1 minute ago, marsman2020 said:

Honeycomb is not providing adequate support for their customers, plain and simple.

The issue that we are experiencing is not limited to Honeycomb. Now if Honeycomb wants to provide a workaround that certainly would be appreciated by their customers.  But ultimately, ASOBO needs to address in the coding of MSFS to handle on-on state buttons. And @fppilot it is broken. It has been explained multiple times in great detail here, on the official forums, in bug reports to ASOBO, and on YouTube. 

17 minutes ago, fppilot said:

Company and product names please so we can research customer reviews, complaints, and responses, both positive and negative?  Please?

I am totally enjoying my Alpha and Bravo.  Proof statement:

(please share yours)

 

What workarounds are you using as I have the same set up as you and without vJoy and Gremlin I certainly have the acceleration bug affecting any FS2020 function that has acceleration applying to the in game dial or button? 

5 minutes ago, marsman2020 said:

They sell the product, they claim it's "100% compatible" with MSFS,

I have not seen that statement, and you would likely be clearly aware that a claim like that, dependent on a another party and it's always developing simulation, would like most other 100% statements in history be flawed.  And as a customer/user someone like you, with what you have represented about yourself, should be well aware anyway of the pitfalls of such a 100% claim.

Ask those at for instance Workingtitle and other mod developers about experience with an everchanging, ever-emerging product as MSFS.  Every update seems to be requiring countermeasures.  

4 minutes ago, snglecoil said:

The issue that we are experiencing is not limited to Honeycomb. Now if Honeycomb wants to provide a workaround that certainly would be appreciated by their customers.  But ultimately, ASOBO needs to address in the coding of MSFS to handle on-on state buttons. And @fppilot it is broken. It has been explained multiple times in great detail here, on the official forums, in bug reports to ASOBO, and on YouTube. 

+1²

In all honesty the tuning increment is not present with the Bravo in FSX SE, which I have set up. The Bravo tunes there in 1° increments.  But much like the Saitek Multipanel, tuning at 1° increments means tuning with the knob is very slow, and like with the Saitek Multipanel I find myself instead tuning with the mouse, in FSX SE, at 1° increments much more quickly than with the Saitek tuning knob.  I find the Bravo much the same.  There is no difference in that regard between the two products.  The only advantage for me with using the knob and most other functions of the Saitek Multipanel was to compensate for the lower center console placement of the autopilot in models like the Carenado C90B and C421.  Other than those two models I used my mouse in the VC's instead.
 

Edited January 9, 20215 yr by fppilot

As someone pointed out to me before it's just as simple as writing a SimConnect solution for assigning controller buttons 

This should be Asobo's responsibility not Honeycomb.  Otherwise the solution is only for Honeycomb controller users and not for other controller users.

The guy developing Axis & Ohs is going down the SimConnect path and he's made some great progress but surely the Asobo team would have the human recourses and sim knowledge to knock up a SimConnect solution quickly, even if it's an external addon that's not used in the games controller menus 

4 minutes ago, Stona said:

This should be Asobo's responsibility not Honeycomb.  Otherwise the solution is only for Honeycomb controller users and not for other controller users.

99.99999% agreement.  I choose not to contradict my objection to 100% statements as mentioned above in this topic.

$%^&&*&*^&^%$@@$%%^&**(
I just realized I could have used this time to dial in my Bravo for MSFS.  So I too must be becoming _______  (fill in the blank)

Edited January 9, 20215 yr by fppilot

4 minutes ago, fppilot said:

99.99999% agreement.  I choose not to contradict my objection to 100% statements as mentioned above in this topic.

$%^&&*&*^&^%$@@$%%^&**(
I just realized I could have used this time to dial in my Bravo for MSFS.  So I too must be becoming _______  (fill in the blank)

Ha ha I've got my Alpha and Bravo dialled in perfectly so I could have been using this time to be flying... all though I've been doing a little to much of that for the last few days since i got my Bravo LOL

3 minutes ago, Stona said:

Ha ha I've got my Alpha and Bravo dialled in perfectly so I could have been using this time to be flying... all though I've been doing a little to much of that for the last few days since i got my Bravo LOL

Might reach out to you if I encounter glitches when dialing in for MSFS.  Did you have any residual overlap with a previous controller to contend with?

7 minutes ago, Stona said:

Ha ha I've got my Alpha and Bravo dialled in perfectly so I could have been using this time to be flying... all though I've been doing a little to much of that for the last few days since i got my Bravo LOL

Have you watched youtube videos from IRL pilots like 310 pilot and baron pilot showing the extent of what happens with their aircraft systems, engines, and avionics upgrades?  We are so fortunate to deal with only the simulator side of such upgrades...  Much less time lost and incredibly less cost.  I have a right-seat ride along experience coming up, hopefully in early February, in a 310 that is currently being upgraded to up to date Avidyne avionics.  I have done approx 35 hours of right seat ride along time in that 310, previously equipped with a Garmin GNS530.  Will be a totally new experience....  Total of six weeks out of service.  Some of the delay due to product availability, some due to delays in service scheduling.  Both due to multiple Covid-19 related issues affecting production associates.  The product availability due to Covid 19 as well as backlog of TCAS compliant equipment fullfillment.

We are so fortunate in this simulation endeavor.......

I’ve just started commercial multi training in an A55 Baron with a G500. Honesty that’s part of my frustration with MSFS right now. So much of multi training is drilling procedures. And at $485/hr for the plane and instructor, I’ll gladly drill away in a home sim with good hardware if that saves actual time in the plane. Unfortunately 1) my Bravo isn’t estimated to ship until early February...after my check ride, and 2) I’d really just like this stuff to work without having to spend hours setting up work arounds. I love MSFS and would prefer to use it...but back to X plane for the time being.

46 minutes ago, fppilot said:

Might reach out to you if I encounter glitches when dialing in for MSFS.  Did you have any residual overlap with a previous controller to contend with?

Yeah sure

Prior to getting my Bravo I was using the Alpha with my siatek throttle

You just gotta make sure that you don't accidently assign the same button in the sim controller profile to the one you use in your Joystick Gremlin macros to fire off a vJoy button that you map in the sims vJoy profile

I created a spreadsheet to keep track of everything I was doing and that proved to be very valuable whilst setting up the ingame profiles

So FS2020 I currently have a single profile for the Alpha Yoke, multiple profiles for the Bravo Throttle Quadrant due to the different engi4ne management axis's for the different classes of aircraft and just a single vJoy profile.

I've only created Joystick Gremlin macros to fire of vJoy for the controller rocker switches and rotary switch on each device but assign the axis's and normal buttons on both controllers to the actual game controller profiles

Even though the Start position on the Alpha and the throttle indents are permanently on switches it's ok to assign leave them in the alpha and bravo controller profile in the sim because they only stay on for a short while when starting the plane and landing before and then you move them back out of their "always on" position; You just gotta remember to move them out of their position when using them, I got caught out yesterday when I forgot to switch back from the Start position to Both when starting the engine so I had a switch permanently engaged when flying and of course it cause the acceleration bug but as soon as I turn the dial from Start back to Both the bug disappeared

The tricky part was working out the Auto pilot on the Bravo which has to be done using JoyStick Gremlin's "condition" action.

Took me ages to get my head around it but now that I have it's easy (albeit a little time consuming) to use and gives you tons of flexibility and customisation. But in saying that I can see a proper SimConnect solution with a nice user interface would be the best

I've posted my solution <<HERE>>

Edited January 9, 20215 yr by Stona

1 minute ago, snglecoil said:

I’ve just started commercial multi training in an A55 Baron with a G500. Honesty that’s part of my frustration with MSFS right now. So much of multi training is drilling procedures. And at $485/hr for the plane and instructor, I’ll gladly drill away in a home sim with good hardware if that saves actual time in the plane. Unfortunately 1) my Bravo isn’t estimated to ship until early February...after my check ride, and 2) I’d really just like this stuff to work without having to spend hours setting up work arounds. I love MSFS and would prefer to use it...but back to X plane for the time being.

I fly a real time real weather calendar based GA flight schedule and thus must rely on avionics and the related interfaces between the avionics and control devices.  That said, with each transition over the past 38 years the transition to new control devices has provided customization challenges.  CH and FS9 to FSX and Saitek, and now from Saitek to Honeycomb.  Now if it were not for every five to six years it would be easy....  But it is new, fresh, and clutter from previous devices needed to be wiped for this combination to become dialed in.

Like most things in life, gain requires effort.

6 hours ago, fppilot said:

In all honesty the tuning increment is not present with the Bravo in FSX SE, which I have set up. The Bravo tunes there in 1° increments.

Hello Frank. Two things. First, although you generally won't see it by default, my experiments show that you can make it fail in FSX-SE easily. I think this is also illustrative of where the real problem lies. So, if I plug in my Logitech 3D joystick, accepting default mappings, I get 10-degree increments on all the instruments and trims if I simply hold down the trigger switch. This switch is mapped to brakes b ydefault, and for some reason the default mapping has auto-repeat set to maximum. If I remove the auto-repeat, my increments go to 1 degree. This demonstrates two things - that the problem is latent in FSX-SE, and that it relates in some way to auto-repeating button mappings. It also seems to confirm that MSFS shares some code with FSX. (This, BTW, isn't necessarily a bad thing, since legacy code is generally going to be more reliable than new code.) I presume you could make the same happen with your Bravo quad by simply mapping one or more of the toggle switches to some function and turning on auto-repeat for that switch. The big difference is you have the option, which means this generally wasn't a problem in FSX.

The second thing is that tuning in FSX-SE appears to have the same acceleration feature for the HDG bug and OBS (and I presume everything else) as it does in MSFS. This means that clicking faster with the mouse incrementally speeds up the bug. Likewise, I presume that spinning the mouse wheel faster has the same effect (as in MSFS), and that mapping a bug to a rotary encoder control will in principle allow more convenient tuning because that will also accelerate if you spin the knob faster. You can try this out by mapping the HDG bug to your elevator trim wheel or to the right-most autopilot encoder wheel. I have found, though, that in MSFS spinning a rotary knob generally doesn't make best use of the acceleration feature and so isn't as convenient as it should be, I think this is because the acceleration lags for about half a second after you start spinning the knob, and resets when you stop. In practice, when spinning a knob fast you tend to do it in short bursts, which isn't very effective.

In the end I don't really care who is ultimately responsible for the bug. Honeycomb sells products that do not fully function with the #1 platform they sell into. As they cannot control what MS/Asobo do, they should be doing all they can to get those issues resolved just as Logitech and others should be doing if their products are impacted by this. Many products provide their own solutions to known bugs in the bigger platform. 

I applaud products like FSUIPC, but it's like needing to learn to fly the space shuttle to get your morning coffee from the coffee shop around the corner. We, as customers, just want this stuff to work as intended.

Where I do feel Honeycomb could dramatically improve is in actually laying out the situation here. What are they doing to work on this? So far as I've seen the only answer is the unhelpful, "we are MS partners". Great. Tell us how that access is getting this addressed so that I don't have to spend hours figuring out how to get a joystick to work in my flight sim. In the end, from the consumer's perspective, both companies are culpable. 

It's so depressing to plug in a $250 peripheral and find that X number of things just don't work in the biggest platform out there today. Yeah, Asobo needs to rewrite their peripheral code, but it's also clear there are ways to get this to work and those should be provided by Honeycomb (and others). 

Edited January 9, 20215 yr by Agrajag

51 minutes ago, Agrajag said:

I've seen the only answer is the unhelpful, "we are MS partners".

I sense there may be some licensing or written agreement issues behind the scenes and product developers may need levels of cooperation from MS/
Asobo to bring their products forward. Or to gain optimum implementation.  And that may not be happening at the pace that either the developers or end users would like. And we have seen ourselves how slow Asobo has been to move ahead in some areas, and how updates in some cases are causing glitches where glitches did not previously exist.

I have not started my Bravo implementation into MSFS yet.  I have spent my time so far setting it up in FSX SE as that is where I continue to do my more serious flying.  That to stay on my flight schedule.  Correct me if I am wrong but it appears to me the MSFS settings will all be set from within MSFS and reside within MSFS. In that respect Honeycomb and other device developers are reliant on MS/Asobo. Laying this heavily at the feet of Honeycomb is to me akin to someone badgering a company like RXP about gauge implementation into an aircraft panel when it would require modification by RXP of the aircraft model developer's code.  I have seen that happen multiple times.

I note quite clearly that a barrier of such sort is badly hampering companies like RXP and HiFi from bringing their products to us for MSFS.  They just cannot get it done without cooperation, and that has not been forthcoming as of this date.