32bit addons for 64bit P3D usable?

[DylanM 1,069]

That isn't revolutionary, that's a totally new sim. And so that won't happen. If LM wanted those things they wouldn't have used the FSX engine. V4 will be an update of v3: you can't expect anything else. Still, LM may have some surprises up their sleeves. The cloud shadows came as a big surprise too and that was with a regular update, not even a new version! No one (well, maybe one or two) really knows what they have in store. The did announce more news at the start of 2017 so... stay tuned.

No - I can expect as much as I want :wink: That's the wonder of vacillating in cyberspace. Any of the wish list items could be be mutually exclusive...or not. And as we've seen with LM, they certainly aren't ones to shy away from rocking the boat. Remember, the DX10 preview button in FSX was fairly wonky out of the box...but was a feature that matured (despite no formal support).

[denali 74]

The addons that do burrow into P3D memory space for data or to change anything are the ones that you will have to repurchase, for certain.  I am still not sure that it is impossible to open a 32bit DLL for a specific 32bit api, if it follows the rules and keeps within the menu of the 64bit api (I wouldn't expect that many changes), and use it in a 64bit memory space, using a 64bit "translator" for the DLL (every time I read about this I think about what a solution may look like).  At any rate, if a scenery company is still alive and wants to keep being relevant it surely won't be that painful for them to recompile a few files, not very wise for them not to IMHO.  (I don't like boxes or rules, especially when all the rules in software are made-up by somebody to begin with).

To elaborate.  Would it be possible to have a 64bit dll that interfaces with a 32bit dll, not to connect to a running version of the 32bit dll, but to port the available calls to 64bit, and run that in the vast 64bit space.  This would be done on the load, but speed at runtime would not be affected.

[denali 74]

Maybe I'm laying out an idea here that would allow working with older addons.   Not looking to make a general DLL translator, but one at lest specific to one addon, if not P3D only.  In other words, the API expects a certain format for the responses in a DLL.  If a 64bit module can figure out where the responses are coming from in the 32bit module, a data file, then maybe it is possible for the 64bit module to make the connection to the data itself.

[Richard Sennett 2,499]

P3D V4 will not be a from the ground up new looking sim with all new eye candy - I think it will look the same or close to it but be 64bit

 

why do I think this because it would take years to develop a sim from the ground up and they haven't been working on 64bit that long - thats what I would put my money on 

 

And I will add DTG's offering will not be any different than your current FSX look at Their Flight school and do the math

[Manny 1,293]

 

 

Project P

 

Mike,

 

This I assume.

 

Project P - Our continued commitment to our strongest platform and it has a huge backing. More refinement, more performance, more destinations from Orbx than ever before. An old friend gets better, faster, stronger, bigger. Oh, and it will be 64-bit.

 

 

 

K.

 

thanks,

[Richard Sennett 2,499]

Mike,

 

This I assume.

 

Project P - Our continued commitment to our strongest platform and it has a huge backing. More refinement, more performance, more destinations from Orbx than ever before. An old friend gets better, faster, stronger, bigger. Oh, and it will be 64-bit.

 

 

There you go exactly what I just posted  :wink: Orbx has stated this knowing its not going to be entire different offering from LM - it cant be - not enough years has passed for that not to be the case

[DylanM 1,069]

 

 

P3D V4 will not be a from the ground up new looking sim with all new eye candy - I think it will look the same or close to it but be 64bit

 

As per my previous comment, let's hope there's a bit more foresight in platform development (things don't need to all shiny on day 1...!).

 

And amazing what eye-candy you can squeeze from an old engine. Just look at x-plane.

[pmb 5,138]

P3D V4 will not be a from the ground up new looking sim with all new eye candy - I think it will look the same or close to it but be 64bit

 

why do I think this because it would take years to develop a sim from the ground up and they haven't been working on 64bit that long - thats what I would put my money on 

 

Who tells you they didn't work on this for years in parallel? I recall vague hints on 64 bits from LM several years ago and quite definite hints for more than a year. And LM isn't just a five man team. I'm pretty sure they have the most manpower among the present flightsim contenders. 

 

There certainly is no guarantee this will pay off, but I am optimistic in this regard.

 

You are certainly right not to expect a new sim from scratch, though. But let's face it, all sims on JVs secret list - Aerofly, Dovetail's XXX, P3D, and XP - are based on many years old code, and for a reason.

 

Kind regards, Michael

[Richard Sennett 2,499]

Who tells you they didn't work on this for years in parallel?

 

No one told me anything - dont have to - pretty obvious as you have stated "But let's face it, all sims on JVs secret list - Aerofly, Dovetail's XXX, P3D, and XP - are based on many years old code," thats the point I was making

 

For me personally I didnt have oom issues with P3D so 64bit was not high on must haves list

[ricka47 614]

Who tells you they didn't work on this for years in parallel? I recall vague hints on 64 bits from LM several years ago and quite definite hints for more than a year. And LM isn't just a five man team. I'm pretty sure they have the most manpower among the present flightsim contenders. 

 

There certainly is no guarantee this will pay off, but I am optimistic in this regard.

 

You are certainly right not to expect a new sim from scratch, though. But let's face it, all sims on JVs secret list - Aerofly, Dovetail's XXX, P3D, and XP - are based on many years old code, and for a reason.

 

Kind regards, Michael

 

Good point - they may indeed be further along in this than we may think.

[him225 51]

They may be old code but there is a difference in working in continuation of your own code and on someone else's code. The former will have lesser hesitation in changing things at the core while things will always be comparatively conservative and complicated with the latter.

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

Our flight sim market and community is so small... Because of that I will be more than happy to repurchase most of my current addons if P3D becomes 64 BIT and we will have to (depending also on Deweloper strategy) to support our community. 

Sadly, I won't.  If a 64 bit comes, which it looks like it is, I will port over all my Orbx catalog, if you can, will pick up about three planes in up-grade price, and that will be about it.  I have spent $$$'s...and oh $$$$$$$'s of dollars on this hobby, and need my funds to bring in new action, not my already purchased vast catalog, because of a 64 bit change up.  

 

I think it is great that they are finally doing this...and that for future hobbyists, they can start their hobby at 64 bit for M.S. based sims.  This IS great.  For those like me...with a pretty serious investment in 32 bit add-ons...not so much.  If you have deep pockets, or 'young' ones, cool.  For those at,... or near retirement...well, I can't speak of course for everybody, only myself.

 

As far as 64 bit, on my system,  I have XP 10 and maturing to full release, 11.    With my latest purchase for that franchise, the weather engine, XEnviro, I am all set up in the 64 bit department. I have never really had an issue with OOM's, because I don't fly commercial, high fidelity cockpits in any MS based sim, other than FS9.  So...the heat has never been upon me, for 64 bit VAS room.  I know, for other's this is the best news they have read.....for they do! 

[FireRx 18]

Good for you, it never happened to me (in 35 years). I guess the keywords here are "major" and "significant", as these apply to the addons too. If that is the case for flightsim addons is probably a matter of debate. I shouldn't have made my statement so broad, my mistake.

 

About "developers should let us know" - spoken for myself - I can't. I have no idea whatsoever about what is to come. If enough changes happen, I would have to redevelop my addons from scratch (they are all programmatic in nature). The market as a whole and the P3D niche especially are way to tiny to warrant that kind of effort (especially if it is supposed to be a free update). In 2 years with a developer account at LM's, I have never received any notice about project plan or roadmap (or any other information for that matter). Once the platform is released and/or specs are available, a decision will be made.

Lorby

 

I for one would be the first to pay a fee for an upgraded Firefighter X sir. :smile:  Love that program.    I been putting the bug in all my add-on folks ear via forum, email or phone call. (since REX is local for me)  the majority know about the upcoming x64 bit sim and I understand the NDA limits what they can confirm but I'm pretty confident I will be able to pretty much have the most of same aircraft and scenery I already own,  the only one I haven't heard bac from is Ricardo of the RIo X sceneries.  most of us that have been on P3D for a while know how to test sceneries, turning off/ and on .bgl files at airports and all to see if things work.  I betting the list of scenery not able to work will be in the minority,.

[jabloomf1230 2,445]

These threads tend to pop up now and again, probably because P3d's journey to 64 bit has been agonizingly slow. The smoothness of the transition will depend on a variety of factors and no one outside of LM and their beta team has any concept of what the final product will look like.

 

1. It could be solely 64 bit or it could have parallel 64 and 32 bit versions ala XP.

 

2. It could retain the ESP file formats like BGL, MDL, AIR and XML gauges. This approach would certainly allow for a fairly smooth upgrade path to 64 bit. Texture file formats like DDS are wedded to DirectX so that's not likely to be abandoned either.

 

3. It could retain SimConnect which would allow external apps and DLLs to communicate with P3d V4.

 

4. Basically, the biggest losses going to 64 bit will the various GAU gauges which are just DLL libraries. Although via some clever coding it is possible to have a 64 bit app access a 32 bit library, it is usually not worth the effort. Sony used this approach which allowed its video editing apps to access 32 bit libraries.

 

5. It is also possible that P3d V4 will be split into multiple apps that communicate via SimConnect. I tend to doubt this approach will be used, but you never know. Adobe used that approach with some of its apps in making a transition to 64 bit.