4 hours ago, Ricardo41 said:

Mmmmm, maybe the guy is just not a very good pilot. He admits himself that "he's too fast on the approach".

You're honestly going to say Steve-O isn't a good pilot? Wow. That is quite a statement. Honestly, as a pilot myself, that's possibly the single most ridiculous thing I've ever read.

23 hours ago, ThomseN_inc said:

I have the same issue everytime i am @FLC and the wind changes in direction/speed. Its a constant wobbling and bobbling.The TBM seems very unstable at the moment.

 

6 hours ago, ThomseN_inc said:

Honestly...why can't people who don't wan't to help or contribute to the OP just stay away? Don't you have better things to do?

Hey, my suggestion in this case would be to set the weather to clear/no wind and try the same thing, even if it means doing it in visual conditions. A strong wind shear can most certainly cause an attitude upset. Does the plane settle after a bit? Or just keeps rocking about?

1 minute ago, mtr75 said:

 

Hey, my suggestion in this case would be to set the weather to clear/no wind and try the same thing, even if it means doing it in visual conditions. A strong wind shear can most certainly cause an attitude upset. Does the plane settle after a bit? Or just keeps rocking about?

Did that. It's more a slow oscillation around the GS. Like it's overcompensating due to a slow reaction. I have solved the bobbing and rocking by lowering the effectiveness of the elevator.

1 minute ago, ThomseN_inc said:

Did that. It's more a slow oscillation around the GS. Like it's overcompensating due to a slow reaction. I have solved the bobbing and rocking by lowering the effectiveness of the elevator.

Had you changed the elevator setting prior to initially encountering the problem? And you're seeing this slow oscillation with literally no wind?

1 minute ago, mtr75 said:

Had you changed the elevator setting prior to initially encountering the problem? And you're seeing this slow oscillation with literally no wind?

No i haven't touched anything before. Wind was set to 0 (deleted all wind layers).

To me it looks like the AP is simply reacting too slow to correct GS deviations and then tends to overreact.

On 10/20/2020 at 5:02 PM, ThomseN_inc said:

I have the same issue everytime i am @FLC and the wind changes in direction/speed. Its a constant wobbling and bobbling.The TBM seems very unstable at the moment.

Same here. I get the bobbing up and down with FLC function. It goes away if I use VS instead. 

For me that issue began not with the latest update, but the one before that.

4 minutes ago, Republic3D said:

For me that issue began not with the latest update, but the one before that.

Exactly! It feels like flying a paperplane at the moment... 😕

11 minutes ago, Republic3D said:

Same here. I get the bobbing up and down with FLC function. It goes away if I use VS instead. 

For me that issue began not with the latest update, but the one before that.

Note:

Quote

A lot of autopilots (especially older ones) tend to oscillate around the target airspeed and constantly pitch up and down while trying to fly a specific airspeed. For this reason (keeping in mind that passenger comfort could be an issue) many people avoid speed modes, especially at higher altitudes.

Quote

One reason that I personally prefer V/S over level change in certain circumstances is that the latter tends to be fairly aggressive about maintaining speed, so in gusty conditions the autopilot (in level change) will end up pushing & pulling quite a bit to hold the speed +/- a knot or two. I think that tends to be an uncomfortable ride, so I'll go to V/S and let the speed fluctuate (the autothrottles can chase it, or I deselect them & just leave a stable power setting) while the pitch attitude stays constant.

At some point, you go back to a speed mode (i.e. once you level off), but for the stable pitch instead of constant push/pull/push/pull, V/S has its advantages.

https://aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/107/flight-level-change-or-vertical-speed-when-to-use-it

I suspect (and have suspected from the beginning) that a lot of this is from pushing buttons and not really knowing what's going on with the airplane. And that's not a dig at anyone, it's just my opinion. I'm a pilot, and I don't bother flying airplanes in the sim that I know I just don't have the knowledge to fly properly, which for me eliminates turbines generally and also anything with a super-advanced glass cockpit and autopilot.

13 minutes ago, mtr75 said:

A lot of autopilots (especially older ones) tend to oscillate around the target airspeed and constantly pitch up and down while trying to fly a specific airspeed. For this reason (keeping in mind that passenger comfort could be an issue) many people avoid speed modes, especially at higher altitudes.

That might be true for RL Planes but i doubt it is an inbuilt realism feature of MSFS. So i assume it's just a lets call it flaw.

 

14 minutes ago, mtr75 said:

I suspect (and have suspected from the beginning) that a lot of this is from pushing buttons and not really knowing what's going on with the airplane. And that's not a dig at anyone, it's just my opinion. I'm a pilot, and I don't bother flying airplanes in the sim that I know I just don't have the knowledge to fly properly, which for me eliminates turbines generally and also anything with a super-advanced glass cockpit and autopilot.

Might also be true. But doesn't apply to me. I got my license many many years ago at the age of 17. I for myself trust my knowledge about whats goiong on with the plane in different situations. My problem is related to MSFS own flightmodel/AP. Maybe it's just a setup thing, maybe not. We'll see...

12 minutes ago, ThomseN_inc said:

Might also be true. But doesn't apply to me. I got my license many many years ago at the age of 17. I for myself trust my knowledge about whats goiong on with the plane in different situations. My problem is related to MSFS own flightmodel/AP. Maybe it's just a setup thing, maybe not. We'll see...

Given that this is a known issue with FLC and that the solution is using VS mode - and that this is exactly what you're seeing in the game - I tend to disagree.

One thing you could do is note the VS during a descent using FLC when you're getting oscillations, then recreate that descent using the same VS using VS mode instead and see if you get the same oscillation. My guess is you won't. And that, to me, would answer the question.

6 minutes ago, mtr75 said:

Given that this is a known issue with FLC and that the solution is using VS mode - and that this is exactly what you're seeing in the game - I tend to disagree.

One thing you could do is note the VS during a descent using FLC when you're getting oscillations, then recreate that descent using the same VS using VS mode instead and see if you get the same oscillation. My guess is you won't. And that, to me, would answer the question.

Of course VS will be stable. AP just has to keep the VS. FLC aims to compensate gusts/wind/load factors etc. changes in order to keep the selected speed. Since especially windchanges can be very abrupt and agressive in MSFS it leads to FLC going haywire. Interesting though i didn't have those issues before one of the recent updates.

Edited October 21, 20205 yr by ThomseN_inc

1 hour ago, mtr75 said:

Note:

https://aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/107/flight-level-change-or-vertical-speed-when-to-use-it

I suspect (and have suspected from the beginning) that a lot of this is from pushing buttons and not really knowing what's going on with the airplane. And that's not a dig at anyone, it's just my opinion. I'm a pilot, and I don't bother flying airplanes in the sim that I know I just don't have the knowledge to fly properly, which for me eliminates turbines generally and also anything with a super-advanced glass cockpit and autopilot.

Thanks for the input. 

But this happens at a low altitude and at any speed. And to such a degree that any pax or crew member would smack their heads in the ceiling if not buckled up. Any loose item would fly around the cabin. In perfect calm weather. Also, this did not happen before the 2nd patch. I'm not a pilot as yourself, but I've been simming for 30 years and I've never seen this behavior in any plane, real or virtual. 

 

7 minutes ago, Republic3D said:

But this happens at a low altitude and at any speed. And to such a degree that any pax or crew member would smack their heads in the ceiling if not buckled up. Any loose item would fly around the cabin. In perfect calm weather. Also, this did not happen before the 2nd patch. I'm not a pilot as yourself, but I've been simming for 30 years and I've never seen this behavior in any plane, real or virtual. 

Not to mention the instant pitch up input when FLC is activated!

For the nitpickers: Yes, FLC is activated AFTER trimming the plane for a certain speed!

1 hour ago, ThomseN_inc said:

That might be true for RL Planes but i doubt it is an inbuilt realism feature of MSFS. So i assume it's just a lets call it flaw.

If it operates like the real thing, how exactly is it a flaw? 

7 minutes ago, devgrp said:

If it operates like the real thing, how exactly is it a flaw? 

Because i am sure this behaviour in MSFS is not intentional.