VC vs 2D cockpits, opinions?

[Guest]

You could hardly tell the difference between the 2d panel and VC when you switched to the VC, that's how good of a job they were doing even back then.

Back then it was a compliment if you could hardly see a difference between 2D and VC. Not anymore: if someone would say now that a VC looks almost identical to the 2D panel, I would regard that as an insult. :( Because things have moved on and imho nowadays VC's actually look better than 2D panels. (Well, the better VC's of course...) Not only are the gauges just as good and crisp and clear, but they are also influenced by the light that falls on them, which make them come alive and makes them real. When it comes to immersion, VC's and TrackIR are the best. A 2D looks the same no matter what weather it is and where the light is coming from. A VC that looks 'as good as 2D' isn't that good anymore... (Not trying to convert anyone to VC-ism, but just sharing my own personal opinion!)

Jeroen, that forced perspective panel pic is AWESOME. I really needed that laugh this morning. :) Thank you. Can just see the captain saying "Dude, put your track-ir on already, I can't see runway."

Glad you liked it! :(

[jrhoads 6]

if someone would say now that a VC looks almost identical to the 2D panel, I would regard that as an insult. :( Because things have moved on and imho nowadays VC's actually look better than 2D panels. (

Not me. I take great pride in my 2D panel work and I am very methodical about the layout and develop everything from a pilots perspective including the viewpoint.Jim(you said)That inset looks exactly like a VC...Yeah, if you like to fly from the back seat.

[Guest]

Not me. I take great pride in my 2D panel work and I am very methodical about the layout and develop everything from a pilots perspective including the viewpoint.Jim(you said)That inset looks exactly like a VC...Yeah, if you like to fly from the back seat.

Well, I have to back up the truck a little perhaps, because, to be honest, it's been a while since I've seen a 2D cockpit... And I certainly didn't see yours. So maybe I should look at some prime examples of nowadays 2D panels before I say what I think of them... But I didn't mean to knock 'm down or to say you are doing a lousy job!!! That wasn't the goal of my post! So I apologize if I insulted you or anyone else... The fact that I personally like the look and feel of VC's more doesn't mean of course the 2D panels are crap. A 2D panel can look awesome and just like a real picture, but I simply don't like using them, no matter how beautiful they are...And about the picture looking like a VC: I of course meant the overall look of it, not that specific viewpoint. :( When I fly I never leave the pilotseat: I do everything from the main VC view, using the TrackIR as in real life to look around and so on. You won't catch me flying a plane from THAT viewpoint! :(

[january 19]

How best to present Flight Simulator? For me, VIEW - (a wide 145

[Guest RonB49]

I usually don't reply on this type of thread but I can offer a different perspective. I use two monitors. One (23" wide screen) is for the outside view and the other (17") for the instrument panel. I arrange the 2d panels to be as functional as I can make them and try to keep them reasonably close to looking like the real thing. Here is my setup for the PAD turbo beaver.I feel that with this method, I have the best of both worlds. All the instruments are right in front of me, common switches (Battery, Starter, Avionics, etc.) are mapped to the keyboard on the right, and I can use the yoke's hatswitch to pan the view without losing any functionality. I must even lean forward a bit to see over the instrument panel to see the runway right in front of the plane when landing. It works for me.R-

[beatle 0]

It is also possible to emulate a 2D panel with a camera view entry in the aircraft.cfg file but this is probably not undockable.Rick

Those should be undockable, they are just 3D view windows with a specific camera, and 3D view windows can be undocked just like panel windows.Tim

[Gumps 0]

Those should be undockable, they are just 3D view windows with a specific camera, and 3D view windows can be undocked just like panel windows.Tim

Tim, perhaps you or someone else could elaborate on this idea. I tried to undock the VC view, but of course, it takes the 'outside' view with it. In the case of a 2D panel, only the panel itself is undocked, leaving the outside view intact. I tried opening a new outside view window, and dragging the VC view onto another monitor, but the FPS went in the tank. Having two outside views causes a big impact on my machine.It would be very helpful, I think, if the outside view could be disconnected from the VC panels view. I realize this would only be of interest to those using more than one monitor, but there do seem to be quite a number of people out there using more than one screen. Hopefully someone can figure out how to tweak the VC panel views so that they can be effectively undocked and used like 2D panels. That would be great.I've been using my TIR more lately, primarily because the new Duke is such a nice airplane, and that's the only way I can fly it. I will say, that while it looks good, it's much more tedious to navigate the cockpit and actually fly the airplane with TIR, and use the mouse, than when using multiple monitors. Throw in touch screens, and well...that's just my view. And I do use both. In the end, to each their own.Noel WBrisbane

[JW6984 0]

Since we have a few developers participating in this thread, can I throw-in my plug for 2D Panels with Widescreen versions!!!It seems like only a few developers are producing WS panels these days :(Jim

[gman! 1]

How about this to give people insight on why people prefer one or the other:If you usually fly from the virtual cockpit try flying using the 2D panel, just for a while (maybe a week)If you usally fly using the 2D panel, try flying using the virtual cockpit. I prefer the virtual cockpit for flying, but I do have to use 2D mini panels at times in certain planes.

[DShutt 14]

Since we have a few developers participating in this thread, can I throw-in my plug for 2D Panels with Widescreen versions!!!It seems like only a few developers are producing WS panels these days :(Jim

Widescreen use is relatively new. Remember that products like ours (Level-D 767 (FS9)) is over 4 years old. Widescreens were very rare and very expensive. The FSX version is an UPGRADE to the FS9 version. That said, the 767 can still be used with widescreens (there are some limitations). I think it's a safe bet that developers - including Level-D - produce panels with WS in mind. Yes, the 757 will have several panel options.

[LAdamson 240]

If you usually fly from the virtual cockpit try flying using the 2D panel, just for a while (maybe a week)

When FS98 came out with a "lame" virtual cockpit, I overlayed working 2D panels to get the effect of a working panel. I must have been tired of 2D's clear back then! :( The bottom line for me, is that a VC adds more sensations of "feel" than a 2D. Lot's more! But you do have to pull back the eye point some. 2D's are better for training purposes such as IFR work (at least in a more complex aircraft. VC's work fine for simple IFR panels). As we've discussed before, "feel" is a matter of the brain filling in gaps.L.Adamson

[Mango 0]

I didn't touch a 2D panel since FSX was released - but i always dragged pop up windows to a secondary monitor. However, this got obsolete for the Duke because it's VC clarity and functionality. One thing would add further comfort and might be easy to code - add a click spot f.e. to the GPS which takes me directly to the proper fixed view (and back). Right now i have to scroll through many unnecessary views until i get the closeup i want. Good idea ?

[N400QW 205]

We are constantly amazed, and sometimes amused, at the "either or arguments" that simmers engage in.Fact is, our customers demand that we as developers provide both 2D and 3D Cockpits in our products and we will continue to provide both.My personal preference is 2D Panel and so we were the first commercial developers to provide both 4:3 ratio and 16:9 ratio Widescreen 2D Panels along with 3D Cockpits.Having said that, I have to agree with Jim and others who've stated that it doesn't really matter what my preference is as long as the customer has options to exercise.By providing both 2D and VC, the customers have the "best of both worlds" and are free to enjoy their flight instead of arguing the merits of 2D over 3D. :(

[robert young 2,897]

I didn't touch a 2D panel since FSX was released - but i always dragged pop up windows to a secondary monitor. However, this got obsolete for the Duke because it's VC clarity and functionality. One thing would add further comfort and might be easy to code - add a click spot f.e. to the GPS which takes me directly to the proper fixed view (and back). Right now i have to scroll through many unnecessary views until i get the closeup i want. Good idea ?

Hi Mango,We are looking into a GPS click spot. In the meantime you can assign a hot key to ANY view in the Duke.Regards,Rob Young- RealAir

[Mango 0]

Thanks Rob :( ! Good idea with the hot key - i should come up with this solution myself... :(