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Guest thx1137

Landing Analysis

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The one thing that FSX lacks lacks is the physical "feeling" of an actual landing. Even though some of my landings look good in theory, there are many times where I wonder was that a nice comfy soft landing or did that landing knock a few teeth out of my passengers.I was wondering if there is any program out there that would give you a complete analysis of your landings? I'm particularly interested in knowing if a landing was soft, hard, or even dangerous.Thank you.

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This is a good question. I kind of get the feeling that landings are subjective in FSX, partly due to the game factor (where it's not so much fun to plant your aircraft like a potato after a 12-hour flight), partly due to limitations of the flight dynamics (stuff like simulated braking power versus tire traction), and a big part that most people fly their desk. If you watch the animation of the flight as it comes in, the aircraft motion looks kind of fake, at least to my eyes. The path of motion doesn't quite look like it has enough natural curves to it, so that the aircraft appears to to me to travel on invisible rails. It's a little hard to describe. It's better in FSX, worse in FS9. The sim is doing a lot of calculations besides the point of touchdown, so I get the impression that some of the stuff you see is abstract within the sim.That being said, programs like Flight Deck Commander or FS2Crew will give you broad audio feedback on your landing ("Thanks for not killing us!" stands out in my mind).You might try FSFlying School, which will grade your entire flight. Setting up proper landings can be a little tricky, especially with add-on aircraft and airports, but if I can do it, anybody can. I am not sure this program is technical enough for your needs, but it might be worth a look. The do have a free demo you can check out, which is always a good thing:http://www.fsflyingschool.com/http://www.avsim.com/pages/1207/FlightScho...lightSchool.htmThere's also FSpassenger, which simulates jetliner travel. I don't have this product, so I know next to nothing about it, although it does provide reports about your fliying and landing skills.http://www.fspassengers.com/?action=homeJeff ShylukAssistant Managing EditorSenior Staff ReviewerAVSIM

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When landing the Wilco 737 PIC, you get a sound cue ... either a jarring sound indicating the rattling of all of the onboard equipment, or the sound of a camera taking a photo as you touchdown (picture perfect!)It's a nice touch. (I believe it's dependent on your rate of descent when the tires hit the pavement).

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Any landing you can walk away from is a good landing, if you can use the plane again it's a great landing, but all landings you live through are ones you can be sued for. :-)XP Pro SP2-FSX SP2AMD FX60-8800GTS-2 Gigs RAMFEX-GEX-UTUSA-FSGenesis-and a bunch of other stuffComputer optimized by www.fs-gs.com

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The brain can actually fill in a lot of gaps & provide some pretty good sensations of "feel". But then...........you have to know what the "feel" is to start with. And for that, I suppose you'd have to be landing a real plane enough, so that the brain knows what to look for.So, based on my above theory.... :7 I actually DO get some good landing "feel", when landing my desktop simulator. In otherwords, it's very possible! :)L.Adamson

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Well, I suppose if you think it's a hard landing then you could always drop a desk on your toe, that would simulate the pain. I remember seeing somewhere a while back that read out information at touchdown, like speed, wind direction, and vertical speed. It seemed to be in a little blue box... although I forget what it was.

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I agree 100%. So with our mind filling in the gaps with reality perhaps we are are not seeing reality-but it sure feels real to me-with certain aircraft of course-and that is what counts-especially with present gasoline prices... :-) what a bargain...GeofaMy blog:http://geofageofa.spaces.live.com/

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A little while back I got invited up for a 20 ride in a friends plane. The plane is a Pitts S2B and he is a aerobatics instructor. I took a 2 hr nap when I got home from that ride, and no I didn't lose my lunch. Sometimes be greatfull you can't feel sh*t when your in the sim!

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I felt that way after my first lessons in a c152 almost 20 years ago.Always felt tired and a little queezy after my lesson but never lost my lunch. Was worried about this at the time-almost thought about quitting.Gained my "sea legs" after keeping with it-still get tired after long flights +-9-11 hours-but is pretty stabilized-never sea sick even in tubulence.There seem to be sea legs that occur over time.Also got sea sick to the point of feeling like dying years ago in a deep sea fishing boat for 9 hours in rough seas.Just took a whale watching boat in rough seas a few months ago-was sure I'd toss my cookies-turned out to be no problem.Seems tossing/not tossing cookies can be learned...maybe?GeofaMy blog:http://geofageofa.spaces.live.com/

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FS Flight Keeper provides a full analysis of every aspect of your flight and will tell you exactly how you performed.Have a look at the web site - http://www.molitor-home.de/FS/FLKeeper. There is a new version currently on beta test and it should be out any time now. This is a first class product, one I would not want to be without.Bud

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>A little while back I got invited up for a 20 ride in a>friends plane. The plane is a Pitts S2B and he is a aerobatics>instructor. >>I took a 2 hr nap when I got home from that ride, and no I>didn't lose my lunch. >>Sometimes be greatfull you can't feel sh*t when your in the>sim!Yep, when it comes to flight induced nausea and the ongoing urge to barf..........the sim fails! :-hah L.Adamson

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I feel double your pain (Baron)...but with a combo of throttling slightly back and planning stops based on fuel prices the hamburger is still doable, though certainly no longer $100.GeofaMy blog:http://geofageofa.spaces.live.com/

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Once again thanks for everyone's input. I will definitely checkout FS Flight Keeper. It's definitely true that any landing you can walk away from is a good landing but I just wanna know if any of my landings are damaging the aircraft and spooking the passengers :)

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I am replying to the poster that commented the replay landing looked like the plane was on rails during landing replay. I feel the same way, and I think I might have a good guess as to why it looks this way.I am a real world pilot, and thus am very hard on myself, especially in turns. I keep the ball centered, and they are always nice and smooth (as much as is possible in a 172). However, I have noticed during replay of some of my famed "semi-perfect" touchdowns that the replay did not show this same smooth motion that I KNOW I exhibited. So...here is my theory. I am thinking that the replay in FSX is definately not a playback of your actual flight "footage" if you will, rather it is a rough interpretation. You can test this yourself. Take-off, complete a circuit, and put her down. Now replay, you will notice in some cases that the control surfaces do not respond exactly on time with the turn, and the aircraft will tend to move in rigid ways, especially in turns. It is even more obvious with helo's. I think that FSX somehow saves resources and plays back the aircraft at certain positions of altitude and heading, therefore not having the fluidity of your actual motion experienced in real time.This is just a guess, as many times I have viewed the replay and wondered why the thing looked the be on rails, as it did not in any way feel like that during the flight or during landing. It should be stated that this "rail" look is only prevalent during spot view, at least to me...Danon O.

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A TrackIR helps a lot to help you get a sense of what your aircraft is doing. And it can help induce queasiness, if you really want to. First, set your monitor to the >lowest< refresh rate you can. Then play at random with the TrackIR settings. Or pick a profile that you think you would never like. Run FSX in as dark a room as you can and still have the TrackIR work. Fly around a bit, and unless you are a steely-eyed aviator or are a heart-of-oak sailor (I am an avowed brown-eyed passenger, and until I cut out caffeine, I would get the occasional cardiac flutter) you can induce some motion-induced queasiness. Do not try this stunt of you have a history of epilepsy or seizures!I think you can learn to overcome motion sickness to an extent, but age and genetics can work against you. It's a fascinating field of study that I don't want to ever know about. I'm getting butterflies just writing about it on this thread. A sailor friend of mine says it helps if you have something constructive to do on the craft. When I started to get sick on his boat, he let me steer, and that helped a lot. If you are down below and sucking on diesel fumes in a 9-foot swell, well, that's gonna turn you green right there. @ Danon O: I suspect you might be right about the replay animations. Replay files themselves aren't actually movies of your flight, but are generated in real-time based on your recorded flight information. Maybe there just aren't enough key frames generated by the recorder, and the computer fills in the missing data with made-up stuff. I've had times where I've made a slight jolt or correction and although I could see it in the instrumentation, it didn't seem to show up in the exterior animation. Jeff ShylukAssistant Managing EditorSenior Staff ReviewerAVSIM

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RE: The Posts regarding the aircraft looking like it's on rails during an approach (playback).Get. FS. Recorder.Then, when you play back you approaches, everything looks smooth and realistic. The gear even expands and contracts as it should. The Default Replay feature in FSX/FS9 is a bit lacking, it doesn't record all parameters. I use FSRecord for all important approaches, that way I can watch them over and over again - and even step back into the cockpit at certain points and refly them!Get FSRecorder!!! It's free!

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I can't access the AVSIM Library from here, but if you do a search for the 'Landing Gauge', you'll get an FS9 gauge that works perfectly with FSX. It tells you your -FPM and Touchdown Speed. I'm not sure how to tell if a landing is smooth depending on FPM. Anybody have a good scale?For example, I have achieved a -87 FPM landing in a 777. Would this be classified as smooth?I've also achieved a -125 FPM landing. Smooth? Medium?Then I've done a -387 FPM landing. Hard, I guess?Thanks,Regards,

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Thanks Jeff,I was pretty sure I was not going insane in noticing this, and what you said is exactly what I was trying to say. The lack of data points seems to be the issue...Danon O.

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Thanks alot! I knew I had seen it, and I thought that it had been in one of your posts as well. It's landspd.zip in the library.

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>For example, I have achieved a -87 FPM landing in a 777. Would>this be classified as smooth?>>I've also achieved a -125 FPM landing. Smooth? Medium?>>Then I've done a -387 FPM landing. Hard, I guess?I've done some calculations, and reckon that:87 FPM is equivalent to jumping off a 2ft high wall125 FPM is equivalent to jumping off a 4ft high wall387 FPM is equivalent to jumping off a 39ft high wallTim

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That's only what you feel if your aircraft has solid steel landing gear, steel tires, no flex or shocks at all, and an aluminum seat.

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I have been missing this kind of feature too so last night I wrote a program to display some stats for us.It has two windows, one is "Realtime" and the other "Landings". Realtime is updated as you fly. Landings is updated when the program detects contact with the ground.It displays the following information:Angle of Attack:Pitch:Role:Yaw:Heading:Track:Side Load (H-T): (this is heading minus track)Vertical Speed:Ground Speed:I have to write a quick bit of doco for it before uploading but I have a flying lesson first :-)Steven.

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