Oh I didnt know stock xp came with zibo mod out of the box! Who'd known..! 

2 minutes ago, Andreas Stangenes said:

Oh I didnt know stock xp came with zibo mod out of the box! Who'd known..! 

It's all free. That's the point. Yes, you need to download a few more MB's. But that's all. No cost, just free addons. I currently see no free addons that make MSFS a sim. It was truly great at Alpha 2 but it went south after that. I don't know why, I am just disappointed. My guess is that money at MS prevented Asobo from delivering what they talked about for more than a year. We can also see it as just a botched release. And it is a very moot point to compare a 21st century new sim to its ancestors from 20 years ago. 

Just now, hjsmuc said:

It's all free. That's the point. Yes, you need to download a few more MB's. But that's all. No cost, just free addons. I currently see no free addons that make MSFS a sim. It was truly great at Alpha 2 but it went south after that. I don't know why, I am just disappointed. My guess is that money at MS prevented Asobo from delivering what they talked about for more than a year. We can also see it as just a botched release. And it is a very moot point to compare a 21st century new sim to its ancestors from 20 years ago. 

Do you actually need to be here? Sounds like you would rather be somewhere else. Why dont you? Go be free, happy and fly whatever you want. There will be free addons for msfs sooner or later. Saying the point of mentioning the zibo mod is that its free is meaningless. It took time to develop, and so will anything worth while in msfs too. 

21 minutes ago, hjsmuc said:

I compare a stock XP 11 with free Zibo 737 and X-Europe to stock MSFS.

But then, as Andreas pointed out, XP 11 isn't stock any longer. You had to add something to it to get it close to a standard that you could use to compare to MSFS. X-Europe is obviously much better than the stock XP 11 scenery but doesn't realistically compare to the stock scenery in MSFS.

Edited August 19, 20205 yr by vortex681

3 minutes ago, hjsmuc said:

It's all free. That's the point. Yes, you need to download a few more MB's. But that's all. No cost, just free addons. I currently see no free addons that make MSFS a sim. It was truly great at Alpha 2 but it went south after that. I don't know why, I am just disappointed. My guess is that money at MS prevented Asobo from delivering what they talked about for more than a year. We can also see it as just a botched release. And it is a very moot point to compare a 21st century new sim to its ancestors from 20 years ago. 

I’m so confused... what changes from alpha 2 made it *not a sim*?
 

That sounds hyperbolic.

Alpha 2 was working great. Anything after that was no improvement. If you don't care about that I wonder why you are here unless you are paid by Microsoft. If it is not allowed to criticise the hyperbole MSFS then we can shut down this forum right away. 

4 minutes ago, hjsmuc said:

Alpha 2 was working great. Anything after that was no improvement. If you don't care about that I wonder why you are here unless you are paid by Microsoft. If it is not allowed to criticise the hyperbole MSFS then we can shut down this forum right away. 

Right, I get that’s how you feel, but I’m asking for specific changes that somehow made it “not a sim.”

Of course criticism is allowed here! I’ve been critical of many bugs and glitches and things I don’t like. But I also see the potential the sim has and how cool what we have is. 

Let's not count peanuts please. Maybe Alpha 2 wasn't a sim either. I wanted to point out that the release is a disappointment for me. Measured against the promises. It may mature or not, the addons may make it desirable. All good and I hope the best particularly for the folks at Asobo who did the work. I will fly it once in a while but there are too many things missing for me to make it my primary choice. The great scenery in some parts of the world is just not enough for me. 

16 minutes ago, hjsmuc said:

Let's not count peanuts please. Maybe Alpha 2 wasn't a sim either. I wanted to point out that the release is a disappointment for me. Measured against the promises. It may mature or not, the addons may make it desirable. All good and I hope the best particularly for the folks at Asobo who did the work. I will fly it once in a while but there are too many things missing for me to make it my primary choice. The great scenery in some parts of the world is just not enough for me. 

That’s great and all. I’m really just trying to understand the nuisances that are making the sim so bad for you. Aside from some release date bugs and a few minor mistakes (lack of accurate taxiways, etc.), everything about this sim seems better than what we had before. Is it a complete replacement yet? Not without the essential 3rd party releases. But is it the best base sim we have so far? I think so by a long shot.

I’m still curious about specifics. We’ve gone back and forth each time, and you just keep saying “it’s not the right sim for me.” That’s fine, and if that’s the case you have no real reason to still be posting here. 

Edited August 19, 20205 yr by FlyingInACessna

Maybe I am just tired after doing all this testing for months, not seeing any progress. I wish everyone a good experience with the new sim and let's hope to see it mature and be supported in the way it deserves. 

1 hour ago, FlyingInACessna said:

That’s great and all. I’m really just trying to understand the nuisances that are making the sim so bad for you. Aside from some release date bugs and a few minor mistakes (lack of accurate taxiways, etc.), everything about this sim seems better than what we had before. Is it a complete replacement yet? Not without the essential 3rd party releases. But is it the best base sim we have so far? I think so by a long shot.

I’m still curious about specifics. We’ve gone back and forth each time, and you just keep saying “it’s not the right sim for me.” That’s fine, and if that’s the case you have no real reason to still be posting here. 

I think it matters from where you came from. If it was FSX or P3D, yes of course it's a big leap and there's no going back.

If you came from XP11 however, yes scenery and weather are really sexy, but the rest feels like a step back, and so much more gamey.

Edited August 20, 20205 yr by Colonel X

1 minute ago, Colonel X said:

I think it matters from where you came from. If it was FSX or P3D, yes of course it's a big leap and there's no going back.

If you came from XP11 however, yes scenery and weather are really sexy, but the rest feels like a step back, and so much more gamey.

I came from XP11 and although the GUI is built more like it is for modern games, I disagree that it makes the sim more gamey.

By gamey I primarily meant the controls. Without tuning them (and that doesn't work well, there's a topic about that), a small bird like a 152 controls just like in GTA, and I think that is intentional. I pulled the stick and boom I was 200ft in the air kind of stuff.