Now, that its settled that this thread is mis-named, for those interested in DX10, you might want to try the World in Conflict Beta http://www.worldinconflict.com/beta/(not that much time remaining, though... till the end of the month)The previous games supporting DX10 don't seem to offer much of an improvement (I've tried the Company of Heroes DX10 patch myself, and the visual improvements definetly didn't justify the fps hit). But WiC looks to me to be the first game to really use DX10 effectively. Switching between DX9 and DX10, the effects are very noticeable and DX10 doesn't take much of an fps hit at all from DX9. The volumetric clouds/smoke are particularily cool. It's amazing what a difference it makes. I hope it looks as good in the FSX patch-- while I think its pretty clear the patch will have volumetric clouds, I sure hope fog is included in that so we can finally lose FS's cheesy-looking fog plane.

I believe that we have to seriously look at indicators. Corporations are no longer paternalistic. Quarterly reports rule. If a company sees a market niche they will move to it while making the cost-benefit analysis on existing customer participation. It is not complaining, whining, or even finding fault when you question a possible commercial agenda that may be detrimental to your goals as a CUSTOMER. If you buy a product from a one-person outfit and that firm later moves its attention to some new product line, wouldn't you be concerned about the support and promises that were made about the product you purchased? The market place continues to need "buyer beware" vigilance. It also needs a new element - buyer be alert. With the faster pace of the marketplace, due to the Internet, changes can occur and plans are finalized before the customer base has a chance to offer input. Thus you need to look for indicators that may be counter to your needs.Regards,Dick BoleyA PC, an LCD, speakers, CH yoke

Sounds good to me!B

How many copies of FS do you think microsoft will sell if they added, for example, SIDS to ATC and just added cloud shawdows in their next version of FS? I hate to say it, but I think Flight Sim is getting very mature. With each new version, there are less and less features left to add to the simulator. There is less and less compelling reason for most people to upgrade! So to spend any resources on such little detailed items and on nothing else will definitely kill the franchise.So if the arcade aspect of the flight sim will generate enough revenue to continue the franchise let it be and be glad for it. You will not get any improvements at all if Microsoft shelved FS!!

Phil - Some of us, myself included, have been around MSFS since FS2 and the CompuServe days. It does, indeed, seem that the focus has changed from flight simming, as we've known it for 25 years, to a more arcade-type of environment. Eye-candy now takes precedent over flight dynamics and procedure. Expansion of the franchise to the wider gaming community seems to have taken precedence over expansion of the functionality of the sim itself. I doubt that there is anything one can say or do to change the perspective/peception of many of us "old timers". I was once a most avid simmer. But, given the situation with FSX, I've moved on to other things and use MSFS now only occasionally. There are many things I'd like to have seen included in the sim in the area of flight-related functionality (improved ATC, improved flight planning, improved cockpit functionality, non-GPS related moving map capabilities, better default aircraft, etc) but it's clear now that these things are not likely to happen without a drastic change in what I perceive as the direction of the franchise. It may be the proper marketing move but, from the viewpoint of a long-time simmer, I think you've gone the wrong direction with Acceleration.Doug

Doug,I agree. But if MS moves away from the simulator arena, this would open up fore some other party, wouldn't it.Ulf B :-)

>cheesy-looking fog plane.It's simple the whining will always be here (I always skip it...) DX10 will probably blow you all away in every aspect because it's the future as with DX8/DX9/DX10 not the past.Believe me we will see some stunning effects in the DX10 field as for FSX I don't know but I guess it will be too :-)I for one I'm always curious to new developments and the future glad I left that building place filling computer behind and it was so slow or that horse instead of my car or good old dos with that monochrome screen and some lines...Happy they make the FS series even more appealing to broader audience the more development resource they probably get :-)I see still the main Flightsim core as an add on platform for 3d party software and I think they did a #### of job at ACES :-)We have still a long way to go dream / imagine if we have something like the real world counterpart in every aspect ;-)I drink :-beerchug on the future... Have fun guys, Andr

It's just an add-on. Expands on the "normal" usage by adding other avenues of flight, nothing more nothing less, why so paranoid that they watering it down? FSX has the best flight modelling out of all the version and most potential yet to model any aspect of aviation including the non-standard air racing, search and rescue, military and so on and so on.They release an add-on with new aircraft and features including missions and air racing and all of a sudden they're shifting the main focus of the sim to an arcade game......man, how paranoid is that despite Phil's comments to dispel that myth? Ian.

Thank you for restoring my hope in the future...I'll second everything Andre just said.Ian.

Oh...please!I just find it funny how someone can take a post, on another forum, and after miss-categorizing it, turn it into some kind of a conspiracy!FS is just a "game", no matter how much we (the addicts) elevate it into some kind of a serious program, it still remains an entertainment product that we should just enjoy, instead of wringing our hands and envisioning some serious "life changing events" that MS may be contemplating!Pete S. ;-) :9

We can only hope so Ulf. A lack of competition is never a good thing. But, if MS is determined to continue the present course it may provide an impetus for someone to try (again) to break the monopoly. What we really need is another Richard Harvey with some significant financial backing. Given where things now are with FSX I think it might work this time.Doug

Umm...we have rotary aircraft, fixed wing aircraft propeller-driven, fixed wing aircraft turbo-prop, fixed wing aircraft turbine driven. Are not military aircraft extremely high performance aircraft that require huge amounts of skill to maneuver properly in close formation with another aicraft? Or even aerial refuelling with the close proximity to a much larger aircraft riding in its downdraft?I thought that was the whole point of Flight Simulator. To allow people the chance to experience all forms of aviation. To allow F/A-18 Hornets as an aircraft is no different than allowing the space shuttle as an aircraft. It is expanding the envelope of what customers who buy the expansion like.Nobody complained about the Vought F4/U corsair that was shipped with either FS2000 or FS2002 some years back or even the P-51D mustang or any other WWII aircraft. They are more than capable of killing someone. Yet did FSX turn out to be a combat flight simulator? I think not. Flight Simulator will more than likely continue to become a civilian flight simulation allowing its fanbase to experience the most varied dip into any aspect of aviation in a non-combat form of flight.They may, however release Combat Flight Simulator IV which may incorporate the FSX graphics/weather engine and allow other aircraft from FSX to be imported, but that would be the extent, just as CFS3 had the ability to import some of the FS2002 aircraft (with major modifications to the air file and config file).I see a few heavily outspoken people ranting and raving about how an F/A-18 in an expansion pack will lead to chaos and destruction in flight simulator. I see it as the inclusion of yet another phase of flight that was not previously available to users at the level that microsoft/ACES can deliver, but instead had to be developed via 3rd parties.

It is changing the focus of a flight *simulation* towards an arcade-style *game*.I doubt that many people in here are overly enthousatic about racing competitions, fighter jets and multiplayer racing. I don't get what that has anything to do with a simulation. I believe MS has covered that market with Combat Flight Sim.As I said in an earlier thread, I would have much rather an expansion that addresses the current shortcomings of FSX, like an improved ATC and a better flight planner, a moving map, new instruments, new views. Missions? Most people fly a mission once. How about including real-live traffic? More/better AI? Maybe a program to capture head movements with a webcam?It seems to be the general direction that serious simulation games with a tradition that stretches for decades and with huge following are going to be "dumbed-down" to be more appealing to reach a broader market - yet it has been the hard-core flight simulator fans who have been religiously buying every single release for years and made the FS franchise a success.I am certainly not interested in a "Red Bull"-like racing competition or flying fighter jets and I think that most flight simmer just shake their heads in disbelieve, fearing FS on XBox with a 4-button controller.I would be interested in a "as real as it gets approach". It seems that MS/Aces has lost the primary focus of a simulation.Best regards,Pat

The Fokker triplane was "built to kill people and be very capable of creating violence." Just ask the Red Baron.Doesn't mean I don't want it in my sim.Pretty much every aviation enhancement for the last 100 years is the result of military technology that has trickled down into civilian aviation.What I see in the Acceleration! marketing is very cool, very accurate simulation of the wicked-fast growing aviation sport called Air Racing, along with a nice set of 20 new missions which allow people to experience an accurate simulation of real-life flying situations (both fixed and rotor).Arcade? I just don't really see that.Simulated flying isn't just about flying a scheduled route from Denver to Milwaukee Regional - utilizing every checklist. That's certainly important, and many add-on developers specialize in providing that kind of sim experience if that's your thing.I always wanted more out of FS ... and FSX delivered it.There is no better engine to simulate these experiences than Microsoft Flight Simulator ... and I've tried them all.But this sim is also about showing people what it's like to be an Air Ambulance pilot ... or an Outback bush pilot ... or even, yes, a secret agent.I don't know about you, but Milwaukee Regional gets a bit stale after 10 or 20 landings.

I agree.73,Dick Boley N3HKNA PC, an LCD, speakers, CH yoke