ILS Problem at LEBB (Bilbao) Airport - Maybe Faulty AFCAD? HELP ME, Please!

[Co-Pilot Diego 0]

Hello to everybody!

 

I've got a small problem which i don't seem to get a proper solution for, and believe me i searched on every flightsim forum possible to try to get a solution, and nothing seems to come up.

 

I'm pretty sure the solution is so simple, that it's breaking my head for days...

(The most frustrating part is that i dont get this in any other airport, JUST LEBB! Before i didnt had this case, i've been flying in and out of LEBB for quite a few times. To answer your hidden question: Yes, i know how to land with ILS...)

 

Here we go: As i approach LEBB, i get ILS RWY 30 Approach from ATC. (4.400 is the ILS intercept altitude for this airport.) I hear the morse code from the ILS, (Frequency is 110.30) as it's activated in NAV1 on my radio.

Then it comes, the 'pink diamond' on the right 'comes down' slowly, (approach speed as normal 148-152 knots, Flaps 30 - Boeing 737-800) reaches the center, but doesn't turn off my ALT-knob!! Then the 'pink diamond' falls all the way down, and ILS approach is screwed up. So in the end the ILS RWY 30 Approach changes into a Visual Approach.

 

My Question now is: How to fix this? What goes wrong? Why ILS RWY30 doesn't turn off my ALT-knob so i can do a normal ILS approach as in for ex. LEBL, LEVC, LECO, LEST or any other airport in the world?

 

For all of you professional i leave you down here my AFCAD behind, which i changed just a little to add an ILS Approach to RWY 10, which offcourse in real-life doesn't exist because of the mountains around LEBB airport. (The problem existed though before i added this ILS Approach)

 

Here is the official AFCAD (+ ILS RWY 10) from Tropicalsim (zipped):

http://www.4shared.com/zip/ENX4jG4R/AF2_LEBB.html

 

I'm completely desperate, because, as i said, it might be such a easy solution, but maybe i'm not able to see it.

("Can't see the trees because there's a forest in front", we would say in Holland...)

 

Anyone who could provide me with a solution or better, send me back the AFCAD and kick my "rear end" for having missed out something important, is welcome. (Be gentle and respectfull, though...)

 

Big shouts out to everyone on this forum, you guys are the ones that make the troubleshooting part of the flightsimming a headache less, and together we're more worth: All for one, One for All!

 

Thanks in advance, Keep up the Good Work,

 

Grtz,

Co-Pilot Diego

[sluggy 3]

Which 737 are you using?

 

Cheers, SLuggy

[Co-Pilot Diego 0]

ANY Aircraft, PMDG 737, PMDG MD11, Default Boeing, Any Posky or Project Airbus, Wilco Pic 737, any type practically. Did you heard of it before?

 

Grtz,

 

Co-Pilot Diego

[Hoang 108]

Have you installed any addons (especially sceneries) recently?

[ronzie 21]

I just thought of this. What was your intercept angle to final. Were you locked on to the LOC? Check the PFD annunciator for status. If you're way off the maximum allowed intercept angle for this approach direction then APP may not lock. The default LEBB shows only RWY 30 equipped with LOC/GS (ILS). If your afcad is up to date there is also LOC/GS on RWY 12.

 

I can't download from 4shared unless I register which I don't do. I can see upload registering but not downloading. Privacy issues. Check your PM.

 

If you are using a DME ARC intercept you might try using HDG to turn inbound as the LOC needle starts to move toward the center and then VOR/LOC to lock to the LOC first and then engage APP if your MCP is so equipped.

 

Current charts do not show a back course LOC for landing on 12. (FS defaults have the back course LOC always enabled.).

[scott967 62]

 

 

Here is the official AFCAD (+ ILS RWY 10) from Tropicalsim (zipped):

http://www.4shared.c...R/AF2_LEBB.html

 

 

Seems to need a login to download.

 

scott s.

 

.

[ronzie 21]

I looked at the ILS 30. It is imported from stock and has a slightly increased glide slope of 3.4 degrees which should be no problem.

 

Here are properties of the afcad three ILSs;

 

 

 

 

 

and the FS9 default:

 

 

all for your comparison.

Placement of the GS transmitter looks good for all.

 

Here are the frequency rules for LOC/ILS systems:

http://en.wikipedia....#Frequency_list

 

I do not see anything incorrect. Maybe someone else will.

[cbrown 1]

If they are all in the same afcad, you have 2 ILS/DMEs for rwy 30 at different positions and headings on the same frequency. They almost certainly interfere with each other and give conflicting signals. Try removing one or change one to a different frequency and see if you then still have the same problems.

 

Colin B

 

Edit:

On my afcad, the second one above appears to be correct.

[mebull 27]

You might try double checking for duplicate AFCAD files for LEBB. I noticed in Ron's analysis that the number one example of ILS/DME 30 (stock) and the default example (stock) of the same do not have matching latitude and longitude locations. If the creator of the scenery matching TropicalSim AFCAD moved the runway or simply adjusted the position of the ILS system slightly you may be experiencing a conflict of duplicate AF files trying to send you two places at once and therfore simply failing to work at all. If you find that you only have your TropicalSim AFCAD and the default FS9 AF airport then I am out of ideas, unless you are switching to the approach mode before the glideslope signal is aquired. I just did a test flight with the default airport. I departed on runway 30 turned to a heading of 180 climbing to 5000 feet. At 20nm out I turned to a heading of 120 for 1 minute the turned to a heading of 330 and descended to 4400 feet. That placed me on a localizer intercept at about 24nm out. I proceded on 330 until the glideslope became active with me below - diamond at the top of indicator - and then set to approach mode. Captured approach and from there everything went exactly as it should, all the way to touch down. All this leads me back to thinking duplicate AFCAD or that your default AP file: AP947160.BGL has been modified or corrupted.

 

If you don't have it find and run ScanAFD available here on AVSIM: http://library.avsim.net/search.php?SearchTerm=ScanAFD&CatID=root&Go=Search

 

Best regards,

Mel

[ronzie 21]

There should be only two valid afcad type files for LEBB. By valid I mean showing runways, etc. The first is the APxxxxx default file.

 

An add-on can have a special afd type file that in AFCAD will list for that airport search and open up visually as a layer with no scenery elements displayed, just the airport reference. Sometimes that extra layer (intended) is a navigation device overlay in an attempt to modify some normally fixed properties of an ILS system. Generally if an extra file path found by scanafd resides in the same scenery add-on folder it is not a duplicate but a second layer for that specific scenery.

 

A frequent source of an afcad type file are those placed by traffic applications that are usually modified defaults. Ultimate Traffic is one such program and places them in add-on scenery\scenery under your FS9 folder.

[ronzie 21]

I contacted a scenery modifier user well experienced referring him to this thread and he looked at this thread and he did not spot anything incorrect on those ILS property boxes.

 

If you are intercepting the localizer at a shallow enough angle and it locks and then the GS diamond drops slowly from above it should lock about one division above center the aircraft continuing to fly level and then starting to descend on track.

[Co-Pilot Diego 0]

Guys, incredibly load of amounts of thanks for fighting through this problem. I will try each and anyof your suggestions (ScanAFD, checking for double frequencies, replacibg the default APxxxxx .bgl file, etc) Ronzie, thanks for your individual analyze and your expertise and time that you took for me.

 

Big up guys, i'll try 'defaulting' it all and start all ocer with this scenery.

Just one question, AP947160.bgl is the bgl file for LEBB? Can i just copy it from original installation and just paste it in the correct place to make it default?

 

Thanks again. You are all geniuses compared to me...

 

Co-Pilot Diego

[scott967 62]

Just one question, AP947160.bgl is the bgl file for LEBB? Can i just copy it from original installation and just paste it in the correct place to make it default?

 

Yes (Scenery\Eurw\Scenery\AP947160.bgl)

 

If I think there may be a problem with an ILS in the scenery, I like to use the default Barron in slew mode to track the sim signals from the ILS in question and verify the deviation indicator needles are moving as expected. Once that's verified you can then test flying with the flight director on, and finally with the autopilot on.

 

scott s.

.

[Co-Pilot Diego 0]

Hello Everyone.

 

Problem solved, but don't know what it exactly was. I reinstalled the AP947160.bgl and completely erased Tropicalsim Bilbao from the system. Then did a test-flight with landing on Rwy30 and it worked. So then i reinstalled Tropicalsim bilbao again, and just finished my second test-flight. All worked fine. Something probably with the AFCAD or the bgl-file was modified i guess.

 

Thanks to every AVSIMmer who helped me out...

 

Co-Pilot Diego