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Mephic

Default ATC for takeoff and landing only

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Is it possible to use default ATC for landing only with 737 NGX? 

What I mean is: 

 

Imagine a situation when I am flying from Airport A to Airport B. The takeoff is not an issue, default ATC handles it very well. Than I never switch to a frequency that controller provides after takeoff. What I need to understand, considering how bad ATC vectors, would it be able to pick me up somewhere in the middle of flying a STAR during approach and just give landing clearance, without vectoring me 50 nm from the place I am at the moment? 

 

 

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Simple answer: No.  The default ATC is brain dead, totally unaware of terminal procedures.

 

Most people enjoy the online ATC groups like VATSIM, maybe you should investigate that. There is an ATC addon that is much better than the default one, RadarContact, and it has it's merits and limits.  There's not much out there that comes close to real ATC.

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Yes you can! What you need to do is when you get the instruction for a freq change to a center, respond to it, so it won't nag you and cancel your flightplan. Do not though contact the new center until you want to continue ATC, When you want to connect again, contact the center, it will give you initial vectors, back where you left off. Ignore these instructions. It will continue giving you vectors, (Usually 3 to 5 times, maybe more depending on the distance and amount of waypoints are in your FP) only when it tells you to resume normal navigation, respond, then you should be good.

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You misunderstood me. I wanted to know if default atc can only provide clearance for landing after I am already flying a star or if they will start to vector me away from airport even though I'm almost there

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Get Pro ATC X, it makes P3D like an entirely new experience. I use it on every flight. Closest thing to real life ATC, which I have quite a few years  of experience with in very congested airspace. 

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How is the learning curve?

 

I am getting soon 777 probably with fs2crew so I will run out of funds for a while...

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You misunderstood me. I wanted to know if default atc can only provide clearance for landing after I am already flying a star or if they will start to vector me away from airport even though I'm almost there

 

I've tried to do this and, unfortunately, it doesn't work. The best I can get is the approach controller, even if I'm lined up on final. After landing, I do get instructions to contact ground. Needless to say, I don't do this anymore.

 

If you don't feel like talking to real people on Vatsim et al., Pro ATC X is doing a fairly good job of things these days. It still needs work, but the developer seems to be quite active, so it does look promising for future improvement. I also liked VoxATC at one time, but it's not P3d v3 compatible and the developer has gone quiet.

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Well let's see. Guess I need to rethink next purchases as the poor at bothers me more than lack of long hauls. On the other hand 777 is so tempting... well guess I still have some thinking. Thanks

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Is it possible to use default ATC for landing only with 737 NGX?

 

 

Yes, that's what I do. I just use the default ATC for clearance from the gate to the active runway for take off, the contact the arrival tower to get landing clearance and make sure the runways in use are the ones I planned to land on.

 

Between the take off and landing I may listen to the different ATC centers along the way but that's about it. I "self vector" myself the rest of the way using what ever DP and SID I had planned, sometimes even cutting those short.

 

 

Sean Campbell

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Yes, that's what I do. I just use the default ATC for clearance from the gate to the active runway for take off, the contact the arrival tower to get landing clearance and make sure the runways in use are the ones I planned to land on.

 

Do you tune the tower frequency in manually? The few times I've tried this, I've been stuck with the approach controller who never switches me over to tower. Only after landing does it switch me to ground.

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Pro ATC X is doing a fairly good job of things these days. It still needs work, but the developer seems to be quite active, so it does look promising for future improvement. I also liked VoxATC at one time, but it's not P3d v3 compatible and the developer has gone quiet.

Pro Atc X has a long way until it gets similar to the real thing, but I hope it can get there in the future.... Vox Atc is nice too, but development is very slow in my opinion...

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Here's a video of PROATC-X (In FSX-SE) to give you an idea what to expect.

 

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 I often do the same as cmpbellsjc. Tower on the way out and the way in all done as VFR even though I am most often IFR. The rest is done on my own. I like the idea of a good ATC addon, but none are up to task yet as there are simply too many variances in phraseology between countries. 

 

 

 

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I just check to see if both airports are VFR Wx. Usually they are, at least lately. My flights are short though. Anything more than a couple hours is too much.

I usually create an IFR flight plan for Active Sky to follow and give information for my flight phases, then if needed I can activate it in the sim for takeoff or landing clearance. Otherwise, in VFR Wx I just request departure to whichever direction I'm going and do my own thing. You can request a flight following or even VFR flight plan if you want. It's all the same really.

Then before descent I dial ATIS in to the VHF-2 radio and wait for active runways. Once I get that I can put the runway I want and/or expect into the FMC. Such as tonight, I flew into KSNA and figured it'd be 19R (I'm on old NavData in sim and on paper). I have all the charts and plates from 2007 so they match pretty good for the data in the sim. I just planned on 19R and once I knew it was active, I plugged it in and kept on my descent. Worked out better than usual. The only aggravation were the hand-offs. Lots of them in that vicinity. Once I figure I'm close enough to find the airport on the menu, I pick it from the list and ask for landing clearance. Works fine for VFR Wx.

In IFR conditions and using IFR flight plans with default ATC, they work better than most people give them credit. They actually work too well for turboprops and small GAs. They will clear you down at an acceptable rate to approach altitude with little issue. They don't work as well with fast moving jets that don't like to slow on descent, such as the NGX or most swept-back aircraft. The clearance to descent is often too late. It will come close to the FMC path but that doesn't accommodate the need for slowing and leveling off at certain points. I've easily been 2000 feet or more too high before due to ATC. Happens much less often with turboprops or planes that slow on descent when needed. You can wash off a lot of altitude in some aircraft but jets need to level, regardless of spoiler deployment.

With IFR plans, the best method is to tell the controller once you get vectors to an active that you want to chose an approach. Start the descent, then pick a different approach from the list in ATC. Most will give a transition point. Usually it's the IAF. For KSNA, where I flew tonight, ILS 19R can be chosen with POM as an IAF. I think SLI is a choice as well. The issue then becomes, pick your IAF from the ATC menu and ATC clears you direct to that waypoint. That almost always throws off your descent calculations and put you too high. The only way it works okay is if the IAF is downwind a ways and that gives you time to lower your aircraft. The next issue is that your IAF is often too far away. For me to pick POM for 19R coming downwind, it takes me so far out of the way and pretty darn low. Just because you can be at 3500 feet AGL at POM heading towards the next waypoint, doesn't mean you should be. It's like over 20 miles from the airport. You'd want to be picking up the GS at 9.7 miles and 3300 AGL. So being at 3500 AGL twenty or more miles out is stupid.

Now, you can alter or create approaches with Airport Design Editor. I can go in and simply change the POM altitude to a more appropriate altitude and ATC will give me that. Or I can even add a different IAF, such as SAGER or SNAKE and that would be better. Then the issue again only becomes having ATC clear you down without screwing your speeds, et cetra.

 

I'd imagine with some creative editing you could add a STAR or partial STAR to an AFCAD, but no matter what the ATC only lets you head direct to your chosen IAF.  So it's best to put in an IAF with acceptable altitude and accommodate the plan that way.  Not unrealistic but no matter what, you're gonna have issues with descent clearances being timely.

 

I've never liked the add-on ATC packages.  They all sound horrid.

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If you are flying airliners as I do , not being able to fly SIDs and Stars is totally unrealistic. 

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