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Farlis

Does Leveld 767 Have GPS?

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The LevelD 767 looks great but does it have GPS? I love to fly but I rarely want to use an FMC. I rather have the GPS control my route. Does the LevelD 767 allow for GPS navigation or does everything have to be controled by the FMC?JC

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JC, based on your statement and style of flying the LevelD is not for you.

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Joe - No, there is no GPS. But the FMC really isn't that hard to learn for the basics. There are a couple of things available which might help you make up your mind. The systems manual for the LevelD can be downloaded here: http://www.leveldsim.com/files/Level-D67-Manual.exe and the FMC manual from the original 767PIC can be found here: http://www.wilcopub.com/downloads/767_FMC.pdf . While the LevelD manual explains the workings of the FMC, I think the older 767PIC manual might be of special interest. Even though it's for the old model most all of it is still valid. There is a tutorial flight included and it will give you a chance to see just how easy it is to get up and flying with the FMC. Just concentrate on the items needed to get from point A to point B and don't worry about all other "stuff" the FMC can do. Honest, it really isn't that hard.Doug

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Why not? I didn't know anything about the FMC when I bought the 767PIC package and now I'm really glad I made the purchase. Everyone has to start somewhere. Besides, I think most people think learning the basics of the FMC is a lot harder than it really is. No use discouraging them further.Doug

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Of course the FMC in the modern Boeings and Airbusses uses GPS enhanced INS navigation so effectively it does have GPS :)

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"I love to fly but I rarely want to use an FMC. I rather have the GPS control my route."They are both pretty similar, you input a route into both, both can guide you along a lateral route, just an FMC is a little more indepth, and can also guide you along a vertical route, mind you so can the GS530 aswell, so in reality, they are both pretty similar.Dan.

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DanI am current on two very different but in some ways simular Citations.One is a three year old Citation Bravo with Primus 1000. Like the 767 it has an FMC and flat screen displays.The other is an old citation.Airframe wise they are pretty simular yet many of the older citations are fitted with Garmin 530s Frankly experienced with both there is very little the Primus can do which the Garmin cannot and the Garmin is far more "user friendly"I am sure some clever so and so will fit a Brace of Reality XP 530s into the 767 ;-)So the Author can have his wish :-)Peter

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Pete, I rather doubt it. That would be like putting an airscoop on a Rolls Royce. :-)

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Hello. Three things:1. Yes, I know the FMC is more true to life and it very usefull. I have the PMG 737 too but don't fly it much because of not having a GPS. Maybe because it does too much. I like the GPS becuase I can set the start and end points very easily in the Flight Planner and start up the plane and fly. At least with the FMC in the 737, the tutorial has you going through pages of menus, setting descend rates, altitude over nav aids, etc. If you are using ATC, half the stuff doesn't apply unless you want to disregard ATC.2. Sometimes I just want to call up a flight plan and fly in a hurry. Don't want to go through all the hassle.3. Can one using the FMC in the 767 just program a start and end point and fly between the 2? Can you save and call up flight plans into the FMC from Flight Planner? That would be neat.I got the PSS Concorde and DreamFleet 727 and even though they are some piece of work, the offer GPS. Don't get me wrong, the FMC is an awesome addition that FS9 planes now have (I have had every version of FS, including the one that came on tape for the Apple II). But the same way where you can go through a 75 page check list to fly from cold and dark or just hit CTRL+E, it would be nice to have a choice to navigate using the FMC or just GPS.Thank you for your responses.JC

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"1. Yes, I know the FMC is more true to life and it very usefull. I have the PMG 737 too but don't fly it much because of not having a GPS. Maybe because it does too much. I like the GPS becuase I can set the start and end points very easily in the Flight Planner and start up the plane and fly. At least with the FMC in the 737, the tutorial has you going through pages of menus, setting descend rates, altitude over nav aids, etc. If you are using ATC, half the stuff doesn't apply unless you want to disregard ATC."If you just want to you can disregard all the VNAV, SID and STAR info, there is nothing stopping you putting in a direct departure to arrival route in the FMS in the same way as the FS flightplanner.That way you can just use the pink line in the EHSI to follow and control the ALT yourself.Dan.

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I wouldn't be put off by the FMC thing, I'e been flying with various FMCs since the days of FS98 but have yet to master the default GPS. There may be a number of reasons for not purchasing the LevelD 767 but having to use the FMC is not one of them.Good luck!Bruceb

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Honestly, if all you need is the GPS then you should just fly a project opensky 767. I assume the complex startup procedure is also of no interest so why pay for the Level D. This plane, along with PMDG, SSTSim Comcorde, RFP 747 and dreamfleet 727 (without GPS) are made to "simulate" the real thing...which is why the don't have a GPS, or in the case of the concorde and 747-200, 727 an FMC. If all you want to do is start engines running on the runway, fly GPS route then I would suggest sticking with freeware...I am not putting that down (I for one don't have the Dreamfleet 727 but freeware instead) just saving you some $$$ from buying things you will never use.Mark.

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Actually Dan the default GPS leaves you nothing to program because FS9 does it for you. I'm in agreement that if people don't want to learn new things that they should stay away from Level-D's 767... :-roll

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Hi Mark. You stated "I assume the complex startup procedure is also of no interest so why pay for the Level D". Wrong. I love the start procedures. I love flipping switches and turning knobs. I love the great sounds, panels and textures of the payware planes. That is why I spend the $ on them. I consider the FMC a small feature in my list of priorities. Perhaps if I find a simple, consice procedure to program the FMC to fly between 2 points with my PMDG 737, I'll look at the 767. After all, I need some new iron. My B17, 727, 737 and Concorde are all old.JCP.S. One of the things I love about jets is the rumble they generate with my 150 watt sound system. The exterior sounds of the Dreamfleet 727 are "ok". The sounds of the Concorde are great. How's the sounds of the 767?

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Well based on your post, id Suggest a freware 767 with lonny paynes panel.Jason

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I consider the FMC>a small feature in my list of priorities. Perhaps if I find a>simple, consice procedure to program the FMC to fly between 2>points with my PMDG 737That's not exactly realistic. FMC's are for complex routes via Airways. So A and B might be your starting point and destination, but in between there are a plethora of navaids and radar fixes to follow. Like this flightplan from Heathrow to Kennedy Intl:EGLL CPT4K CPT SHA BURAK UN533 MALOT TRAKC DOTTY J580 YQY J575 YQI STOOL PLYMM PLYMM4 KJFK>How's the sounds of the 767?Realistic. Which means no engine roars, just whines. And during cruise you don't hear the engines at all, just the fans from the ac blowing and the wind.

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You can just enter the dep and arr airports in the FMC then activate the route and it'll make a decent direct route for you. Or you can just fly it manually set to vor radials and ndbs( good to brush up on manual IFR) if you don't want to use the FMC. Well if you want the easy direct feature, guess we'll just wait and see if some progrmamer makes a MS Garmin like addon for the levelD or pmdg.(or find a way to hook up the MS Garmin 500 to the levelD/pmdg's autopilot, maybe have to make another addon switch to choose between FMC or GPS).But I agree it takes a while(at least more than a minute) to enter in routes in the FMC. What I usually do to streamline it is make a flight in flight planner. Then I pull up the kneeboard window with the flightplan. Then enter in an abbreviated course. If there are multiple waypoints and VORs on one Jet airway I just enter the beginning and ending skipping all the waypoints in between, So the overall flightplan may end up just 3 pages(along with adding dep and arr runways and sid/stars also). Just picking VOR to VOR may be the fastest way to route also. Need a programmer to write conversion programs to translate the LevelD XML format from MS flightplans and other formats to levelD/PMDG as well.

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I wasnt into FMCs until I got the PMDG 737....now I wont fly without it...

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Programming the FMC in the LDS 767 is essential, not just because of the route info but the weight and balance info, winds, runway selection. It just will not fly properly without the FMC being programmed correctly. If the weight and CofG data is not enetered the autopilot trim and engine thrust is all out of wack and is does not fly very well. In addition the FMC is required to get the IRS system aligned. Once you learn how to do it you can program the FMC in 2 minutes.Mark.

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OK, let me ask you a stupid question since as you know, I don't use FMC. If I wanted to fly from JFK to LAX or JFK to SFB, how would I find the jet routes or VORs to fly? Where do I look?JC

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You could do it a number of ways.1) You could use the FS flightplanner to find either a jetway or vor-vor route for you, write down the waypoints and enter them in the FMC2) You could use FSBuild or FSNav to create a flightplan in a similar way, in fact you can import these plans directly in most FMC's, so if you use these you need not input any route data in, also a few FMC's can read flightplans made with the default FS flightplanner.Dan.

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Man, I sure wish I could get on VATSIM. Tried twice but never could figure it out. Maybe the next release.....Doug

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