34 minutes ago, ca_metal said:

My guess is, they don't want to finish off 2020 while it's still thriving. It would be bad for them and also for the third parties.

Well if what they say is true about add-on compatibility, it wouldn't be much of an issue for third parties, especially in the context of something like a closed alpha. If it were me, I'd keep the marketplace open in the alphas and give newcomers a reason to commit after the full release lol. Sim purchases would definitely slow down tho but at some point they will have to start building the hype. Overall I do agree that they don't need to keep to the same timelines.

1 minute ago, Krakin said:

Well if what they say is true about add-on compatibility, it wouldn't be much of an issue for third parties, especially in the context of something like a closed alpha. If it were me, I'd keep the marketplace open in the alphas and give newcomers a reason to commit after the full release lol. Sim purchases would definitely slow down tho but at some point they will have to start building the hype. Overall I do agree that they don't need to keep to the same timelines.

But it's not really about compatibility and transferability. Look, they already promised to keep MSFS 2020 as updated as possible, even after 2024 is released, but I've seen people saying they are killing 2020 before fixing it. I think they are avoiding promoting 2024 as much as they did with 2020 because they are afraid people might go into waiting mode. That affected other sims back in 2019/2020. It's important to show people 2020 isn't getting abandoned and they still care about it.

About the Alpha Insider, I would love to join it again, but I can see why it isn't that necessary this time around. ASOBO/MS might be focusing on 3rd parties feedback. I think it's better to focus 100% on the 3rd party devs' feedbacks than splitting their resources between users (simmers) and devs. 3rd party enviroment is stablished this time, they have an SDK to improve as much as possible before the release. 

That said, I'm eagerly waiting for new info when they are ready, including the new features showcases.

If 2024 still releases this year, then they've already passed the point of Alpha when compared to 2020.

I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't do an invite alpha, and only just a beta.

Edited March 4, 20242 yr by Tuskin38

2 hours ago, ca_metal said:

Look, they already promised to keep MSFS 2020 as updated as possible, even after 2024 is released, but I've seen people saying they are killing 2020 before fixing it.

Heck, I did say I noticed they're offloading more and more fixes and wish list features onto 2024. I guess that makes sense since the whole point of 2024 is giving us what the current 2020 engine cannot achieve. I'll be honest with you though, I don't think MS really cares in the grand scheme of things. Establishing add-on compatibility was far more important because it is the bridge that allows us to make the jump seamlessly and that affects their revenue stream. We've already seen that 70% of all of the participants in the last Navigraph survey have shown intentions to jump over to 2024. Most of the people concerned about continued support of 2020 are using it as an insurance policy in case 2024 ends up being terrible. If that doesn't turn out to be the case, people who still use 2020 are going to end up being a very small minority. I mean what's the point if 2024 runs, looks and flies better while allowing 99.999% of your current add-ons to work? I guess there will be a few people who won't want to spend another $60 or so lol.

While there are indeed people who are concerned about continued support of 2020, I do also see plenty of people who wonder why MS is going to bother with maintaining two sims and would prefer them to focus their resources on the new one. So I do agree that they might a little concerned about the revenue stream stalling in the short term but the optics surrounding their plans for 2020 in the future is not going to make or break their bank.

3 hours ago, Krakin said:

Heck, I did say I noticed they're offloading more and more fixes and wish list features onto 2024. I guess that makes sense since the whole point of 2024 is giving us what the current 2020 engine cannot achieve. I'll be honest with you though, I don't think MS really cares in the grand scheme of things. Establishing add-on compatibility was far more important because it is the bridge that allows us to make the jump seamlessly and that affects their revenue stream. We've already seen that 70% of all of the participants in the last Navigraph survey have shown intentions to jump over to 2024. Most of the people concerned about continued support of 2020 are using it as an insurance policy in case 2024 ends up being terrible. If that doesn't turn out to be the case, people who still use 2020 are going to end up being a very small minority. I mean what's the point if 2024 runs, looks and flies better while allowing 99.999% of your current add-ons to work? I guess there will be a few people who won't want to spend another $60 or so lol.

While there are indeed people who are concerned about continued support of 2020, I do also see plenty of people who wonder why MS is going to bother with maintaining two sims and would prefer them to focus their resources on the new one. So I do agree that they might a little concerned about the revenue stream stalling in the short term but the optics surrounding their plans for 2020 in the future is not going to make or break their bank.

When I say they need to ensure continued support isn't really about concerned simmers, but to keep people using 2020 (and of course buying on the marketplace) until they are ready for the transition. It's not really the time to keep the hype up. I don't have the numbers, but drying up marketplace sales for 6 months -  1 year would be a huge loss (I guess), not just for MS, but for the 3rd parties. Of course that's my assessment, I could be wrong.

And I'm pretty sure most (if not all of us) active users/simmers will transition in less than a year to the new sim. It's pretty much just a matter of keeping 2020 alive until the time comes. Also keeping late adopters happy until they are ready (they are also an extended user base if you consider they will still be able to buy new compatible add-ons). I know people still running FS9 (really late adopters LOL).

2 hours ago, ca_metal said:

When I say they need to ensure continued support isn't really about concerned simmers, but to keep people using 2020 (and of course buying on the marketplace) until they are ready for the transition. It's not really the time to keep the hype up. I don't have the numbers, but drying up marketplace sales for 6 months -  1 year would be a huge loss (I guess), not just for MS, but for the 3rd parties. Of course that's my assessment, I could be wrong.

We've already seen this happen in real time. Third party devs like A2A, Hype and FSReborn have seen record breaking sales since the announcement of 2024 and that's simply because MS have promised near universal compatibility of add-ons. MS could hype 2024 to the moon and back and it won't dry up sales on the marketplace because people will be thinking their add-ons are going work just fine in the awesome new sim. Remember, when 2024 was announced, the number one concern from the community was compatibility.

54 minutes ago, Krakin said:

We've already seen this happen in real time. Third party devs like A2A, Hype and FSReborn have seen record breaking sales since the announcement of 2024 and that's simply because MS have promised near universal compatibility of add-ons. MS could hype 2024 to the moon and back and it won't dry up sales on the marketplace because people will be thinking their add-ons are going work just fine in the awesome new sim. Remember, when 2024 was announced, the number one concern from the community was compatibility.

If the sales skyrocketed BECAUSE of the 2024 announcement then I stand corrected and I don't see why they aren't marketing it more. I don't have access to the numbers and also didn't see the devs talking about sales lately. By any chance do you have links where I can see their statements concerning sales? I think last time I saw sales metrics were about PMDG.

8 hours ago, ca_metal said:

If the sales skyrocketed BECAUSE of the 2024 announcement then I stand corrected and I don't see why they aren't marketing it more.

I think you're misunderstanding me. I was saying those devs got record sales IN SPITE of the 2024 announcement, not because of it and that is because concerns about add-ons not working on the next platform were put to rest so it was business as usual.

For A2A and FSReborn, I'm going by marketplace rankings and things the devs have said here and in other places. @simbol's FSR500 is already in the top 100 best sellers and I haven't seen any A2A product get as much hype as the Comanche for MSFS did so more of a guesstimate there. As for HPG, one of the devs told me directly that their latest release (the H160) outperformed all of their previous releases. I asked about it on a podcast on youtube.

 

 

2 hours ago, Krakin said:

I think you're misunderstanding me. I was saying those devs got record sales IN SPITE of the 2024 announcement, not because of it and that is because concerns about add-ons not working on the next platform were put to rest so it was business as usual.

For A2A and FSReborn, I'm going by marketplace rankings and things the devs have said here and in other places. @simbol's FSR500 is already in the top 100 best sellers and I haven't seen any A2A product get as much hype as the Comanche for MSFS did so more of a guesstimate there. As for HPG, one of the devs told me directly that their latest release (the H160) outperformed all of their previous releases. I asked about it on a podcast on youtube.

Ok, I got it now. In that case I think it would still be risky to start hyping up the new version. Just a hunch based on how simmers and also gamers deal with new versions coming, they usually put the current version to rest waiting for the new one to come (you will never see the other devs announcing their new sims much prior to the release, they will always wait until they are really close). My guess is, if they really start marketing it, it COULD dry up sales for a while. But anyways, this subject is offtopic here. I'm hoping they will start talking about it ASAP.

For whatever reasons they're holding back on giving more details about MSFS 2024 at present.. I suspect it is to maximize impact and reception, and also perhaps to not make the guffaw they made with the first trailer where it seemed like a missions pack or missions focused sim with no mentions of core improvements to the sim (even though that trailer was fit for that X-Box event it still basically was the first news of MSFS 2024 to the world).. then they actually divulged more of those details at FSExpo, which I sometimes feel like they didn't initially plan on doing but then had to, due to the trailer's reception. 

I really hope they do start the revelations and deep dives come Spring time, and perhaps MS is holding back Asobo until some big MS/XBox/gaming/other event around then. I think it's one or more of these reasons as opposed to them waiting till the last minute in order to not impact sales of v2020.

But ya, can't come soon enough.
 

Edited March 5, 20242 yr by lwt1971

1 hour ago, lwt1971 said:

as opposed to them waiting till the last minute in order to not impact sales of v2020.

Yup. MS could start a 2024 marketing blitz tomorrow and people will keep buying add-ons as long as they don't do a 180 on backwards compatibility. I actually think I spent the most money on add-on AFTER 2024's announcement since a lot of cool stuff came out afterwards and at great prices. I have money set aside for the Fenix A319/21 when they drop.