Sign in to follow this  
N562Z

Innsbruck AI

Recommended Posts

Can anyone tell me from either experience flying there or living nearby, what commercial airlines fly into Innsbruck, Austria LOWI? I've been working on my world AI flightplans and can't seem to find a local carrier who's planes show up at LOWI. It's not an installation issue, I have no problems with that. I've tried most USA domestics, Hapag-Loyd, Condor, Edelweiss....maybe Austria Airlines?Please Help, and Thanks!Alex ChristoffN562ZMinneapolis, MNThermobulb@aol.com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Help AVSIM continue to serve you!
Please donate today!

I don't have any first hand info, but a great way to find out that kind of information is using Airliners.net. Just do a search for all commercial traffic at LOWI and sort by most recently added. Just from pictures you can find out what carriers and what types of planes fly in and out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great idea, thanks Craig!Alex ChristoffN562ZMinneapolis, MNThermobulb@aol.com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tyrolean has several daily flights to/from LOWI. They are part of Austrian Airlines Group and fly a fleet of F70, CRJ and DH8. Some tourist carriers have charter flights to/from LOWI as well, often with larger aircraft, but they in all likelihood don't appear on published schedules. Misha

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Misha, James, Craig....Thank you all for your responses, which were corroborated nicely by photos of all of those liveries landing and taking off at LOWI at airliners.net. Man, this AI thing is a real drug, isn't it? Too cool...Alex ChristoffN562ZMinneapolis, MNThermobulb@aol.com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dear Alex,If you fly to Innsbruck be aware of the fact that the GS for RWY 26 is incorrectly located. If you follow it you will land at the end of the runway. I have made the correction using EasyNavs.Regards,

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Domingos:We meet again. First at the delayed and flawed threshold at Genoa Sestri, now at Innsbruck! Could you please send me your updated.bgl file for Innsbruck LOWI? I tried an ILS approach there the other night in the Posky Condor 767-300, except it was into runway 8, a localizer-only approach: it was a disaster...:-lol I posted some screenshots in the screenshot forum. Now I know to approach from the east, runway 26! Your modified approach will help, though I'm hoping to be visual before I realize that I've overflown the entire runway.Chiao,Alex ChristoffN562ZMinneapolis, MNThermobulb@aol.com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dear Alex,I have sent the bgl file by email. In this case the DME was correctly located, only the GS was placed at the same co-ordinates as the Localizer. Although I had made several landings at Innsbruck, only recently I noticed the GS was not at the correct location. This was due to the fact that I would follow the approach using the AP, but soon after I had the runway on sight I would switch to manual landing.Regards,

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks again Domingos for your efforts to correct these incorrect GSs.Alex ChristoffN562ZMinneapolis, MNThermobulb@aol.com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Folks!I just wanted to let you know that the fact Innsbruck Airport is famous for is its offset approach from the east on runway 26. One mile from the runway you have to go onto a visual procedure and perform a slight right-turn. In line with the runway there are buildings as churches, hospitals and 10-floor appartment-buildings just less than one mile away (unfortunatley not in default MSFS) Mountains in the north of the city are about 7500 ft high (much more impressive than in FS), less than one mile away. Don

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can you get AI Traffic to actually land in Innsbruck?I believe they keep crashing into the nearby mountains...Lousy AT Controllers :-)Stamatis

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Andreas:Thanks for you info. I've posted another set of screenshots from my second landing attempt, which was much more successful. I did the cicling visual approach from the west to runway 23. A bit scary in a heavy jet flying low and slow, but I got it down. Look for 'Innsbruck Approach Revisited' in the screenshots forum.Alex ChristoffN562ZMinneapolis, MNThermobulb@aol.com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Christoff,here are some usefull linksFlightplan for scheduled flights from/to LOWI, valid 27 Oct 02 - 29 Mar 03:http://www.innsbruck-airport.com/linienfluege.aspWinter flightplan for scheduled charter flights from/to Innsbruck. http://www.innsbruck-airport.com/charterfluege.aspThis flightplan looks completely different for the summer season. The winter flightplan is mostly incoming charter bringing tourists from the UK, Skandinavia Russia etc. to the Tyrol (Tirol) for skiing, whereas the summer flightplan is mostly outgoing, flying the locals to Greece, Turkey, Tunisia, Spain, Canary Islands etc. for their summer holidays.In the Charter flightplan you will also find indirect flights to longhaul destinationes like Indonesia od Mexico. BTW I haven't found the summer flightplan on the net yet. Ofiicial Homepage of Innsbruck Airport (german version)http://www.innsbruck-airport.com/Ofiicial Homepage of Innsbruck Airport (english version)http://www.innsbruck-airport.com/englisch/index.aspHomepage of the "Friends of Innsbruck Airport" (unfortunately only in german, but with lots of selfexplaining pictures)http://www.lowi.at/I hope this hepls you,Wolfgang

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

>visual approach from the west to runway 23Rwy 26 :-)Wolfgang :-wave

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Domingos,in real life you are not supposed to follow the GS down to the runway. MDH is at 4500 ft (approx 2500 AGL) which is at the ABSAM NDB, at DME 6.0 OEV. From that point on real world pilots do not use LOC or GS but make a visual approach, because the LOC is offset and also maybe for the reasons you have experienced. Till that point the default FS2002 GS seems to work perfectly IMHO.One thing I do not understand is, that (also in real life) the OM is located after the MDHpoint - for what reason do you need an OM, when making a visual approach?Till that point the default FS2002 GS seems to work perfectly IMHO.Wolfganghttp://ftp.avsim.com/dcforum/User_files/3e307b8708dbb83e.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

MDH is at 4500 ft (approx 2500 AGL)Then MDA (not MDH) is 4500 ft and DH is 2500 ft :-)Stamatis

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, thanks!I'm always a bit confused by this ".. is it MDH or MDA, DA or DH..." :-)Wolfgang

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks, you have just confirmed my suspicion, as expressed in message #11 above.Stamatis

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have chnaged the active rwy to 26 by AFCAD and discovered, that now many approaching aircraft do not crash but report missed approaches to ATC. By using the follow AI mode in AIMAP I found out that these planes decend till they have approx. reached the height of the surrounding mountains, then report a "go around" even if they are on a straight in approach and have freec sight to the rwy, climb out into eternity, never to be seen again.Changing the active rwy to 26 at leasts helps the departing planes not to crash into the mountains, when they turn to the north a few miles after take off like all departing AI planes in Innsbruck seem to do. Wolfgang

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dear Andreas and Wolfgang,I would like to clarify the comments on the ILS location:a) The localizer is correctly located, and it is an offset localizer.:( The GS is wrongly located at the same co-ordinates of the localizer, i.e. at the far end of the rwy. As Wolfgang says, once the rwy is on sight, the pilot will make a manual approach and landing. That is why I did not notice the GS location until recently. Only when, under low visibility conditions, I made the ILS approach, I noticed I was too high when I reached the rwy threshold.c) The co-ordinates I used to correct the GS location are those provided by MS through AFCAD. As you may know the information used by the instruments (VOR, ILS,...) and the information used by Map and GPS come from different files.d) If you follow the GS (correctly located) you will come safely from the top of the mountain down to the rwy in a position that will allow a landing with a minimum of manual intervention.e) Why the OM is located where it is I have no idea, but according to the Jeppesen chart it seems to be correctly located.Regards,

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you all for your input and information, this has been very informative. The crashing AI traffic at LOWI is very interesting! I'm about 75% finished with my Swiss / German / Austrian AI traffic additions and have not witnessed this strange behavior yet in the simulator, but Wolfgang's idea to change the active runway to 26 seems like a good idea. I would either use the ILS 26 approach or the circle to land approach to 26 anyway, despite MSFS ATC clearing us for a straight-in to runway 8 when approaching from the west: I don't think that is possible, or done in the real world,is it?Alex ChristoffN562ZMinneapolis, MNThermobulb@aol.com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this