Patch getting close

[Guest]

 

 

or is there anybody who need it urgently

 

Well, as it is now I hardly fly anymore due to OOMs, so… I would like to see that patch appear soon, including OOM fixes. ^_^ However, if the patch comes without OOM-fixes, I will probably start flying again anyway but with lower settings or without FTX regions, one or the other. I might also create a few settings cfg's and load them depending on where I want to fly.

 

 

 

I gave up on POP_FREE_AUTOGEN too and that seems to help, but I was impressed with it and I'd like to use it

 

I am willing to give up on some features of P3D v2 but that new autogen system is one thing I will never ever disable. I rather fly with (a lot) lower settings than go back to the autogen popping up all the time nearby. 

[Novation 534]

Here's hoping those two items fall under: "Working with some 3rd party devs on some of the remaining major backcompat issues".

 

 

I would bet money (a couple of pounds anyway ) on that being the case, as this issue only crops up with 3rd party scenery, as far as I'm aware... I know its very easy to quickly change the texture size, but I'm holding off using my UK2000 airfields until this is fixed... call me picky ^_^

 

I think LM have made great effort to correct a huge list of issues so quickly, and those guys seem genuinely passionate about making P3D as good as they possibly can... their communication is spot on too.

 

Very impressed! :smile:

 

 

 

I am willing to give up on some features of P3D v2 but that new autogen system is one thing I will never ever disable. I rather fly with (a lot) lower settings than go back to the autogen popping up all the time nearby.

 

Same here, the new agn system is too good to lose... as is the volumetric fog layers, which give an amazingly real look to low level fog, even if it does have some issues, which should also be fixed in 2.1.

[FlyBaby 659]

I am excited about the upcoming patch. However, P3D was released with “many” obvious bugs that should have been caught during the beta testing period. At best, the patch will get P3D to the state that it should have been when LM released it back in November.

 

I like LM’s dedication to fixing the bugs, but their biggest problem lies within their testing efforts that should not fall back on the consumer. Yes, there will always be bugs, but many of these patch issues were due to “poor” quality control.

[Jim Robinson 122]

But if they'd have fixed all the bugs it wouldn't have been released back in November, it would have been released in late January or early February. Can you imagine the fire fight being two months late would have triggered? I can't really see where problems "fall back on the consumer" if they're fixing it and giving us a patch for free, and I personally don't have a problem with a few bugs when I see how hard they're working on ironing them out. Actually I'd rather see what they've come up with in the early stages and have a say in what I think needs to be fixed while they're still working on it rather than have one of my pet niggles end up being a problem forever because the sim has been deemed "finished" by the time I get my hands on it.

 

I guess if they decide to charge me another $60 bucks for the patch then I might change my tune, lol. Arrgghh, that actually sounds a bit like "Acceleration" doesn't it?

 

(actually even Acceleration wasn't a complete ripoff, the fundamental patches were available in SP2 which was free)

[LHookins 3,113]

 

 

However, P3D was released with “many” obvious bugs that should have been caught during the beta testing period. At best, the patch will get P3D to the state that it should have been when LM released it back in November.

 

If you've worked in the software industry, you've probably heard something like "We're shipping it Wednesday.  Have it ready."  Sometimes, release dates have little to do with the actual finished state of the product, and more to do with other pressing issues.

 

I agree with Jim above, and would rather have an almost-finished product and give some feedback rather than have one that will never be fixed because someone in management decided it was time to move on.

 

Hook

[Mike_CFII_MEL 790]

Hi,

 

Exactly; with the massive changes from DX9 to DX11 and all the items added to and removed from P3D2.0, I'm actually surprised there weren't more problems... As long as items are being fixed, I have no problem with L/M releasing the program last year.  As far as Flight Sim base platform developers are concerned, IMO no-one has been as vigilant in listening to and repairing problems (in a timely fashion) as L/M has been over the past months.

 

Well done L/M!

 

 

But if they'd have fixed all the bugs it wouldn't have been released back in November, it would have been released in late January or early February. Can you imagine the fire fight being two months late would have triggered? I can't really see where problems "fall back on the consumer" if they're fixing it and giving us a patch for free, and I personally don't have a problem with a few bugs when I see how hard they're working on ironing them out. Actually I'd rather see what they've come up with in the early stages and have a say in what I think needs to be fixed while they're still working on it rather than have one of my pet niggles end up being a problem forever because the sim has been deemed "finished" by the time I get my hands on it.

 

I guess if they decide to charge me another $60 bucks for the patch then I might change my tune, lol. Arrgghh, that actually sounds a bit like "Acceleration" doesn't it?

 

(actually even Acceleration wasn't a complete ripoff, the fundamental patches were available in SP2 which was free)

[FlyBaby 659]

If you've worked in the software industry, you've probably heard something like "We're shipping it Wednesday.  Have it ready."  Sometimes, release dates have little to do with the actual finished state of the product, and more to do with other pressing issues.

 

I agree with Jim above, and would rather have an almost-finished product and give some feedback rather than have one that will never be fixed because someone in management decided it was time to move on.

 

Hook

 

I have worked in the software industry (I develop both games and financial software solutions) and there is such a thing as "pushing back" the release date or not "announcing" a release date until a more stable package is available. Time pressure is no excuse for a "black screen" after loading.

 

Anyone who develops software knows that releasing poor quality software is a bad business ethic, plain and simple...having your consumers pay to be testers is a scam that has somehow become the norm.

[Novation 534]

Personally speaking... I've have had, getting on for, two months of great flying with v2, and am perfectly happy with the release window. Yes, there are issues, but for most of us they have not been total show-stoppers...In fact, we may end-up with a far better product, quicker, this way.

 

A beta team (whether we like it or not) can never compare to getting something out on to the open market, where a vast range of configurations [and fussy git simmers ] can give their feedback. If you are sensitive, and critical of faults, its best not to buy ANY software at release, whether you like that fact or not...

 

The game/soldier sim ARMA3 offered a novel business model, by selling the product [through Steam] as an alpha/beta at a reduced cost, with the ability to download the full/finished product when it was released, for no extra cost, which was pretty cool... You could also opt to download developer builds to run and test, if you so wished, so you could be directly involved with the development process.

 

I'm an experimenter, so am quite happy to run software in various states, which is why I've beta tested quite a bit over the years.... Having said that I don't consider v2 to have been a beta test, even though there have been many issues... I've run beta's that are a total mess and far-far worse than this.

[Mike_CFII_MEL 790]

Hi,

 

One can hardly test the numerous hardware/software configurations on the market. As an individual in the business, I'm surprised at your response.... You should have a better grasp of this than the average home user.  Nor would I expect L/M to purchase various controllers and third party programs to insure they are operational within their base program.

 

That's what updates are for. This also includes driver updates from companies that develop hardware; as well as software patches from third party addon developers, not just L/M... This company has out performed every other flight sim base platform developer in regards to a timely patch and I've been around since the very beginning. I started with my Radio Shack Tandy computer and have purchased numerous platforms. How many fixes has L/M been able to fix in a couple of months, i've lost count... is it 60?. If that's not total dedication to their simulator then I don't know what is.

 

As far as stability, with a few minor "inconvenient" tweaks/changes, I've been able to avoid the black screen issue as have many others.. P3Dv2 as a stand alone program is very stable on my setup. I wonder how many unstable overclocks are out there causing problems that are being blamed on P3D? and/or cranking up just about every option within the sim... That, quite frankly their system is just not capable of supporting.

 

Sorry, but to infer that L/M has somehow scammed their customers couldn't be further from the truth.

 

 

I have worked in the software industry (I develop both games and financial software solutions) and there is such a thing as "pushing back" the release date or not "announcing" a release date until a more stable package is available. Time pressure is no excuse for a "black screen" after loading.

Anyone who develops software knows that releasing poor quality software is a bad business ethic, plain and simple...having your consumers pay to be testers is a scam that has somehow become the norm.

[LHookins 3,113]

 

 

I develop both games and financial software solutions

 

Oh good.  Then you'll know about the truism that the first major bug will be discovered 10 minutes after the product irretrievably ships.  And it doesn't matter how many mechanisms are in place to prevent it.  This includes things like peer code reviews and professional in-house testers.  It doesn't happen very often, but it happens often enough to make you humble.  If it hasn't happened to you yet, it will.  It happened to me in a game utility I wrote in the early 90's, but hasn't happened since to me personally, and I only had about 15 years professional experience at the time, and I was my own tester.

 

If the black screen bug affects everyone who runs the program, then I'll agree that this was a "show stopper" level bug that should have kept the product in-house until it was fixed.  It's much more likely that it only affects a small percentage of people, and if you've done any development, you'll understand that the most common reason is PEBKAC.

 

Hook

[jabloomf1230 2,445]

I am impressed that LM fixed so many issues so quickly, but none of them are really major and are examples of teething issues with a the first release of a new product.

[shivers9 1,174]

you'll understand that the most common reason is PEBKAC

you'll understand that the most common reason is PEBKAC

OK Mr. Hook...I see what you did there but for the rest of us what does PEBKAC mean??

[LHookins 3,113]

PEBKAC = Problem Exists Between Keyboard and Chair. 

 

Edit to add:  You have no idea how frustrating it is to spend a week trying to track down a problem, with the customer swearing he didn't do a certain thing, only to isolate it to that specific thing and the customer suddenly says, "Oh yeah, I forgot about doing that."  The first thing you do with a bug report from a customer is try to eliminate everything but your program being at fault.  Once that's done you bust your butt to fix it.

 

Hook

[Guest]

 

 

If it comes then it comes whenever it will be or is there anybody who need it urgently?

 

I believe several 3rd party developers are waiting for this patch to release so they can complete their own products and get them out ... so there is some level of urgency from them.

 

 

having your consumers pay to be testers is a scam that has somehow become the norm.

 

Paying beta testers are used frequently, can't say it's the norm.  Steam have many paying Beta products on their servers in far worse condition than P3DV2.  I agree there are some rather obvious bugs ... but I'm ok with that and I don't feel it was a scam at all.  The opportunity to use P3DV2 is only $9.95/mo with no restriction on cancellation.  Steam have some paying Beta products that are $90 upfront with no guarantees of anything.

 

I honestly don't know what the Black Screen bug is ... I've never encountered it - can someone fill me in?  The only time I got a Black screen was when I had DXTORY running (video capture), Fraps works fine ... external software not really anything to do with LM.

 

One thing that really needs to be considered when evaluating P3DV2 is how much compatibility they were able to achieve, it's pretty amazing it's working as well as it does, bugs and all ... bare in mind some 3rd party Devs are asking LM to retain compatibility with FS8 SDK (2001) so you can see the huge challenges they have.

 

I can certainly understand some of the initial frustration with the product, OOMs were a big frustration for me and fortunately I've found work arounds for just about everything so far.  Some work arounds aren't optimal, but the product does indeed work.

 

I'm happy that I was able to gain access to this product "in it's current state" back in November and knowing that patches are coming with continued communication is a huge benefit.

[FINXPAS 5]

Very courageous for any software business to deploy a platform that is supposed to interface with a multitude of addons. Not to mention the diversity of hardware configurations. My experience was very positive and made possible by:

 

Turning off HDR lighting.(black outs)

Getting FSUIPC (joysticks disconnect )

Updated C++ and .net service packs

Up to date graphic card drivers

Last but not least.. A GTX770 with 2Gb video RAM