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J van E

ProATC/X problem

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Yes, I know they have a forum of their own but after spending 10 minutes to re-register I found out I didn't have access to ANY of the support forums so that's why I am asking this here...

 

I started using ProATC/X again (after a few years of not using it) in P3D v3.1 and I like it but I keep on running into the same problem: whenever I pass the last waypoint of a STAR before the first waypoint of the approach ATC clears me back to that previous waypoint and I end up flying in circles around it. This has happened on all my last flights (3). Anyone has an idea what might be the problem?

 

Example:

 

I was assigned the RANUM STAR:

https://www.ippc.no/norway_aip/current/aip/ad/enbo/EN_AD_2_ENBO_4-11_en.pdf?cachebust0615

After passing GISDO and flying towards the assigned OSLIP IAF:

https://www.ippc.no/norway_aip/current/aip/ad/enbo/EN_AD_2_ENBO_5-1_en.pdf?cachebust0615

I was cleared to GISDO again. I was vectored there using HDG and it kept on clearing me towards it even after passing it a few times.

 

I'd like to solve this problem because so far I do like ProATC/X, even though it doesn't do VFR. I specially like the unobstrusive interface (no huge panels on screen like Pilot2ATC) and full support for AIRAC (unlike PF3). Somehow P2A v2 still attracts me although it's a shame it doesn't interact with AI. ProATC/X doesn't do that often but it does do it. ProATC can also automatically plan the correct SID and STAR based on ASN weather: in P2A you have to plan things yourself and it can only use real time weather from another source. I probably will try the P2A v2 demo whenever it will be available because it can do VFR.

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ProATC sometimes does that. I've noticed it also. Sometimes it's a fault in the correct order of waypoints, but sometimes the reason is not clear (at least not to me). I guess you know this already, but you can bypass this by asking ATC a direct-to clearance to the next waypoint. It's not a real solution, but al least you can continue your flight.

Als je het nog niet wist, probeer het maar eens Jeroen.

 

regards,
Jan

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Ah, clever about that direct to: didn't think of that.

 

Dat ga ik zeker proberen, Jan! ;)

 

BTW I am surprised how easy it was to get into ProATC. Of course I used it before but that was years ago. It certainly doesn't seem to be a complicated ATC addon (unlike others). Easy to use and I am flying with procedures and all within no time, really! Works even faster (a lot faster!) then setting up a flight with Plan-G and then figuring out the procedures myself using charts online and the GTN 750.

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I agree. One weak point of ProATC is the planning of trans-atlantic flights. I doesn't know NAT's and it just generates a whole bunch of waypoints across the Atlantic.

When flying trans-atlantic, I always use PFPX (with actual NAT's) and then import it into ProATC, but quite often it still doesn't recognise the NAT-route and generates it's own route across the Pond, sometimes in one go from coast to coast. In that case I have to add the NAT-route manually.

Otherwise: it's indeed a great ATC tool!

 

regards,

Jan

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import it into ProATC, but quite often it still doesn't recognise the NAT-route and generates it's own route across the Pond, sometimes in one go from coast to coast. In that case I have to add the NAT-route manually.

 

ProATC uses a different route naming for coordinate waypoints, than PFPX (more info on the support forum). If you enter they waypoints in ProATC compatible format (and don't let ProATC to autocalculate) the route, you should be fine.

 

Other option would be to export SquwkBox3 format out of PFPX and then import it into ProATC. If you do so, please double check the resulting ProATC flight plan, because sometimes PFPX adds departure and arrival waypoints, that shouldn't be in the plan (this is the reason why I import all of my routes using copy/paste flight plan import).

 

---

 

As for missed waypoints. I does happen from time to time. This is why it's good to have the ProATC's moving map open during the flight. As already mentioned, requesting DCT should get you out of trouble.

Edited by Jarkko

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New buyer same problem. Happened twice here, not the third time, however.

 

I discovered myself the option "Direct to" as a workaround, but got a "Negative".
It would be nice if there were an option to simply update the active waypoint manually in such cases, but there is not or I was unable to find it so far.

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If you get "negative" as a reply, you are already on the arrival or approach phase of the flight (where ProATC will deny DCT requests). If it happens too often, please post a log on the forum. There usually has been a good explanation what has caused the missed waypoint (I usually get a missed waypoint once every 80 flight or so => about once a year).

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You have to look at the log to see what happened. My suggestion is to register at their forum, post the problem, along with the log of the flight you are having a problem with and they will give you a solution. A;s as Jarkko suggested always look at your moving map as you pass a waypoint, to see if the next waypoint shows up. 

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If you get "negative" as a reply, you are already on the arrival or approach phase of the flight (where ProATC will deny DCT requests). If it happens too often, please post a log on the forum. There usually has been a good explanation what has caused the missed waypoint (I usually get a missed waypoint once every 80 flight or so => about once a year).

 

Yes, that is true. I tested PRO-ATC/X on a short flight. I lost a waypoint and when I asked for a direct I was already on the arrival phase.

I will try this again on a longer flight. Thanks for your input.

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Yes, that is true. I tested PRO-ATC/X on a short flight. I lost a waypoint and when I asked for a direct I was already on the arrival phase.

I will try this again on a longer flight. Thanks for your input.

 

You will get  a negative if you are too close to the next waypoint that you want to go to. I have asked for and received direct to's after entering the star, many times. 

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ProATC uses a different route naming for coordinate waypoints, than PFPX

 

I assume that's on the list of bugs to be fixed? After all, it is a specific format selection in PFPX. They should surely match! (And of course both should abide by normal rules for ICAO Flight Plans)

 

Pete

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You will get  a negative if you are too close to the next waypoint that you want to go to. I have asked for and received direct to's after entering the star, many times. 

 

Yes, this is exactly what happened. As I said, it was a short flight I made for test. I bought the product two days ago and tested no more than 3 times so far. I am positevely impressed, though.

So you are telling me that in general when I ask for a direct, I get it, unless I am on the Arrival or Approach step, is it correct?

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I assume that's on the list of bugs to be fixed? After all, it is a specific format selection in PFPX. They should surely match! (And of course both should abide by normal rules for ICAO Flight Plans)

 

Pete

Hello Pete,

 

Unfortunately Jan hasn't stated which flightplan format he tried to import, PRO-ATC/X imports FSX plans generated by PFPX without issue including the NAT waypoints it is not however aware of the active NAT tracks.

 

EDIT:

 

Squawkbox plans do not contain NAT waypoints, only the track designator which PATC cannot interpret

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Unfortunately Jan hasn't stated which flightplan format he tried to import, PRO-ATC/X imports FSX and Squawkbox plans generated by PFPX without issue including the NAT waypoints it is not however aware of the active NAT tracks.

 

Thanks for correcting me!

 

I meant to say: about copy/paste import NAT track waypoint from other sources than PFPX (I know I said PFPX, but that was a typo). First think you need to do is add a DCT between NAT track waypoints and the ProATC's coordinate format was different than the source (I don't know which), that some of the ProATC users were using.

 

EDIT:

 

I have to search the forum for the right coordinate format, so it will be easier to give examples.

Edited by Jarkko

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Did another flight and first of all: ProATC is totally awesome when it comes to ease of use. Simply entering the departure and destination is enough to get you going: you don't even have to think about procedures because ATC will assign them to you with name and all. (You CAN already see them during the planning phase but you don't have to.) During the last flight I got unexpected direct to's twice during departure which saved me some time. That was quite nice. But the approach went wrong again. But this may also have to do with the AIRAC not being in sync with the GTN 750 database. It's a pity the latter doesn't support Navigraph: I will have to wait until I can get a hold on the right database upgrade to match whavever Navigraph cycle I can get. In the end I closed ProATX and simply flew the assigned ILS myself. ProATC also was way too late with the TOD: I ended up some 4000 feet too high at a certain moment and had to dive down with 2000 f/m to make the assigned altitude at the last waypoint of the STAR. Seems like it doesn't read the f/m I set up in my Legacy profile...?

 

But well, there is more than enough to like about ProATC: as I said I like the very mimimal interface. You can interact with ATC simply by pressing numbers and without using a popup screen or panel (unless you want to ask something specific). And creating the flightplan has never been easier. Since I already own this one I might as well forget about the others.

 

Think I will buy the latest Navigraph AIRAC cycle now (1602) and hopefully I will get a hold on the same cycle for the GTN 750 soon: that might solve various problems I am having now.

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