Mr. Bradbury...that is by all accounts, a very reasonable point of view. You're sentiments are more along the lines as to what I expected. The manner of the message is clear, concise, while presenting a valid point of view. It lends itself to an open discussion where people aren't afraid to express their true opinions because they're not bullied into agreement. Now I've had some first hand experience with those who have an agenda and consequently, I could be a bit jaded. I grant you that. It's just my intuition telling me that no one should be that passionate about something that doesn't belong to them in the first place. There could be an issue with obsessive behavior or maybe it's just simply stress. In both cases, nothing positive is accomplished and the original message is muddled in obscenities. If I was going to change the course of a discussion I would not go about it that way. So even if you are correct, (and you very well may be), unfortunately the end result is still the same. Mark

Well, I take your point about being suspicious of people getting passionate about things that do not belong to them. But that's only a valid point if that is precisely what they are getting passionate about.Perhaps it is honesty that they are getting passionate about? Or moral standards? Or the thin end of a potentially very big wedge? And these are things that belong to all of us.I don't want to sound too high handed there, and one should always be careful not to get vertigo when attempting to stand on the moral high ground, but these are equally valid stances from where someone may be commenting.Al

So now I'm asking, what's your agenda Mike? ... Yeah, I've been waiting to read that. A few of the opinions that were expressed in this topic lent themselves to someone saying "buy the latest version of a new AI package". I was just waiting for the first one to come along.But don't get me wrong, I'm sure that UTII is a good and viable product. But I beginning to believe that's why a few people have been diametrically opposed to the SKAI stuff. Granted, SKAI has overstepped the boundary of good sportsmanship but the anger and disgust that have been radiating from some, it just didn't fit as far as I'm concerned. There maybe a vested interest in there, and maybe not. I can't tell, I don't know, I can only postulate

Is your tinfoil hat on straight? My agenda, world peace, no more, no less. :( :(

Ok Ok Ok...hold on there.

Ditto, we are discussing this kind of package, not the legitimacy of the stuff it uses. That's a whole nother story, though an interesting discussion, because it is not as simple as you make it out to be. American Airlines once went after someone and as a result you will find no American Airlines in the original Ultimate Traffic for example, other airlines don't seem to care. Airline flightplans for example can be bought legitimately, this is what Ultimate traffic did, not sure about version 2. Sites such as Amadeus.net are often used by flightplanners. If SKAI get it from AIG, who get it from Amadues, let's also discuss the latter's status, and so on and so forth. But that's beyond the scope of this thread in my opinion.

(Not a Socialist, are you?)

Nope, conservative liberal.

Two words (if you have some cash spare) - Ultimate Traffic II !!

Two words, FSX only...

Ultimate trafffics models aren't optimuzed for frame rates. I hate it.

The original Ultimate Traffic came with first generation PAI models, at the time, they were the best available. Version 2 comes with the best available models we have now. Mostly from AIA and TFS, see the respective websites. Most new models from both groups were made for UT2, converted to FSX compliant models by Flight1 and released as freeware for FS9 (FSX compatible).

Nice, I like "the moral high ground". Might use it some time if you don't mind :) It isn't the message that was being sent, as there was nothing that didn't work in the message. It was in the manner that the message was delivered. That type of unwavering commitment comes at a cost, namely a diverse audience of free thinking people. There is no question, (at least in my mind), as to the validity of any point that has been made concerning this topic. They are all valid points of view. I simply don't align well with unilateralism. It has a tendency to make the non-confrontational shy away and we all loose out on hearing what they have to say.Mark

The Wings were flying tonight.JimCYWG

offtopicMaybe. But the Pens will take it in 7 :( :(

offtopicMaybe. But the Pens will take it in 7 :( :(

Ah...2 can play at that game? I'm from L.A. and "Laker's Basketball Is On The Air"!Mark

I couldn't agree with you more chock, and in essence that is what I was stating. I was trying to make a point to Mr. FJ Mike that you cannot rant and rave on 1 person, and be ok with somebody else doing the same thing. In my opinion, the person who compiled SKAI did a great thing. Though he did not get permissions to use peoples software to compile the package, he tried to make something to give back to the community. And I think he did a good job of it. There was a statement made about the amount of hours that it takes to create said timetable/repaint/ai aircraft, but I'm sure that SKAI didn't take a mere 5 minutes to create. Think about all of the research, collecting, compiling, and work that was done. And that person did not receive anything in return (except maybe some heartache). What that individual or individuals did was use their time and effort to compile all of those ai packages so that nobody else would have to.I personally use UT, but if I didn't, I would probably be using SKAI.

I was trying to make a point to Mr. FJ Mike that you cannot rant and rave on 1 person, and be ok with somebody else doing the same thing.

Yeah, but we're discussing just the one topic. That doesn't mean I'm okay with the rest or that I don't have an opinion about it, but I like to keep my rants specific and consistent and not drag a million other things into the discussion in an attempt to make a point.:(About possible hidden agendas, politics, psychology... I myself am most suspicious of thread starters who have just "found" something. But I'm no doubt influenced by my years of modding experience, not related to FS. I've seen countless newbies, people who literally just signed up, post about how they "found" a great action figure on eBay and they wanted to let everybody know in case someone was looking for it. Yeah, right... (We had a do not post your eBay auctions policy.) Some even used the same screen name as their eBay account, I kid you not. :(All kidding aside, I do not have an agenda. And I seriously wonder if it's even cause for discussion. It cannot be proven either way, so why even go there. Or talk about how some people may or may not be enclined to participate (anymore)... Enough with the deflective arguments already. It's an internet forum, enough said.*Shrugs*:(

Not meaning to put the cat among the pidgeons but I noticed there is another offering called Mortens AI and that offering is bigger than SKai .It seems he laid it out in a differernt manner to SKai Contains commercial traffic, general aviation, cargo, military, government flights etc...Models, Repaints, FligtPlans & tools are taken from:www.AVSIM.comwww.AVSIM.ruwww.flightsim2004-fanatics.com/FlightSim/KnowledgeBase/Brandon.htmwww.calclassic.comwww.htaimodels.com/downloads/dwai/fs_projectswww.dusteagle.huaca.be/fs2004/index.htmlwww.flightsim.comwww.projectai.comwww.trafficsystem.ru/eng/main.phpwww.samdimdesign.free.frwww.the-fruit-stand.comCompared to another freeware package like skAI Traffic 2.3Morten's AI Traffic 1.0-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------Number of Aircraft used in Flightplans: 9113Number of Flightplan files; 1560Number of different Airports used in Flightplan: 6019Number of Flights: 44428Number of Legs: 896462skAI Traffic 2.3-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------Number of Aircraft used in Flightplans: 3606Number of Flightplan files; 1Number of different Airports used in Flightplan: 3651Number of Flights: 18404Number of Legs: 581738Contains 1560 traffic.bgl files. Every one tells you the company and the valid period like: Traffic_KLM_Wi0809.bgl.If there is traffic you don't like, just delete a single file or rename it from .bgl to .bak instaed of edit a huge one traffic file.Remember to backup and delete your existing AI TrafficThis package requires app. 13.1 GB of free space. It's huge, but i think it's worth it.How long will it take for FS9 to start with that lot on your HD :( Mark

You know, I would never have seen this if someone didn't post it. I've never logged into any torrents before. My friend just happened along the skai thing and thought I'd like a copy of it. I like a diverse amount of traffic, I think I have a couple of gigs worth but 13gb...my goodness, that is a lot! I think that the load time would go from 5 minutes to 15, just to get FS9 to the "Create A Flight" screen.Well, there is hope. Someone has posted a request to find out if there is a way to move all of the AI traffic out of the Aircraft folder. If there is a method to do this then hello 13gb? The issue then becomes where to get the thing to at least have a look at it. I don't torrent and don't like getting stuff out of the news groups. Hey, maybe my friend can put it on a cdrom for me! Regardless, thanks for the heads up because I might not ever have seen it.Mark

First off, get the latest version of BBQ Hide AI, brings the load time back down.Secondly, This Morten guy must have no life, but my God, that's a lot of AI for FREE.And Alan; ...Nail on the head!

" I myself am most suspicious of thread starters who have just "found" something"

:( Google !!! It is quite good for finding things :( Mark

:( Google !!! It is quite good for finding things :( Mark

You're right! Lately, I've been goggling FS9 automation and configuration issues. I've been trying to come up with a common installation methodology for all add-ons. So my focus wasn't AI specific, so to speak, it was more along the lines of texture and library layering and how FS9 handles duplications. So I think I've devised a good way to automate some pretty common and time consuming issues in FS9. I didn't think to look if there was a new AI package out there...I was so used to going to the Fruit Stand for a Watermelon smoothie that I just didn't notice :)Mark

:( Google !!! It is quite good for finding things B) Mark

You're right! Lately, I've been goggling FS9 automation and configuration issues. I've been trying to come up with a common installation methodology for all add-ons. So my focus wasn't AI specific, so to speak, it was more along the lines of texture and library layering and how FS9 handles duplications. So I think I've devised a good way to automate some pretty common and time consuming issues in FS9. I didn't think to look if there was a new AI package out there...I was so used to going to the Fruit Stand for a Watermelon smoothie that I just didn't notice :)Mark

Didn't have time to read this whole thread, but here's my 2 cents...I have used skAI since the 2nd version.Before then I first tried Ultimate traffic...worst money I ever spent...horrible fps with not that great looking models.Then I went over to world of AI, and love it...yet not that big of a selection.Then i found skAI...best thing I've seen. Great fps (many times the number of AI the UT with much much best fps), great looking models, many different types of planes, and a lot of traffic everywhere. Yes I understand the author may not have used the proper paths to compile it but you can not argue that this is not the best AI package to date, payware or freeware, and I would not consider downgrading from this, call me spoiled.I too have heard of the new Morten AI but hear it was a big rough on the fps.Don't knock it till you try it... :(

The problem is that said author didn't actually do that work. He simply compiled it in one easy to install package. Yet people thank him for doing all that work and never even bother to thank the original authors who really did do the leg work of creating all of those files.That's like wrapping up a birthday present for someone and when they come up and give you a big hug as thanks, you don't even bother to mention that you didn't even get the present for them, you just wrapped it up!!!!The second problem is that when people compile these packages together onto one disc or whatever, in clear disregard for the stated copyright policy, they eventually end up on EBay at some point being sold to some unknowing person.Our world is going to @#$%, and people don't even bother to stand up for what's right any longer. :(

Well now you're arguing morals. Morals do not always parallel law, really. Is it truly immoral to pack freeware into an easy to install package for folks like myself (who likes flying--not screwing with traffic .bgls) to enjoy. NO! Think LOGICALLY, folks.