 737, ASCA, AS4 and run sliders pretty heavy on a 4k monitor and I am able to get 30 FPS steady like I normally do elsewhere.

Nothing is wrong with the performance of this airport.

This hobby is too small to belittle or try to degrade someone, especially those developers who work very hard to bring us some amazing software so we can continue to enjoy this hobby year after year.

Get over yourself. 

[Mitch24 194]

18 minutes ago, Dyno152 said:

Get over yourself. 

I am already over myself. In fact, I got over myself 25 years ago. 

1 hour ago, Bluestar said:

Although I don't have KLAX, I do have several FSDT sceneries along with sceneries from most of the other major developers including the new KSFO/KSLC/EDDF/KBOS/KMIA/KSDF/ORBX and I haven't notice a lot of difference in any of them when it comes to performance.  Each developer has their own style, but the performance is similar and certainly not a deal breaker. I'm just glad they are out there. 🙂

I agree. I was simply saying that FSDT KLAX doesn't perform nearly as well as the others. (Which is true). Then the FSDT police showed up like he does to everything lol.

FSDT KLAX was made with old FS9 polygons if I remember correctly which is why it doesn't perform that well.  

Edited May 12, 2018 by Mitch24

[virtuali 4,421]

51 minutes ago, Mitch24 said:

FSDT KLAX was made with old FS9 polygons if I remember correctly which is why it doesn't perform that well.  

You are not remembering correctly.

KLAX doesn't have a single FS8/9 polygon, which is why it performs so well. We made a separate FS9 version, but it was released several months after the FSX version, because we had to redo all the background polygons just for FS9. After that experience, we decided to drop FS9 support, since it was far too effort to convert for a sim it wasn't designed for.

You might have confused it with KLAS, which does have *some* FS8/9 ground polygons, and it was our last scenery that was made like that, in 2009. Then, it came KDFW (no legacy code) in 2010, and then KLAX in 2011 so, we have been FS8/9-free for the past 8 years.

Interestingly enough, even KLAS works quite well in P3D4, likely because the FS8 code was kept to a minimum, the airport is smaller, and the surrounding area is much more fps friendly.

Edited May 12, 2018 by virtuali

[DaveCT2003 1,820]

I run FSDT KLAX under P3DV4 with ORBX Global and Vector, P3DV4 settings are above average, and on my system the performance is pretty good.  The frame rates are actually better with the KLAX Photo Real Freeware, but I use the FSDT.

My system:  i7-4770K at 4.5GHz, GTX1080.

Umberto has never claimed to be a gem when it comes to interacting with people, in fact I'm pretty sure he'd agree that customer relations is solidly in the toilet.  But he does put out some pretty darned good software and his tech support is usually spot on (if you can tolerate his attitude).  I'm not complaining about this especially since I've been doing product tech support for 14 years and know the type of things a developer has to contend with.

Best wishes to everyone.

 

Edited May 12, 2018 by DaveCT2003

[virtuali 4,421]

37 minutes ago, DaveCT2003 said:

Umberto has never claimed to be a gem when it comes to interacting with people

In the small flight simulation market, which more than a market, is really a cottage industry, you can say the same for a lot of other developers. No need to do names but I'm sure most will agree it's quite common.

And the reason is very simple: support is not our job, I'm a developer which is happy when its C++ routine compiles and works correctly, and I get excited by my debugger, and the only reason why I have to interact with users, it's because this kind of "industry" is so small that, even assuming we had the budget to hire someone formally trained in customer care, he might be able to offer a somewhat friendlier support, but I doubt he might be technically prepared on something so specific and so niche such as home flight simulators. Having a support guy that will reply "I'll have to ask the developers", to every question which is not entirely obvious at first sight, is not my idea of efficient or useful support.

 

Quote

But he does put out some pretty darned good software and his tech support is usually spot on 

And that should be the only thing that matters.

But sometimes it really hurts, after you spent so many (thousands) of hours working at something, always thinking new and better ways to optimize, since for me (personally), frame rate is the thing that matters most, as long the scenery is at least decent, reading such comments as a scenery being "badly optimized", when it's optimized like ***LL.

I'm sorry for being passionate, and I apologize for caring...

Edited May 12, 2018 by virtuali

[Mitch24 194]

38 minutes ago, DaveCT2003 said:

 

Umberto has never claimed to be a gem when it comes to interacting with people, in fact I'm pretty sure he'd agree that customer relations is solidly in the toilet.  But he does put out some pretty darned good software and his tech support is usually spot on (if you can tolerate his attitude).  I'm not complaining about this especially since I've been doing product tech support for 14 years and know the type of things a developer has to contend with.

Best wishes to everyone.

 

The reason why he gets into so many arguments with his customers is because he lashes out at them if someone even posts a question or a statement about any of his products. He needs to be more understanding that not everyone has his knowledge of computers or software development and needs to be more understanding with people.

He also needs to learn how to ignore comments if someone says the slightest thing about his products.

If he claims that support is not his "thing", well, sorry, you are dealing with customers and if you can't handle it than hire someone else to do the talking because you probably drive people away. 

Edited May 12, 2018 by Mitch24

[virtuali 4,421]

35 minutes ago, Mitch24 said:

The reason why he gets into so many arguments with his customers is because he lashes out at them if someone even posts a question or a statement about any of his products.

Yours wasn't a question. It was an opinion which wasn't shared by anyone in this thread, except user honanhal, which had a completely different attitude than yours, and accepted the chance it might be something related to his system, so my reply to him was very different, and I think I gave him some pointers to start with, in order to understand what was affecting fps in *his* system.

You, instead, continued to insist in your theory of the badly optimized airport, and said all the videos posted either do not count, or cannot be trusted because mine might have been faked or something.

Quote

He needs to be more understanding that not everyone has his knowledge of computers or software development and needs to be more understanding with people.

Re-read my reply to honanhal: I think I might have passed some useful information to him. 

Quote

If he claims that support is not his "thing", well, sorry, you are dealing with customers and if you can't handle it than hire someone else to do the talking because you probably drive people away. 

Yes, that's exactly what I've said, and it's a very similar situation about many other developers too.

It's strange that, after what just happened to DTG, we don't seem to accept the reality: this IS a SMALL market and will *remain* small. DTG were very nice guys, they even had a proper P.R. lady, they looked good on social media and were well financed too so, what could possibly go wrong ?

I'm working with flight sim stuff, at full time, since 1993, and in 25 years I've seen many companies, products and personalities coming and going away and, the most usual case of a failed product/company, is when someone tries to enter the market using the same approach of larger companies, hiring large staff, getting some funding for marketing, support and P.R. people like a "real" company, and then falling flat on ground, after realising the market is too small to support this, and there's no way to make it any larger than already is, because the matter is complex, and is not for everybody: it takes some brain to care about flight sims, and that's not something you can just grow up with marketing.

So, I'm afraid we'll have to remain small, not because we cannot "afford" to hire a properly trained support specialist (and that's not even certain, I'll have to ask "accounting", which in fact is my wife, and she'll likely say "no"...), but because for the same money, I'd rather hire a new developer or a modeler or a texture artist, to release a product, or help the guys that are working hard to make the next one.

Edited May 12, 2018 by virtuali

[kand 205]

2 hours ago, virtuali said:

Yours wasn't a question. It was an opinion which wasn't shared by anyone in this thread, except user honanhal, which had a completely different attitude than yours, and accepted the chance it might be something related to his system, so my reply to him was very different, and I think I gave him some pointers to start with, in order to understand what was affecting fps in *his* system.

You, instead, continued to insist in your theory of the badly optimized airport, and said all the videos posted either do not count, or cannot be trusted because mine might have been faked or something.

Re-read my reply to honanhal: I think I might have passed some useful information to him. 

Yes, that's exactly what I've said, and it's a very similar situation about many other developers too.

It's strange that, after what just happened to DTG, we don't seem to accept the reality: this IS a SMALL market and will *remain* small. DTG were very nice guys, they even had a proper P.R. lady, they looked good on social media and were well financed too so, what could possibly go wrong ?

I'm working with flight sim stuff, at full time, since 1993, and in 25 years I've seen many companies, products and personalities coming and going away and, the most usual case of a failed product/company, is when someone tries to enter the market using the same approach of larger companies, hiring large staff, getting some funding for marketing, support and P.R. people like a "real" company, and then falling flat on ground, after realising the market is too small to support this, and there's no way to make it any larger than already is, because the matter is complex, and is not for everybody: it takes some brain to care about flight sims, and that's not something you can just grow up with marketing.

So, I'm afraid we'll have to remain small, not because we cannot "afford" to hire a properly trained support specialist (and that's not even certain, I'll have to ask "accounting", which in fact is my wife, and she'll likely say "no"...), but because for the same money, I'd rather hire a new developer or a modeler or a texture artist, to release a product, or help the guys that are working hard to make the next one.

Very logical, keep up the good work, without FSDT I wouldn't have so many great US destinations

FWIW, I have KLAS in my FSDT library, I run my sim PC only displaying the outside world as I am lucky enough to own a Jetmax rig, I dont see the issues reported here and I run FTX, all black marble and heavy wx settings (GTX1080ti i76700k @ 4.5ghz) 

Edited May 13, 2018 by kand

[KL Oo 706]

@virtuali

Do not take any offence from people on here bashing you or your product. The quality of your addons is, IMHO, fantastic and the direction you have taken in ensuring your products are contemporary is admirable (removing support for older antiquated software). 

Keep doing what you're doing - your products speak for themselves and the fact that you come on here and engage with the users is A LOT more than some other developers do.