So this is a serious question that really irks me and I am intentionally posting it in the FSX forum as you are the users I want to hear from first hand...Why is it that every time a conversation about FS9 comes up a lot (and I am not saying all or making generalizations here) but a lot of FSX users jump in and bash FS9 like it is some inferior good for nothing sim and everyone associated it with it is poor or good for nothing just like the sim? Do FSX simmers forget that the engine FSX is built around is FS9? Do users forget all the YEARS of enjoyment FS9 brought us? Do simmers realize that had it not been for FS9 there would probably be no FSX? Do FSX users forget the level of realism AC like the PMDG 737/747/MD11 the RFP 747-200 and SO many others brought us? It reminds me of the Harley Davidson rider who thumbs his nose at a guy riding any other bike. It is sad and disheartening to see the blatant superiority complex SOME FSX users feel over their FS9 counterparts.AND BY NO MEANS am I dismissing FS9 users from this equation at all. For the most part a lot of FS9 users (myself included at times) have not helped our cause by some of the FSX criticisms by FS9 users. No one is without blame here.But and this is a big BUT, why is their such a negative disposition to FS9? What did it ever do wrong? Was it so worthless for all those years that you weren't really enjoying it? Or does a lot of this come from FSX users who never even simmed with FS9 and do not appreciate how much it has brought to our hobby and how critical it was for the development of FSX? And to the bigger point, why is anyone who still chooses to use FS9 deemed to be immediately inferior or from a lower economic standing than an FSX user? Trust me, people don't want to start comparing W-2's here but I am just so disheartened by the constant insulting of FS9 users and FS9 in itself I wanted to try and understand where it comes from and what if anything can be done to remedy this situation and allow us to just share our love of FS regardless of our choice of sim...And for all the FS9 users myself included that does mean coming to terms that the development hayday of FS9 has long past and if you are going to stay with it you should for the most part be happy with what we have and NOT expect developers to churn out FS9 releases the same way they did in the past. We do not always do ourselves favors by assuming every release is going to be FS9 compatible although we are CERTAINLY grateful when it is!!! There is a certain level of reality that has to be faced if choosing to remain with FS9. So I do not hold FS9 users in a white light with a halo around their head either, I see both sides but again, I do not understand the animosity, the lack of appreciation for FS9 and what it is and was; and the insults strewn at FS9 and its users...That is my .02 for the day, As Mr. Rogers once said, would you be mine, could you be mine, won't you be my neighbor...I think it is time we put this conversation on the table once and for all and we should all address the 800 pound gorilla in the room and possibly by talking through some of this we can come to a middle ground with a respect and appreciation for all sims and all simmers.Sincerely,Paul Solk

Amen Paul! Well Said.

I've learned that you don't listen to, or make legit by argueing, with all the 'nut cases' out there. You look. You listen. You pick and choose. But you don't react. Or post answers to 'partisan' remarks made solely to incite. These are called 'props'. They 'prop' you up so they can knock you down (with words). Trouble is they run their 'mouth' before they 'engage' their brain, or so it seems, so they are easy to spot. Some even start threads and then want a reply.CBNapamule

Amen Paul! Well Said.

Thanks Joe,And as Andre posted out in the FSX thread, this could be completely reversed and posted to the FS9 user who feels they need to shove FS9 down everyone's throat and constantly bash FSX and its users... No one is without blame and we all need to look at ourselves in the mirror and evaluate our own behavior if we are going to overcome the FS9/FSX animosity and divide in the forums...It should be about our love of aviation, our common love of simming and your immersion in whatever you choose to fly... Paul

Hi, Paul. As you said, "It is sad and disheartening to see the blatant superiority complex SOME FSX users feel over their FS9 counterparts." I suspect that those people would also behave the same about a whole spectrum of topics. You know; example: The color of jelly bean I prefer is superior to your color and you are sorry example of a human being for eating any other color. It's ego assertion at it most annoying and nothing more than a way to be "big". There could be a complete book on the psychology of ego and self esteem inserted here, but, . . .enough said. Before the aforementioned people set me on fire electronically, please everyone, consider this; I occasionally see downloads / uploads for FS98 and I have thought to myself, "People still use that, hmmm?" Nothing more nothing less, no condemnation, no feeling of superiority because I'm 'smarter' and 'better' for using a newer version of the sim, and I would not think of criticizing their choice. Jeeeez people, get real.Best regards to all,MelP.S. As has been said, that attitude applies in the opposite direction or all directions and it is a problem with 'people' not the choice of sim. Yes it should be all about flying and all about the hobby, but some people just can not resist making it about themselves.

Hi,For all the FS9/2004 users, as I said in the FSX forum:I still use both, I am spending more and more time with FSX and I believe once PMDG and Level-D puts out their new aircraft I will be leaving FS9 behind. I am fortunate enough to have a great system and the ability financially to continue to purchase hardware as it becomes available. FS2004/FS9 with all the third party addons available to the flight sim community is a great sim and will be for years to come!!!. I also believe its in the same league as FSX, I believe someone coined the phrase FS9.75, and I agree. However, I spend most of my time (99+%) in Boeing aircraft, the Level-D 767 as great as it is, is dated. The advancements that FSX brings to third party developers will allow Level-D's new 757 and PMDG's 737 to achieve new hights in realism that I believe are unobtainable in FS2004/FS9.All-in-All, both sims with third party addons are - "G R E A T"Just my 2cents

Repeaat from the FSX Thread...It really comes down to personal preferences.I've run, enjoyed, and developed for both for a good while and happen to think both are great sims.Best advice is to ignore the critics of both and enjoy yourself. It is after all, YOUR sim experience and your money. :( :(

Repeaat from the FSX Thread...It really comes down to personal preferences.I've run, enjoyed, and developed for both for a good while and happen to think both are great sims.Best advice is to ignore the critics of both and enjoy yourself. It is after all, YOUR sim experience and your money. :( :(

Sorry you guys had to repeat post, I just know some guys stick to one forum and thought this was important enough to discuss in both. I do appreciate all of the input and just hope we can make the forums a little more amicable as you both said "regardless of your preference"And Mel, very well said, as for me I would have a much easier time telling you what color jelly beans I DON"T like, it would be torture if someone forced me to pick a favorite :( Thanks again for all the feedback guys,-Paul

Paul you can have all of my black jelly beans, if you like.Mel

this could be completely reversed and posted to the FS9 user who feels they need to shove FS9 down everyone's throat and constantly bash FSX and its users

Very very rare, if you ask me. From my forum (not only AVSIM) experience I can say in 90% of cases it is the other way. And in 90% of cases I can read that it is because we, FS9ers, are frustrated as we cannot afford a rig good enough to fill FSX with high FPS.I have also read tones of other nonsense about FS9 and people using it (!).I peacefully tried to show my point of view here and there so many times that I simply got tired.Now I'm trying to stay away from 'FS9 vs FSX' discussions. So I'll try to stop here.I just wanted to say 'hi' to Paul. Hope you're fine! :(

Paul you can have all of my black jelly beans, if you like.Mel

LOL!!! And you can have my red and yellow starburst!

LOL!!! And you can have my red and yellow starburst!

:( Mel

Great Post! It's amazing how quickly people forget.I think the bashing is coming from brainwashed members of the community that are buying into the FSX superiority they hear from most addon developers. I don't understand the rush to FSX, chances are it could be the last FS version we ever see... why force everyone away from a sim that is basically the same.I like to look at FSX diehards like Apple a really excited user, if you don't use it they'll bash you and they always feel the need to tell the whole world how superior they are above you because they use FSX.

Hello Paul, and all:I can only speak for myself. First, I have FSX and a ton of add on's for FSX. I have also been a PMDG beta tester, so there is NO lack of great aircraft in FSX for me to fly. For the most part, FSX's scenery is 'photo' and much more detailed than FS9. I have a very high end rig, ASUS Maximus MB, QX9650 overclocked to 4.1 which runs flawlessly, and a GTS 9800 512, overclocked to the max. All this with dual Raptor HD's. I have NO overheating problems, no CTD's..........it's the only unit that I have been 100% thrilled with. and it's faster than skunk stink! SO I HAVE NO PROBLEMS RUNNING FSX JUST ABOUT MAXED, EXCEPT FOR BLOOM.Saying all of that, I think I have the perfect rig for FSX, at least for me.................AND I STILL PREFER FS9. Maybe it's because of FSNav . . . I love that program. Maybe it's because I'm getting old and find no use for the new upstart. Or that I find bugs all the time in FSX. I found those also in FS9, but have worked them all out..............I just plain don't like FSX. Can't give you any other reason why..............just don't like it.Best to allClay

Hello Paul, and all:I can only speak for myself. First, I have FSX and a ton of add on's for FSX. I have also been a PMDG beta tester, so there is NO lack of great aircraft in FSX for me to fly. For the most part, FSX's scenery is 'photo' and much more detailed than FS9. I have a very high end rig, ASUS Maximus MB, QX9650 overclocked to 4.1 which runs flawlessly, and a GTS 9800 512, overclocked to the max. All this with dual Raptor HD's. I have NO overheating problems, no CTD's..........it's the only unit that I have been 100% thrilled with. and it's faster than skunk stink! SO I HAVE NO PROBLEMS RUNNING FSX JUST ABOUT MAXED, EXCEPT FOR BLOOM.Saying all of that, I think I have the perfect rig for FSX, at least for me.................AND I STILL PREFER FS9. Maybe it's because of FSNav . . . I love that program. Maybe it's because I'm getting old and find no use for the new upstart. Or that I find bugs all the time in FSX. I found those also in FS9, but have worked them all out..............I just plain don't like FSX. Can't give you any other reason why..............just don't like it.Best to allClay

A nice post Clay. It is refreshing to read a level headed thought on the subject and the reasons for your choices devoid of the opinionated BS. Thanksbest regards,Mel