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Bobsk8

Here we go again.

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This is my issue.  I'm too heavily invested in P3D to start over.  

That might be the excuse for a lot of people, but it stands to reason that many people would have a long standing vested interest in a platform like FSX and/or P3D.  You have FSX and P3D, both using similar architecture and are cross-compatible.  Form the consumer standpoint, it was wise to buy the content, knowing you could install one in to another and back again.  With XP, it's different, and it also stands to reason that people would be apprehensive to invest in a new platform, but if the positives outweigh the negatives with regard to performance and visuals in XP vs. P3D/FSX, then you chalk it up as evolution and all that was spent was really to support the developers future.  Ever since P3D v2, I'd had hopes that subsequent versions would change "bits", but it has yet to happen.  XP changed over a while ago, and I have seen a serious difference in performance and visuals, so now I am taking a step back to look at the long term in who to invest in.

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There is a good deal of interest in XP11 by the FSX/P3D crowd if the activity on the boards indicates anything and, long-term, it may not.  I was very interested in XP10 when it was first announced but didn't stay with it.  Whether the current interest in XP11 translates into actual purchases is another thing.

 

There is a desire for 64 bit; there is also a desire for something different. But at the same time most of us want the familiarity of a sim we have grown used to.

 

I think I read on the Orbx forum (JV, I believe) that over 65% of Orbx users now have P3d as their number one choice when compared to FSX. If Lockheed were to launch a v4 64 bit P3d then I think it would likely be a winner.

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Cheers,

Geoffrey Easton

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 Ever since P3D v2, I'd had hopes that subsequent versions would change "bits", but it has yet to happen.  XP changed over a while ago, and I have seen a serious difference in performance and visuals, s

 

I don't disagree with you.  

 

I think XP - even in it's default state, is more appealing now than it has ever been before. Much cleaner interface, genrally good looking visuals, an amazing looking 737 model.    My flying however is purely heavy metal and has been for the past two years.  I love my 737, 777 and soon to be 747. They are the only aircraft I fly and would be hard pressed to give up my current platform.

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There is a desire for 64 bit; there is also a desire for something different. But at the same time most of us want the familiarity of a sim we have grown used to.

 

I think I read on the Orbx forum (JV, I believe) that over 65% of Orbx users now have P3d as their number one choice when compared to FSX. If Lockheed were to launch a v4 64 bit P3d then I think it would likely be a winner.

 

The VA I flew with for about a year, which is very active and has many real world pilots in it's membership, publishes which sim the members are using every month. Here are the stats for last month.  

 

# of flights and sim version used on those flights. 

 

 

 

          FSX       3,110 (70.8%)

          P3D          546 (12.4%)

          FS9         579 (13.2%)

          X Plane    159 (3.6%)


 

BOBSK8             MSFS 2020 ,    ,PMDG 737-600-800 Fenix A320, FSLTL , TrackIR ,  Avliasoft EFB2  ,  ATC  by PF3  ,

A Pilots LIfe V2 ,  CLX PC , Auto FPS, ACTIVE Sky FS,  PMDG DC6 , A2A Comanche, , Milviz C 310

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FSX 3,110 (70.8%)

P3D 546 (12.4%)

FS9 579 (13.2%)

X Plane 159 (3.6%)

The demographic distribution and platform usage data across the board will be very different depending on the source of your data. Mainstream forum polls are likely to show very similar usage patterns compared to one of very many VA's - many users of which would not necessarily frequent forums and vica versa.

 

An interesting set of stats there nonetheless. I didn't expect that, but in retrospect, not surprised, considering the source

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I think XP - even in it's default state, is more appealing now than it has ever been before. Much cleaner interface, genrally good looking visuals, an amazing looking 737 model.    My flying however is purely heavy metal and has been for the past two years. .

My flying is purely GA, but I will stick with P3D, too. And, yes, I bought XP11 and will follow its further development with interest. Aside the fact I spent 1000's of Euros for P3D, I still prefer the overall visuals of P3D, while I have to admit the OSM concept aside a few flaws seems to fit better than the P3D LC concept in general.

 

I am sure LM will find an answer to XP11 - acutally they certainly already found one and only wait for the proper moment to release it. They can't be that stupid to just sit and watch half of their commercial customers switching to the commercial XP11 license, can they?

 

Kind regards, Michael

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pmb, on 30 Nov 2016 - 2:33 PM, said:

I am sure LM will find an answer to XP11 - acutally they certainly already found one and only wait for the proper moment to release it. They can't be that stupid to just sit and watch half of their commercial customers switching to the commercial XP11 license, can they?

It depends on whether XP (or any other platform) is truly viewed as 'competition'. I am still of the view that the common individual user within a small arm of the LM empire doesn't feature highly in any pecking order. It may however be that a higher number of subscribers makes it easier to justify the continuance of the P3D platform, although I thought you and I are only really convenience factors (for testing) in a much bigger and more financially lucrative world of professional flightsims and training schools - not to mention the expansion of P3D into other arenas of combat and training other than flight.

 

I think a good way to estimate the number of common users is to look at the number of subcribers to popular Youtubers. Take Matt Davies or Froogle for example - I'd say those two are the most popolar Youtubers in the flightsim world. They average 50 000 subscribers each - and they mostly fly with P3D. Let's say every subscriber to their channel was also a P3D user paying $199 a pop for a license - that's roughly $10m worth of subscriptions per full release version every two years. That is not an insignificant amount of money by any stretch of our imaginations, but I'm not sure if a multi -billion dollar industry firm (whose missiles are worth $1m a pop) will blink or not at that figure - and therfore whether they are really concerned about what Ausin Meyer has done with XP11 - certainly not from a commercial standpoint.

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The VA I flew with for about a year, which is very active and has many real world pilots in it's membership, publishes which sim the members are using every month. Here are the stats for last month.  

 

# of flights and sim version used on those flights. 

 

 

 

          FSX       3,110 (70.8%)

          P3D          546 (12.4%)

          FS9         579 (13.2%)

          X Plane    159 (3.6%)

 

Actually, I've found the quote which was indeed by JV on 25 October..

 

"Well over 65% of Orbx customers are now on P3D V3. Enough said really ..."

 

Perhaps not quite what I said but you get the gist.


Cheers,

Geoffrey Easton

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The demographic distribution and platform usage data across the board will be very different depending on the source of your data. Mainstream forum polls are likely to show very similar usage patterns compared to one of very many VA's - many users of which would not necessarily frequent forums and vica versa.

 

An interesting set of stats there nonetheless. I didn't expect that, but in retrospect, not surprised, considering the source

 

I don't think that forum posts are indicative of the use of a particular sim. If you look at many forums, you will see that probably 75% of the posts are submitted by maybe 15-20 members at most . One sees the same names over and over again even on one thread. 


 

BOBSK8             MSFS 2020 ,    ,PMDG 737-600-800 Fenix A320, FSLTL , TrackIR ,  Avliasoft EFB2  ,  ATC  by PF3  ,

A Pilots LIfe V2 ,  CLX PC , Auto FPS, ACTIVE Sky FS,  PMDG DC6 , A2A Comanche, , Milviz C 310

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I don't think that forum posts are indicative of the use of a particular sim.

I'm not talking about posts or posters, I'm talking about polls on sim usage run by the forum owners - generally all common users of fora tend to participate in polls, whether they post or not.

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I don't think that forum posts are indicative of the use of a particular sim. If you look at many forums, you will see that probably 75% of the posts are submitted by maybe 15-20 members at most . One sees the same names over and over again even on one thread.

The Avsim forum statistics I linked to was number of views, not posts.

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Wasn't there an official AVSIM simulator usage poll which might be considered more representative? Neither would I consider the Aerosoft poll some time ago (certainly XP biased) nor the ORBX usage statistics (certainly P3D biased) as representative.

 

Kind regards, Michael


MSFS, Beta tester of Simdocks, SPAD.neXt, and FS-FlightControl

Intel i7-13700K / AsRock Z790 / Crucial 32 GB DDR 5 / ASUS RTX 4080OC 16GB / BeQuiet ATX 1000W / WD m.2 NVMe 2TB (System) / WD m.2 NVMe 4 TB (MSFS) / WD HDD 10 TB / XTOP+Saitek hardware panel /  LG 34UM95 3440 x 1440  / HP Reverb 1 (2160x2160 per eye) / Win 11

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if LM stick with the same core ESP engine thats 10 + yrs old then no, they wont be able to compete with xp11. I for one a fsx user since fs95 till p3d 3.4 have at least taken it upon myself to try out xp11 after seeing some videos on youtube of what it is capable of doing. I tried it out , had a little difficulty at first but man once you get it going, its amazing. just for the night flying alone its worth it.  Once xp11 gets released and all the xp10 addons work coupled with the new  weather engines that are coming out soon, i may not go back to p3d, its that good.

My flying is purely GA, but I will stick with P3D, too. And, yes, I bought XP11 and will follow its further development with interest. Aside the fact I spent 1000's of Euros for P3D, I still prefer the overall visuals of P3D, while I have to admit the OSM concept aside a few flaws seems to fit better than the P3D LC concept in general.

 

I am sure LM will find an answer to XP11 - acutally they certainly already found one and only wait for the proper moment to release it. They can't be that stupid to just sit and watch half of their commercial customers switching to the commercial XP11 license, can they?

 

Kind regards, Michael

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I think a good way to estimate the number of common users is to look at the number of subcribers to popular Youtubers. Take Matt Davies or Froogle for example - I'd say those two are the most popolar Youtubers in the flightsim world. They average 50 000 subscribers each - and they mostly fly with P3D. Let's say every subscriber to their channel was also a P3D user paying $199 a pop for a license - that's roughly $10m worth of subscriptions per full release version every two years. That is not an insignificant amount of money by any stretch of our imaginations, but I'm not sure if a multi -billion dollar industry firm (whose missiles are worth $1m a pop) will blink or not at that figure - and therfore whether they are really concerned about what Ausin Meyer has done with XP11 - certainly not from a commercial standpoint.

 

Microsoft didn't care about the 100+ millions they cashed in from FSX sales... 


Simmerhead - Making the virtual skies unsafe since 1987! 

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