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Interpaul

Fuel disagree / Insufficient fuel

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Hi,

during the engine start I get an insufficient fuel warning on the CDU and there is difference between the totalizer and the calculated fuel numbers. Some minutes later there is a fuel disagree warning and the option to use the totalizer numbers on the progress page. 

 

Am I doing something wrong?

 

Thank you.

Jan

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Jan, How did you load the fuel onboard....CDU? or FSX fuel option?

 

I entered my numbers in the CDU.

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during the engine start I get an insufficient fuel warning on the CDU and there is difference between the totalizer and the calculated fuel numbers. Some minutes later there is a fuel disagree warning and the option to use the totalizer numbers on the progress page. 
 
Am I doing something wrong?

 

Did you use Ground Operations at all?

 

Was this in between two flights where you adjusted your fuel?

 

There may be something here that we're looking into.  For now, follow the checklist in the ECL (totalizer is normally the correct one in my experience) and select the appropriate value on the PROG pages.

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Okay i think we can add using AES as a possible cause of this, i never had this issue before until when i finally configured AES to be used with the T7, ever since then, every time after engine start (even if i didnt use AES services at all or i start at an airport that doesnt use AES like default) i would get this message. What i do is go back to the perf init page after start, make a manual fuel entry (any number will do) then delete that manual entry, it will force the FMC to read the calculated fuel and you should be set from there.

 

Its just one possible clue though

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Did you use Ground Operations at all?

 

Was this in between two flights where you adjusted your fuel?

 

There may be something here that we're looking into.  For now, follow the checklist in the ECL (totalizer is normally the correct one in my experience) and select the appropriate value on the PROG pages.

 

It was between two flights. I entered the amount of fuel for the next sector in the CDU (FS ACTIONS -> FUEL -> TOTAL KGS). Didn't use PMDG ground operations.

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It was between two flights. I entered the amount of fuel for the next sector in the CDU (FS ACTIONS -> FUEL -> TOTAL KGS). Didn't use PMDG ground operations.

 

Cool - good to know.  This looks like something we're going to have to chase down.

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I have been getting this when not using the Ground ops system, and instead going to FS Actions > Fuel  and entering a number directly into TOTAL KGS (Line select 1L)

 

This will always end up with a major difference between TOT and CALC, pop up the insufficient fuel, then you can go to PROG and select "Only use totalizer fuel" (Line Select 5L) and then the Calculated fuel field disappears from the PROG page, along with insufficient fuel warnings. The fuel prediction on the Prog Page changes and then you clear the non-normal checklist that popped up.

 

All of the times that I use ground ops it hasn't happened. (waiting 1h30min for it to complete is a bit boring sometimes when you're just trying to catch some Vatsim ATC at random who will probably be gone by then)

 

All of the times I have used the FS ACtions > Fuel, it seems the Calc fuel doesn't 'see' the new fuel come in, so it will still say I only have 20 tonne when I actually have 85 or whatever.

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I'm also having this issue, 30.6 tons on board but the calculated amount is 19.1 tons, using AES and this is on a turnaround.

 

Refueled using the Fuel page not Ground Ops as GO was being contrary earlier on and not allowing me to enter 20 mins as the turnaround time, instead insisting on 1:30...

 

Regards,

Ró.

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I have been getting this when not using the Ground ops system, and instead going to FS Actions > Fuel  and entering a number directly into TOTAL KGS (Line select 1L)

 

This will always end up with a major difference between TOT and CALC, pop up the insufficient fuel, then you can go to PROG and select "Only use totalizer fuel" (Line Select 5L) and then the Calculated fuel field disappears from the PROG page, along with insufficient fuel warnings. The fuel prediction on the Prog Page changes and then you clear the non-normal checklist that popped up.

 

All of the times that I use ground ops it hasn't happened. (waiting 1h30min for it to complete is a bit boring sometimes when you're just trying to catch some Vatsim ATC at random who will probably be gone by then)

 

All of the times I have used the FS ACtions > Fuel, it seems the Calc fuel doesn't 'see' the new fuel come in, so it will still say I only have 20 tonne when I actually have 85 or whatever.

 

Hi, did you use AES? Just trying to figure if it is consistently experienced by people who use AES.

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Refueled using the Fuel page not Ground Ops as GO was being contrary earlier on and not allowing me to enter 20 mins as the turnaround time, instead insisting on 1:30...

 

It won't allow entries that would be lesser than the assumed fueling time.

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Hi, did you use AES? Just trying to figure if it is consistently experienced by people who use AES.

Don't own AES.

(Actually had to google it to figure out what it was)

 

I do have GSX, but havn't been using it with the odd door config issues (it doesn't know doors are open). GSX has also crashed a few times and taken Coatl/FSDT down with it (barren buildingless KORD as a result.) I havn't seen other people talking about that though, so I might just need to update GSX/FSDT Addon manager or something.

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There may be something here that we're looking into.

 

:huh: So this isn't intentional then?

 

What the FMS thought I had, vs. what the FUEL synoptic page said I had, was lower (which is OK). I didn't get the fuel disagree message though. The FMS ended up about 3500 lbs lower than the totalizer, over 8 and bit hours.

 

Best regards,

Robin.

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It won't allow entries that would be lesser than the assumed fueling time.

Refueling time was something like 17-18 mins, I also tried to enter 25 minutes and 40 minutes, but it wasn't having any of it, it wanted 1:30 and wouldn't budge... Would make a great negotiator...  :P

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So this isn't intentional then?
 
What the FMS thought I had, vs. what the FUEL synoptic page said I had, was lower (which is OK). I didn't get the fuel disagree message though. The FMS ended up about 3500 lbs lower than the totalizer.

 

A minor difference is to be expected, but when the fuel loader that comes with the plane is creating errors outside of failures, it's something to look into.

 

 

 


Refueling time was something like 17-18 mins, I also tried to enter 25 minutes and 40 minutes, but it wasn't having any of it, it wanted 1:30 and wouldn't budge... Would make a great negotiator... 

 

Hmm... that doesn't make sense...

I used 70 min the other day, and 50 min at some point before.  Both were fine.

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Hmm... that doesn't make sense...

I used 70 min the other day, and 50 min at some point before.  Both were fine.

Maybe it's this long turn panel state thing you mentioned in the other thread? It did this yesterday as well, but then it also worked for a bit. I'm just sitting here confused TBH...  :wacko:

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Yes, I ve had this same issue various times.

 

I also noticed that it continues to keep topping up the fuel to, so sitting there with the APU running, I can sit there all the time and still have whatever the amount of fuel I uploaded, as soon as the APU burns some, the groundops tops it up again.

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Fairly reproducable

 

  1. Load up "Short Turn" Panel state
  2. Load fuel and fly somewhere - no problems
  3. Save panel state
  4. Shut down sim, Restart PC
  5. Open Sim, load the save state from step 3.
  6. Refuel with the "Load Fuel" page in FS actions, and not Ground Ops
  7. Start an engine: = Fuel disagree/insufficient fuel message
  8. Tot Fuel - Calc Fuel = The amount of fuel you used in step 2.

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Cround Operations is a complete bust for me.  Tried it twice with no usable refueling.

I may be doing something wrong.  Plus you cannot stop ground operations once it starts.

Cheers,

Don Emerson

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I do have GSX, but havn't been using it with the odd door config issues (it doesn't know doors are open). GSX has also crashed a few times and taken Coatl/FSDT down with it (barren buildingless KORD as a result.) I havn't seen other people talking about that though, so I might just need to update

 

I have no issues  in using  gsx  with  the t7  at all,  did you get  the messages  sometimes  to add the updates   when your  connected to fsx  and  do you install or  you simply ignore  them. Best bet  is  to download  the latest  addon manager  from fsdt  and install it  hopefully this will fix your issues. If not  if you post in the fsdt forum  the dev   will hopefully get back to you with the fix 

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Fairly reproducable

 

  1. Load up "Short Turn" Panel state
  2. Load fuel and fly somewhere - no problems
  3. Save panel state
  4. Shut down sim, Restart PC
  5. Open Sim, load the save state from step 3.
  6. Refuel with the "Load Fuel" page in FS actions, and not Ground Ops
  7. Start an engine: = Fuel disagree/insufficient fuel message
  8. Tot Fuel - Calc Fuel = The amount of fuel you used in step 2.

 

iam using that short panel state as a modified (secured the AC, switched all off) for the broken original cold&dark state which load by default, i also did the other steps more than 10 times now because these are the steps i normaly use and i never got to the problem, i didnt at all.

 

edit: there is one difference next to the altered cold&dark panel state, if i load a panel state manualy, i mostly do that by just loading the FSX save, where the regarding T7 panel state is loaded automatical then.

 

 

JG

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