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Tom Allensworth

Lockheed Martin Issues Statement

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'Flight' was slated for being just a game, now we have people slating P3D for NOT being a game.

 

The irony.........

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Parents always are entiteld to read and test educational stuff they buy for their children.

 

Damnit, I need a kid.

 

We should STOP asking LM to say things they are not allowed to.

 

Said it a long long time ago already.

 

They did not buy MSFS for that purpose and the product being profitable or not is of no interest for LM.

 

LM did say to me on one occasion that the primary reason they have P3D is for internal trainings. From that I can only conclude that we are just a byproduct. Something LM doesn't depend on. But they know they can have small profits from it and why prevent that?

 

Pressing LM to say things they are not allowed to say, doesn`t help.

 

Halelujah. Thank you.

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It never ceases to amaze me how a segment of this community can so whip themselves into a frenzy, causing themselves and many others, needless stress. We disallowed the discussions on EULAs and the MS - LM license before because there were arm chair lawyers coming out of every crevice and bolt hole imaginable, armed with more opinions and "guesses" than limbs and orifices. Here we go again, apparently. Folks, ambiguity is a legitimate business strategy. Adopt it. Accept it. Move on and enjoy!

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It never ceases to amaze me how a segment of this community can so whip themselves into a frenzy, causing themselves and many others, needless stress. We disallowed the discussions on EULAs and the MS - LM license before because there were arm chair lawyers coming out of every crevice and bolt hole imaginable, armed with more opinions and "guesses" than limbs and orifices. Here we go again, apparently. Folks, ambiguity is a legitimate business strategy. Adopt it. Accept it. Move on and enjoy!

 

+1000

 

I intend to enjoy.......

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Let's hope AVSIM asks and keeps asking until it gets an answer "which EULA permits P3D to be used by individuals for personal/consumer entertainment ?"

 

How about if I use it but do not enjoy it and am not entertained? Absolutely NO FRIGGIN WAY that any legal entity can make that determination. Think about it. Do you really believe that someone could take someone to court claiminig that they broke a law because they ENJOYED something. Has everyone lost their marbles?

 

Vic

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I have greater things in life to be concerned with. If anything, its humorous.

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regarding their "statement" - I see it as SSDD - other than the weaponizing reference.

 

But just to cover my backside, let me publicly state that I get absolutely NO personal entertainment from using P3D.

 

Vic

 

  • We should STOP asking LM to say things they are not allowed to.

  • They give us a wide variety of ways to get it.
    Just play the game with them their way.
     
    How long that wil go without problems depends on MIcrosoft.
    Personally I do not expect any action from that side .
  • Thats guessing I realise , the rest is cristal clear.

 

FINALLY! Someone who gets it. We are dealing with legalese words here, not reality. As long as LM maintains their stance, they are in compliance with the MS agreement. The difference between "can be used" and "must be used" is monumental in legalese.

 

I agree with another poster - I am beginning to find this humorous.

 

Vic

 

+1000

 

I intend to enjoy.......

 

wouldn't that be considered "entertainment"?

 

Sorry, I just HAD to say that. I agree totally with Tom re ambiguity being a valid business model.

 

Vic

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How about if I use it but do not enjoy it and am not entertained? Absolutely NO FRIGGIN WAY that any legal entity can make that determination. Think about it. Do you really believe that someone could take someone to court claiminig that they broke a law because they ENJOYED something. Has everyone lost their marbles?

 

Vic

 

:LMAO: :LMAO: :LMAO:

 

It never ceases to amaze me how a segment of this community can so whip themselves into a frenzy, causing themselves and many others, needless stress. We disallowed the discussions on EULAs and the MS - LM license before because there were arm chair lawyers coming out of every crevice and bolt hole imaginable, armed with more opinions and "guesses" than limbs and orifices. Here we go again, apparently. Folks, ambiguity is a legitimate business strategy. Adopt it. Accept it. Move on and enjoy!

 

Amen to this.

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Do you really believe that someone could take someone to court claiminig that they broke a law because they ENJOYED something. Has everyone lost their marbles?

:LMAO: :LMAO: :LMAO: :LMAO: :LMAO:

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It never ceases to amaze me how a segment of this community can so whip themselves into a frenzy, causing themselves and many others, needless stress. We disallowed the discussions on EULAs and the MS - LM license before because there were arm chair lawyers coming out of every crevice and bolt hole imaginable, armed with more opinions and "guesses" than limbs and orifices. Here we go again, apparently. Folks, ambiguity is a legitimate business strategy. Adopt it. Accept it. Move on and enjoy!

Thank you for that statement Tom!! I have been reading these opinions and thinking about it all morning. My first reaction was also Look out the sky is falling!! LOL! After giving it some thought, I believe once again we are being our own worst enemy. I know that I learn things everyday from using the Simulator. I also know that many of us hate being treated and called "gamers". Here is the key to the whole thing. FSX is a game and Prepar3d is a simulator. Simulators are built as a learning tool. If you take a 737 passenger plane and add hard points and bomb racks on it, then you have a bomber!! For us it is that easy.....There is no Lawyer or company who can know or prove that you intent is not to learn from a simulator so long as your intent is to educate yourself. LM did state clearly that that learning experience does not have to be in a class room. As Tom said...."Accept it. Move on and enjoy!" Just the opinion of one new Flight Simulator Student!!!!! Former President Bill Clinton said it best "It all depends on what you definition of "is" is.

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It never ceases to amaze me how a segment of this community can so whip themselves into a frenzy, causing themselves and many others, needless stress. We disallowed the discussions on EULAs and the MS - LM license before because there were arm chair lawyers coming out of every crevice and bolt hole imaginable, armed with more opinions and "guesses" than limbs and orifices. Here we go again, apparently. Folks, ambiguity is a legitimate business strategy. Adopt it. Accept it. Move on and enjoy!

 

Precisely.. I had Prepar3D running on one monitor and reading this thread on another monitor while drinking coffee and eating a cinnamon bun and just shaking my head wondering why this matters to people so deeply.

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What's really amusing is that most if not all people, don't even RTFM when purchasing any software or addon, yet they want to make us believe they sit down, read, analyze and evaluate an EULA in order to comply with it. LMAO

 

Yea right...

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What's really amusing is that most if not all people' date=' don't even RTFM when purchasing any software or addon, yet they want to make us believe they sit down, read, analyze and evaluate an EULA in order to comply with it. LMAO

 

Yea right...[/quote']

You are so right...

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I do quite a lot of telecommunication contracts, and you would be amazed how rarely people read contracts - maybe 1/100? And those are quite serious things compared to buying a flight simulator addon! :lol:

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Even when you do read them, without council present, I look like this when finished. :crazy: :Silly: :Monkey:

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Almost seems like because some folks are sad/mad that certain high-level 3rd party developers wont produce for it, that they want to make sure that everyone else that couldnt care less is miserable too, and refuses to use it. Well I'm here to tell ya, folks will use it as long as it's good value for money regardless of the EULA. I'm willing to bet that the same folks crying about the EULA issue are some of the same that wont hesitate to copy a CD and give it to a friend, etc.

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ambiguity is a legitimate business strategy

 

But not very helpful to anyone considering a long-term investment in P3d etc.

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ambiguity is a legitimate business strategy. Adopt it. Accept it. Move on and enjoy!

 

Tom, I think you should pin this at the top of the Prepar3D forum. Looking forward to reading the upcoming P3D team interview !

 

But not very helpful to anyone considering a long-term investment in P3d etc.

 

Please name me an addon that is P3D only ? (except the estonian migrator of course). Your investments are safe, at least till V2.0

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I am so glad that AVSIM has taken a position on this.

 

I would also be very glad if the others who don't use it but take satisfaction from telling us we cant use it take a back seat. There are many other forums for you to post productive things about the sims you do care about.

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Legal translation into English

You can use it if:-

You are a PPL, or are studying to become a pilot, or seriously interested in learning to fly. Or one day when I have enough money I'll start training. The download location is imaterial. It's not a game as was "flight". It's a learning and educational tool as is FSX and FS9.

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First singing the song how beautifull the fs world will be :

 

"We are now updating our rendering system to support DirectX11 and development is progressing nicely. With DirectX11 support, Prepar3D can leverage features such as hardware instancing, shaders, GPU-based particle systems, tessellation and multi-threaded rendering. We’re excited about the future of Prepar3D’s new rendering capability and are eager to be able to release it to the community in 2013"

 

And next : BUT that's NOT FOR YOU!!! How can you make a statement more ambiguous as it is, right now...

 

In my country one would say, "Dear AVSIM, we really sorry, but Prepar3D is not your business", when they wouldn't allow us to use it for entertainement, sorry training.

 

Sorry, English is not my mother tongue, it sounds a bit rude.

 

Hugo

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Please name me an addon that is P3D only ? (except the estonian migrator of course). Your investments are safe, at least till V2.0

 

PMDG's investment in P3D is obviously safe - it hasn't made one, and seems unlikely that it will. Until developers like PMDG are prepared to develop for P3D it's unlikely that P3D can be a serious alternative to FSX - that's not what we all want surely?

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Aerosoft and Flight Sim Labs dont agree to that statement, they are embracing P3D and willing to work with it.

 

Like Tom said, enjoy it and move on.

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Hello everyone! I just got a prezzie - a DVD called P3D, or something. I am learning all about flying planes. Wow! It's really cool. My Dad thinks it's fun too! :p0504:

 

- P. Pan (age 6 years).

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