AviatorMan

Sparse/slow autogen loading in P3Dv4

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I noticed there were a number of threads on this issue last year and earlier this year, both on Avsim and LM's forums. But to my mind there were never conclusive nor even authoritative answers to what were the causes. Some said it was setting AM, too high settings, it's an Orbx problem, etc. I noticed on the LM forum that no one claiming to be an official LM representative answered what was the problem. (On the A2A forum if you post a problem, someone from A2A responds typically within hours.) I was not really having the problem until I installed v4.4, and now I have it big time. I have tried most of the unofficial solutions,and nothing seems to fix the problem. I am thinking about uninstalling and reinstalling v4.3 for the time being. If someone here is aware that there is a real answer out there, hidden somewhere withing the many threads and responses, I would greatly appreciate hearing it.

 

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Unfortunately, too many people ignore this issue and don't complain enough. This issue became visible since version 4.1 came out, I personally complained (and have a post here and on their web recently) about it.

Apparently, LM don't care about it and to my recollection, they said over a year ago that they will look into a solution. Unfortunately, 3 or 4 versions later still the same issue for a large number of people.  

Just a few examples    

https://www.dropbox.com/s/j9uzigilvqnlkzv/slow to load.PNG?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/lel60ergirqxgov/textures.PNG?dl=0

I asked different people and everyone came with a different suggestion, unfortunately, LM is to fix it.

I agree with you that 4.3 is better from this point of view...…………………..

Check this one, it was too much of inconvenience. I really don't understand why would they block it instead of committing of fixing the issue or just admit it that they unable or unwilling.

I would not have a problem with the last part, but locking the post for a valid and known a problem I have an issue with it. 

https://www.prepar3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=130120&start=45

Edited by killthespam

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I agree the autogen loads too slow. The further you fly from the starting scenario point the longer it takes to load autogen in the distance. On my system I can see a line roughly 15-20NM out in urban areas sometimes less, sometimes further that is very annoying where the autogen - nonautogen dividing line is. I have since lowered my autogen to normal density and turned up load distance to max and terrain radius to max to help. It does help as well as some of the new scenery 4.4 tweaks. But still not where it needs to be. LM needs to improve this a lot.

I have 64GB of DDR4 at 2800mhz running at 12CL. SLI 2080TIs and a TR 2990WX CPU that boosts up to 4.2ghz w/ HT off. P3D is on it's own m.2 2TB 960 Pro SSD and same type of m.2 SSD for OS only (W10). My rig is impeccably maintained. This has been an issue for the last few releases for me.

I agree since around 4.1 was the last time it was decent, seems to have gotten worse.

And unrelated it is unacceptable how that engine sound pitch glitch got through to the release version of 4.4. That is LITERALLY the same sound glitch from FS2000 where when you went into the cockpit after being outside and the engines pitch is higher than slows back down to where it should be. It was fixed in FS2002 and has been fixed since P3D4.3. Whatever they did they brought that old bug out of hiding. While the code has slightly been changed since then, higher sample rates and sound cones, the base sound engine is unchanged since FS2000. So it's entirely probable that glitch could still surface again. Even if it's not the same bug the characteristics are the same as the FS2000 one. Very annoying.

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I can’t believe that LM didn’t fix the autogen issue for this release ... I kind of suspected it wouldn’t be fixed because my post questioning this issue was deleted on their forum ...

 

 

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The best way to fix autogen loading issues is to set the internal frame rate limiter to other than unlimited. The price will be some FPS but the autogen loads correctly.

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4 hours ago, BlueSky31 said:

The best way to fix autogen loading issues is to set the internal frame rate limiter to other than unlimited. The price will be some FPS but the autogen loads correctly.

I tried this. Set to 30 fps. Absolutely no effect on the autogen problem that I can detect.

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How are your settings then? With unlimited and autogen draw distance on "medium", the autogen loading late and in patches should be eliminated. With a frame limit inside P3D, you should be able to go higher than "medium", but only if your hardware is capable of. Currently, I use a limit of 30FPS and "very high" (the setting just one notch below max) and I only see autogen loading in extremly heavy scenarios and only at the very end of the view distance. So basically limiting the FPS to 30 almost eliminated the issue (it is still there of course, but not that prominent anymore).

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POP_FREE_AUTOGEN=1 does not seem to be functioning anymore - I set my FPS to 20 and on a high visibility day I see the autogen pop in chunks; that was supposed to be fixed.

I remember this working at some point (autogen fading in to view), but not in 4.3 or 4.4, and I wonder if this has something to do with this issue.

Stuff gets fixed and other stuff that was fixed gets broken.:wacko:

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3 minutes ago, pracines said:

Stuff gets fixed and other stuff that was fixed gets broken.:wacko:

Exactly my thoughts too Paul.

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BluSky31 and AnkH, thank you so much for the good intentions. Unfortunately it doesn't fix the problem. 

We just try to hide the issues with different tweaks and try to believe that is ok when actually it's a big problem for many of us starting over a year ago with V 4.1.

This is something very visible and unpleasant, besides this now we have an additional issue with the engine sound.

I would think that after over a year where many of us tried so many tweaks to no end and no success we would not ask too much from LM to fix it!

Unfortunately people got used with this "tweaking" from FSX and find this normal.

LM has a very good potential of doing good things and we should ask from them first  to fix what is broken and then to add the other goodies.

We should remember that this is not a FREE software (we paid individually for each version V1, V2, V3 and V4) and the small updates (fixes) for each version are part of the normal process.

What I found unacceptable is that LM blocked a  series of posts with valid problems regarding the software instead to commit to a fix, that's the biggest problem IMHO.

Let's be real here, when you buy a product for some people will work perfect and for other not, that's why we take that product back to be fixed or else.

 

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Unfortunately, that's the consequence of allowing 3rd party add-ons. LM only tracks down problems associated with the base sim. Even then their first suggestion is to use use lower IQ values as they also can't control what hardware is being used.

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Jay,

If you don't mind, maybe I'm getting this wrong but we are not talking about 3rd party add-ons or some odd hardware. I'm just looking at vanilla installation within LM minimum system requirements before adding anything else.

Again I'm sorry if I misunderstood your post.  

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I was only pointing out that LM either ignores or locks posts when they are redundant versions of previous posts in which the user was told to remove all add-ons and lower their settings. I wasn't responding to your specific issues.

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Jay,

That's fine thank you!

Edited by killthespam

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17 minutes ago, jabloomf1230 said:

I was only pointing out that LM either ignores or locks posts when they are redundant versions of previous posts in which the user was told to remove all add-ons and lower their settings. I wasn't responding to your specific issues.

And now they are deleting them ...

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Honestly I don't blame them. The perfect example of such posts are the "CTD near Greenland" thread(s). It must be obvious by now to the casual observer that LM can't either duplicate this error or can't understand how to fix it.

Edited by jabloomf1230

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2 hours ago, jabloomf1230 said:

Honestly I don't blame them. The perfect example of such posts are the "CTD near Greenland" thread(s). It must be obvious by now to the casual observer that LM can't either duplicate this error or can't understand how to fix it

Perhaps, but this is not such an issue. Many have experienced it and probably many more who haven't posted hoping that LM will fix it and they will find the solution in a thread here, on LM's site or elsewhere. I honestly wasn't following that close to know that LM have deleted posts from users experiencing problems and who are just hoping for a solution. I can't see that's really such a good customer relations approach.I apparently have come into this issue late if this discussion has been going on that long, because for whatever reason I didn't really experience the problem until v4.4, so I am just looking for some help. And I haven't added any addons that I didn't already have.

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Its funny that I don't experience any of the issues above and if anything 4.4 works wonders on my system. All my autogen is there no poping or drawing in. The black textures when looking around are just about a thing of the past. P3D v4.4 I think is the best thing to happen in a long time for me. I'm really sorry that others are having issues but I don't think they would have released it if it wasn't ready.  Anyhow I hope it all works out in the end for everyone and they find a solution for there problems .

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58 minutes ago, FreeBird(Josh) said:

Its funny that I don't experience any of the issues above and if anything 4.4 works wonders on my system. All my autogen is there no poping or drawing in. The black textures when looking around are just about a thing of the past. P3D v4.4 I think is the best thing to happen in a long time for me. I'm really sorry that others are having issues but I don't think they would have released it if it wasn't ready.  Anyhow I hope it all works out in the end for everyone and they find a solution for there problems .

I am one of the victims. Take off from KSFO (FB) and fly into the Silicon Valley (ORBX) with an ocean of buildings in fair weather. I see a clear line dividing the "autogen region" from the "non-autogen region" as soon as I turn South. Initially, after turning to Highway 101, the line is a tad beyond Palo Alto. After a few minutes (in a C172), autogen gets loaded beyond that line in patches. I even made a couple of videos and posted them on the LM forum a year ago.

http://www.prepar3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6312&t=125808&start=30

(scroll down). This very same behavior did not change during alle updates since, includiung 4.4. LM's Beau Hollies himself states they didn't do any major changes in the way autogen loads in 4.4

http://www.prepar3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6314&t=131712

And no, this can't be cured by setting a fixed fps, and I tried several fps figures. As in previous versions, it can only be cured by setting the Autogen and Scenery Range Slider to "Medium". While this makes a soft transition, the latter is quite close to the plane (around the autogen radius of P3D3.x, I would say).

I agree, LM has done a wouderful work with photo scenery and former black buildings loading now. I also feel, they improved the ground morphing in mountain reagions, without completely eliminating it, though. But the autogen issue remains unsolved so far, at least for me.

Fortunately the autogen issue is only visible in extended ranges full of buildings, like the Silicon Vallay or Paris City (France VFR).

Kind regards, Michael

Edited by pmb
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I do see that line especially in big cities and now that things are sharper its more prevalent. I believe in the past and I also complained about it just what your talking about. I believe there answer was it gave better performance. I believe this all started on V3 and I hated it but now with the new tweeks  I don't see it anymore except in big city's. Last night I did a flight from KMRY to SFO as was amazed on how far the autogen went. I was just on top of the Santa Cruz mountains and I could see the SFcity and all the autogen  was complete from San Jose to the GG Bridge and as I got over Silicon Valley the lights of Marin were visible along with the top of the GG bridge.

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Guys, let me give you a good advice. I won't necessarily solve the problem of autogen popping for those who have it, but limit your visibility!  The pictures linked to by killthespam show a totally unrealistic and ugly looking unlimited visibility devoid of haze that you get when you select "Fair Weather". Have you ever seen a condition like this in the real world?  If you use unlimited visibility, you will always see the border of the autogen radius, no matter how high you set the autogen draw distance.

This is how the visibility usually looks like on a sunny summer day. I have taken this shot while the airplane was approaching Miami:

2hyic6q.png

How does it compare to the ones linked?  If you use Active Sky, I recommend limiting the ground visibility to 30 miles, unless you are flying at high latitudes. If you limit the visibility, not only will you have a much more realistic depiction, but any autogen popping in the distance will likely be obscured.

This is how it looks on my sim with proper settings and with Envshade, and I am still using P3D v3 that has an autogen draw distance that is equivalent to "medium" in v4. As you can see, the haze makes the transition at the borderline of autogen drawing much less noticeable. Go figure!

2ppelw9.jpg

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17 minutes ago, killthespam said:

This is a video capturing the issue, please note on the left side of the window how ground initially has empty blocks (squares) of autogen textures missing and after a while they fill in.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/5pqsob31q2s1n3u/Lockheed Martin® Prepar3D® v4 12_6_2018 2_18_58 PM_Trim.mp4?dl=0

Any thoughts on this?

Have you experimented with the new SCENERY_DRAW_DISTANCE setting as a possible solution in v4.4?

 

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Hi Bob,

Thank you for taking the time to help.

Yes I did, the problem is that the textures are not loading evenly as you can see. Regarding the distance,  I was able to get it somewhere to where I want it without any penalty on performance, regardless of SCENERY_DRAW_DISTANCE adjustment or not,  I can see the same issue of big empty squares that later they fill in with the proper autogen.

 

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