1.  Does it work well with VFR?

2.  How well does it work with PMDG 737 integration with SayIntentions API Key?

3.  Will it work with PSXT data fed by RealTraffic (LiveTraffic) and AIG models?  (assume just ATC aspect)

4.  Can it be menu driven rather than voice?

Premium services is $190/yr which seems reasonable if they deliver VFR support that works in controlled airspace.

I have BeyondATC but their roadmap seems to never change (aka completed) and the ATC voices were great but it just kept on endlessly hounding me for  responses to the point where I just disabled it … that and no VFR support in controlled airspace.

Thoughts?

You'll get lots of views, often opposing. It's a divisive product in that some absolutely love everything about it, whilst other people's perception is of constant frustration and problems.  I started my SI journey in the former, and ended it while firmly in the latter.

One man's view:-

1. SI VFR in the US is outstanding.  SI VFR outside of the US ranges from just ok to terrible. The way it's set up is that most countries outside of the US use the basic US system with some vocabulary changed to make it appear more realistic.  In the UK, instead of "flight following" you'll hear "Basic service" and "Traffic service" which is correct.  However the actual machinations behind the scenes are really just the US systems and there are countless inaccuracies.  When you check in with a FIR in the UK, all sounds pretty good at the point of check-in, but then literally nothing happens.   When you fly north out of London Information's region, there'll be no hand off to Scotish Information.  You have to just figure out when you've flown out of the London FIR, then cancel your 'basic service' and then check in with Scotish. In SI, flying VFR in Europe, there is zero functionality related to checking into a FIR for VFR. All it offers is the 'immersion' of checking in.     VFR in the US is a completely different ball game and the functionality is excellent.   I personally stopped ever using SI for VFR, other than in the US. You can soon 'see through' what the program is doing and it feels pointless and hollow.

2. No idea, never tried it. I'd left SI by the time the PMDG was released.

3. No idea.

4. To a degree. There is a dialogue box that you can type text into but the whole UI and product isn't really designed for non-voice / menu.  SI's strength is it's immediacy. Typing long "pass your message" responses for VFR in the UK would become almost unmanageable, if typing into the UI.   I used ot use the text dialogue only for occassions where it was behaving strangely with voice input or just couldn't understand what I was asking it.  

Edited February 5Feb 5 by JYW

Thanks for the response, very useful information.

No menu option selection for response is probably a show stopper for me … not into voice control/response during my flight sessions … too many “Say Agains” 😉 

 

3 hours ago, JYW said:

You'll get lots of views, often opposing. It's a divisive product in that some absolutely love everything about it, whilst other people's perception is of constant frustration and problems.  I started my SI journey in the former, and ended it while firmly in the latter.

One man's view:-

1. SI VFR in the US is outstanding. 

I would not call it outstanding but it does exist and it does work. it's pretty new in SI.

It is also pretty much the only place that offers Vfr.

I believe they still give a 24 hour windows to try.

Worth it and enough time to give you a idea if it's good enough for you.

You van also subscribe for a month and change to a yearly later if you decide to.

They are always updating so it should only get better.

4 hours ago, SayAgain said:

3.  Will it work with PSXT data fed by RealTraffic (LiveTraffic) and AIG models?  (assume just ATC aspect)

ATC will work, just your plane,  but will not see PSXT injected aircraft. 

4 minutes ago, ZKOKQ said:

but will not see PSXT injected aircraft.

Hmmm … ok, thank you.  So with PSXT/AIG/RealTraffic, SI could give me clearance for takeoff on a runway even if there is a line of 3 aircraft waiting to takeoff from that runway?  Or could allow me to cross a runway when AI aircraft is landing or taking off on that runway?  That would sorta make the product pointless in this situation/configuration?

I noticed SI indicate they have a Traffic Injection process in “Beta” … what is the data source for the injected AI (RealTraffic here … I have a subscription to RealTraffic)?  Assume SI Traffic Injector means ATC would be aware of AI traffic?  

Assume it will use whatever aircraft models I have installed (aka AIG)? 

Thanks for all the input.

2 minutes ago, SayAgain said:

Hmmm … ok, thank you.  So with PSXT/AIG/RealTraffic, SI could give me clearance for takeoff on a runway even if there is a line of 3 aircraft waiting to takeoff from that runway?  Or could allow me to cross a runway when AI aircraft is landing or taking off on that runway?  That would sorta make the product pointless in this situation/configuration?

I noticed SI indicate they have a Traffic Injection process in “Beta” … what is the data source for the injected AI (RealTraffic here … I have a subscription to RealTraffic)?  Assume SI Traffic Injector means ATC would be aware of AI traffic?  

Assume it will use whatever aircraft models I have installed (aka AIG)? 

Thanks for all the input.

I think there's some awareness from SI over other traffic - I seem to remember back when they didn't have traffic injection and I used FSLTL it would actually tell you to stop or won't clear you for take off. 

The problem is that real live traffic is problematic in an ATC environment. If it can't actually control them – re-sequence, tell them to go-around, adjust speed – then it sort of kills any point in having ATC to begin with. But then the moment it tells a "real" plane to go around then it's not real traffic anymore. 

To answer your question, SI uses real world schedules for airliners and will manage them based on your sim time. So if a plane is supposed to arrive at 10.30 at Christchurch then you'll probably see it there if you set your time to 10:30. Or if it's due to depart at 16:30, you'll see it taxi for departure then. Reality is that it will never be 1:1 with Flightradar or the likes so if you want parity in that way you'd be disappointed. 

It also adds static traffic and sprinkles GA traffic throughout too.

Honestly, the no voice thing sounds like a massive deal for you but SI is all about voice control. I think that's why I like it – it feels so natural to just speak into it. I'd urge you to try it even if you feel hesitant. I'm not a vatsim person at all but feel comfortable with SI's interpretation and patience in that regard. And of course the more you use it the more confident you get. 

 

Thank you for all the responses, SI is something that doesn’t seem to meet my current goals for ATC … but will keep an eye on how they progress.

I wasn’t looking for SI to control the AI aircraft, only navigate me thru what the AI aircraft are doing based on whatever process is being used to control them (i.e. PSXT + RealTraffic) … so not a true ATC.  Just a process that can respond to AI locations and navigate me accordingly (be it ground, taxi, departure, arrival, etc.).

Since PSXT + RealTraffic is based on real ATC management of aircraft in the real world, they are under ATC control already so SI shouldn’t need to manage those AI aircraft.  Since SI is server based and subscription, I was hoping their “AI” processing would be capable enough to understand the MSFS AI traffic and be able to route me accordingly.

Pilot2ATC is MSFS traffic aware. It doesn't control the planes but will route you around them (as best as it can). 

20 hours ago, SayAgain said:

Thanks for the response, very useful information.

No menu option selection for response is probably a show stopper for me … not into voice control/response during my flight sessions … too many “Say Agains” 😉 

 

If you're not into the voice control, I honestly wouldn't recommend SI.   It's not like Beyond ATC which shows you prompts of what you could say.  SI will give no hints on expected next actions. I guess to some, that's why they find SI more realistic.  Have you looked at FS HUD?   I've never used it but from what I've heard, I think it may be more compatible with a no voice preference.

19 minutes ago, JYW said:

I guess to some, that's why they find SI more realistic.

I get it, absolutely more realistic, I'm just not looking for that aspect of ATC realism.

18 hours ago, Room112 said:

Pilot2ATC is MSFS traffic aware

Pilot2ATC seems to focus more on Xplane (which is fine) and runs entirely external (no in-flight interaction window).  Looks extremely robust, probably too robust for my desires.  I didn't see any menu driven selection option, seemed to be all voice driven.  Can Pilot2ATC run on a separate networked PC?

52 minutes ago, JYW said:

Have you looked at FS HUD?

FS HUD seems only work with it's traffic injection process and not with PSXT+RealTraffic.

Thanks again for all the suggestions.

One 'advantage' of SI is also that you'll get FREE lifetime e-mail spam from them. 

Just now, MaGer1965 said:

FREE lifetime e-mail spam from them

Haha ... all goes to my junk folder if I want it to and then deleted after 3 days.  I guess you're not an SI fan?

No, I found their business practices aswell as the permanent 'fixed' messages...disgusting? IMHO it's only a matter of time they'll fall - even if only because of persistent, ongoing and incorrigible violations of the European General Data Protection Regulation. 

Ah, just one more thing😜: The more AI, the less I want it. Regardless of where or from whom.

Edited February 6Feb 6 by MaGer1965

53 minutes ago, SayAgain said:

I guess you're not an SI fan?

 

39 minutes ago, MaGer1965 said:

No, I found their business practices aswell as the permanent 'fixed' messages...disgusting? IMHO it's only a matter of time they'll fall - even if only because of persistent, ongoing and incorrigible violations of the European General Data Protection Regulation. 

Ah, just one more thing😜: The more AI, the less I want it. Regardless of where or from whom.

 

Thinking back to my first comment being that SI is "highly divisive" 😊  You'll see a lot of this; fierce defenders of the product and organisation, and others who have been driven to true contempt towards SI.  

The CEO - Brian - is a figure not too dissimilar to Robert Randazzo; in his elevated view of himself and his product, occassional narcissistic traits and a tendency to become fanatically defensive.

I personally used SI for a year and one month - subscribing from day one.   I started to feel that SI was going in a very unpleasant direction and I was also plagued with reliability problems with it.   I posted a post here on AVSIM that contained no abusive content, just a list of my criticisms and justifications for them (in my eyes).

Brian (CEO) saw the post and immediately refunded every payment I had made, then banned me. 🤔  My account now discludes the ability to re-subscribe.   As an experiment, I set up a new account under a different email.   I then got a message saying "duplicate account detected - your accounts are blocked".   As I have a fluid IP address, this leads me to believe that SI obtained a hardware footprint from my PC, which they now use to prevent me from ever re-subscribing. 😄

People getting banned from things in FS is not that exceptional - but if you saw the post that led to this, you'd be gobsmacked by how benign it was.  

Yes, the SI Father-and-son team are an odd bunch.  I'll stick with the word odd 😊

 

Edited February 6Feb 6 by JYW