Kodiak vs Cessna 208B Grand Caravan EX Improvement Mod

[Bobsk8 12,879]

6 minutes ago, DeepestRed said:

 

 

For anyone who might be confused, what I think Bob is saying here is that he has hundreds of virtual hours in a plane that he has never put his butt in in real life, but by virtue of his vast experience with simulated planes over the years he can tell you that this particular virtual Kodiak is a perfect implementation of the real thing because it "feels" real.   Furthermore, because of that self-evident perfection there is no need to even try any modification to it, as such a mod would be inherently flawed by simple virtue of its desire to alter that perfection and anyone using it would be wasting their time.

It's pretty straightforward, I think.   What I haven't yet figured out is how this comports with the developers' own statement that a) there was a bug in the original model that had to be fixed, and b) there are further fixes coming, including some along the lines of what's already present in the mod on the official forum.  All I can figure is the developer must have a tragic misunderstanding, as Bob says its flawless.  Someone should stop them before they break it and become as worthy of scorn as that mod that there's no point in anyone trying.  🙃

I leave it to the developer of the Kodiak to tweak the way the Kodiak flies. So far he has done a pretty good job with the Kodiak.  He even has input from the Kodiak Company to advise him. 

The person that did the mod, what aircraft has he ever  developed?

Edited January 20, 2022 by Bobsk8

[fppilot 4,407]

Sometimes I wish there was a method to do a true "blind taste test" so to speak.  i.e. have combatants fly both versions as unknown which time is which, and then identify which flight was with which....

I have a two hour flight to complete in the RYT Bonanza this afternoon, then I will log an hour or so in the Kodiak, and an hour of so in the mod'd Kodiak in the same conditions.

Edited January 20, 2022 by fppilot

[jpe828 624]

22 hours ago, liamp51 said:

Sounds like it corrects some of the issues with the current FM. I'm going to give it a shot. 

I think it is fantastic. It feels much more realistic to me... as a pilot IRL it just flies more believable to me. Less twitchy. 

[flyinpilot212121 724]

1 hour ago, fppilot said:

Sometimes I wish there was a method to do a true "blind taste test" so to speak.  i.e. have combatants fly both versions as unknown which time is which, and then identify which flight was with which....

I have a two hour flight to complete in the RYT Bonanza this afternoon, then I will log an hour or so in the Kodiak, and an hour of so in the mod'd Kodiak in the same conditions.

Let us know if you notice a difference between your 2 Kodiak flights!

[DeepestRed 214]

4 hours ago, fppilot said:

Sometimes I wish there was a method to do a true "blind taste test" so to speak.  i.e. have combatants fly both versions as unknown which time is which, and then identify which flight was with which

There would be, if the changes were entirely non-visual, but it would rely on trust in two directions:  you'd need to have a moderator who could provide "Version A" and "Version B" with the serial numbers scrubbed off without messing with either, and testers who would be on their honor, and could be trusted, to not try to examine the packages they were given to determine which is which.

The data-driven rationalist in me is actually intrigued by this idea, and now I want to see if I can think of a somewhat automated way to make this work as close to zero-trust as possible.    Because I'm 100% with you:   without something like that, these arguments are only slightly less pointless than spitting in the wind.

Edited January 20, 2022 by DeepestRed

[Stearmandriver 2,333]

Picked up the Kodiak tonight, and did quite a few patterns around Port Moresby to get a feel for her and tune my controls before making many hops through the jungle strips along the Kokoda track.  Beautiful aircraft with many well-thought-out features and little touches that make the experience feel richer.

I'm looking forward to trying the flight model mod tomorrow. 

I've never flown a Kodiak, but I have quite a bit of real world time in Caravans, and I think it's fair to assume some similarities in behavior.  The persistent annoyance I had with the Kodiak in the sim tonight is that the darn thing wouldn't come down!  Full flaps, prop full forward, idle power... and I was gliding down at 70kts and 400 ft/min.

I cannot believe that even approximates reality. 

In the Caravan when flying jumpers, we'd go idle and full flaps and have to point the nose down 15-20 degrees to maintain 65kts.  We could reliably beat the tandems down, and some of the solos.  When flying freight, we'd routinely carry a bunch of power and fly the approach at 90-100kts.  When you pulled the power to idle at the threshold and you heard that big prop swing flat, you were thrown into your harnesses like it was an arrested landing.

That big prop creates a ton of drag when flat.  It's the same engine and prop on the Kodiak (a lighter plane).  The Kodiak's flaps also look bigger and more slotted than the Caravan's.

I'm not meaning to knock the Kodiak model, really. They've got a great project here, I know they're not done tweaking it, and in its present state it's well worth the purchase. 

But I'm gonna try that mod tomorrow.  😉

[mrueedi 702]

21 hours ago, fppilot said:

Sometimes I wish there was a method to do a true "blind taste test" so to speak. i.e. have combatants fly both versions as unknown which time is which, and then identify which flight was with which....

You could record both flights with FlightRecorder from fligthsim.to, provide the recorded files to other users who replay the files with a "neutral" 3rd aircraft type (preferably a similar one).

Edited January 21, 2022 by mrueedi

[Ixoye 1,841]

I probably belong to a minority, but I actually like the Caravan better, Kodiak is fine, but the taxi speed is insane and very irritating having to control it with reversed thrust, then I experience it as very sensitive on the controls, hopefully it will get better with some tweaking, but I've put it in the hangar in the meantime.

Edited January 21, 2022 by Ixoye

[flyinpilot212121 724]

19 minutes ago, Ixoye said:

I probably belong to a minority, but I actually like the Caravan better, Kodiak is fine, but the taxi speed is insane and very irritating having to control it with reversed thrust, then I experience it as very sensitive on the controls, hopefully it will get better with some tweaking, but I've put it in the hangar in the meantime.

I don’t own it, but curious if you tried it with the mod?

[Ixoye 1,841]

55 minutes ago, flyinpilot212121 said:

I don’t own it, but curious if you tried it with the mod?

Only for a short flight, but I didn't notice any major difference.

[Bert Pieke 7,592]

2 hours ago, Ixoye said:

Kodiak is fine, but the taxi speed is insane

Have you tried taxiing with Low Idle selected, as in the real aircraft?

[Bobsk8 12,879]

3 minutes ago, Bert Pieke said:

Have you tried taxiing with Low Idle selected, as in the real aircraft?

Taxi speed in low idle, is still a bit fast, but a tap on the brakes once in awhile keeps it in check. The reverse thrust in MSFS is not as smooth as it would be in real life, where you can apply just a bit of it to control speed, so it really doesn't work well for that. I just use low idle and brake tapping and stay around 15 knots which is passable. 

 

I did several takeoffs by the way, this morning, and I have been reading the posts about people complaining that they can't keep the aircraft on the runway during takeoff. I normally slowly accelerate from the start, till rotation and can hold it on the centerline. Now If I slam the throttle forward, that is when I notice it pulling off the centerline, even with rudder corrections. Just a nice smooth takeoff roll, and takeoffs should be a breeze providing you have about 5 clicks of right trim in. Like my CFI told me many years ago, "fly it smoothly"..

Edited January 21, 2022 by Bobsk8

[Ixoye 1,841]

21 minutes ago, Bert Pieke said:

Have you tried taxiing with Low Idle selected, as in the real aircraft?

Yes I've done that, but the aircraft taxi at 45kts if I not stop it in time, I have now set up an axis for brakes on my TM Warthog throttle so I can apply little brakes smoothly enough to handle the beast, with is difficult to manage with my toe brakes without it getting jerky, this aircraft have to much thrust at idle imo, maybe it's realistic, but definitely not fun to handle.

Edited January 21, 2022 by Ixoye

[Bobsk8 12,879]

1 minute ago, Ixoye said:

Yes I do that, but the aircraft taxi at 45kts if I not stop it in time, I have now set up an axis for brakes on my TM Warthog throttle so I can apply little brakes smoothly enough to handle the beast, with is difficult to manage with my toe brakes without it getting jerky, this aircraft have to much thrust at idle imo, maybe it's realistic, but definitely not fun to handle.

Something wrong with your toe brake setup then. Should get very smooth braking....

[Ixoye 1,841]

10 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

Something wrong with your toe brake setup then. Should get very smooth braking....

Nothing is wrong with my toe brakes, but it's easier to apply about 5-10% brakes with a handle on my Hotas than hold the same pressure with my feet and steer the aircraft at the same time, but the best solution would be if I could reduce the thrust at idle by modifying some value in a file, but I unfortunately do not have that knowledge.

Edited January 21, 2022 by Ixoye