McChester

Assignment of individual throttles

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Hello PMDG team, I am looking very much forward to explore the Austrian alps with the 6 - nevertheless, I encountered a problem during my first session.

My setup: Saitek Cessna Yoke and three axis throttle quadrant. For all aircraft, I have set up my throttles via FSUIPC - two engine aircraft with throttle 1 for lever one and throttle 2 for lever 2. For four engine aircraft I have engines 1+2 for throttle 1 and engines 3+4 for lever 2. So far so good.

My problem: I found that when configuring the PMDG DC-6 via FSUIPC it would not work. No problem I thought and wanted to send the Axis assignments for this particular aircraft direct to FS - also to no avail. Finally I completely ignored FSUIPC for testing reasons and still no individual control of throttle levers - If I assign a lever to throttle 1 in the P3D settings, it stays centered and does not move. When I assign said lever to all throttles, they do work without a problem. Any ideas?

P3Dv4, Input set to Raw.

Alexander Arlow

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Assigning in the sim kills the whole idea of assigning different hardware configurations depending on the aircraft.. will try it later though.

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3 minutes ago, scandinavian13 said:

Assign in the sim. Process in FSUIPC.

Please reread my posting - for testing purpose I have completely omitted FSUIPC - to no avail.

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19 minutes ago, MatzeH84 said:

Assigning in the sim kills the whole idea of assigning different hardware configurations depending on the aircraft.. will try it later though.

I asked in order to help troubleshooting. If you'd like to push back, then you can troubleshoot on your own if you'd like. Up to you.

19 minutes ago, McChester said:

Please reread my posting - for testing purpose I have completely omitted FSUIPC - to no avail.

You said "ignored." This is unclear. Please define "ignored" and be more specific if you'd like to point back to things you've already said as if it makes things immediately clear for people attempting to help you.

Please read the forum rules about including your name in your posts, too.

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2 hours ago, scandinavian13 said:

You said "ignored." This is unclear. Please define "ignored" and be more specific if you'd like to point back to things you've already said as if it makes things immediately clear for people attempting to help you.

Please read the forum rules about including your name in your posts, too.

You did not inquire any additional info but served me a generic oneliner that you used in another thread before. As I said in the opening post (which provides a name btw), for testing purpose I kept FSUIPC out of the configuration loop and removed all assignments and configurations from FSUIPC; thereafter I mapped my throttle axis to "throttle 1" and it was stuck in the center of the throttle range. I just reset my FSUIPC.ini (deleted it) and now I can assign lever 1 to trottle 1 in the P3D axis setting and it is not stuck in the center of the range anymore - there was probably still a link from the first attempts to get the throttles running.

So now the follow up question: How to map a two lever setup in a way that lever 1 controls engines 1+2 and lever 2 controls engines 3+4 without FSUIPC?

Alexander Arlow

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13 minutes ago, McChester said:

So now the follow up question: How to map a two lever setup in a way that lever 1 controls engines 1+2 and lever 2 controls engines 3+4 without FSUIPC?

I was about to ask a very similar question.  I've got 6 levers available and was wondering, before I buy the aircraft, whether it was possible to have 1 lever control engine pairs for throttle, prop and mixture without FSUIPC?  I know it's not possible via FSX:SE controls settings but does the addon come with its own control configuration "utility"?

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1 hour ago, McChester said:

So now the follow up question: How to map a two lever setup in a way that lever 1 controls engines 1+2 and lever 2 controls engines 3+4 without FSUIPC?

Alexander Arlow

You can still process the controls in FSUIPC, just assign the axis in FSX/P3D. In FSUIPC axis calibration tab, on the page with throttles 1,2,3,4, bottom right corner there's a tick box that has something along the lines of 1->1,2 2->3,4. Tick that.

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1 hour ago, AndyUK said:

I was about to ask a very similar question.  I've got 6 levers available and was wondering, before I buy the aircraft, whether it was possible to have 1 lever control engine pairs for throttle, prop and mixture without FSUIPC?  I know it's not possible via FSX:SE controls settings but does the addon come with its own control configuration "utility"?

See my above re. throttles, there might be a similar setting for mixture etc. as well.

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The only thing that worked for me was to assign and calibrate my throttles in P3D. Even trying to calibrate only in FSUIPC was a no go. Everything else is still assigned and calibrated in FSUIPC, and all seems to be working. 

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3 hours ago, McChester said:

You did not inquire any additional info but served me a generic oneliner that you used in another thread before.

Okay. I can't read minds. The fact that I used the line before is of no relevance, because you did not differentiate your issue from elsewhere.

3 hours ago, McChester said:

(which provides a name btw)

Names are required in every post btw

3 hours ago, McChester said:

So now the follow up question: How to map a two lever setup in a way that lever 1 controls engines 1+2 and lever 2 controls engines 3+4 without FSUIPC?

Dunno. Get inventive. We made a product that fits into a simulator. If your interface isn't working, find another one.

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Wow, this is Carenado level support i would expect for a 25 € plane, not for 70 € and over 590 € over the past years (and almost no support inquiries from my side). Its not the fact that it does not work, it's the fact that at first you did not even take the time to understand customer's (my) problems and then you get smart by just saying I shall be inventive - a feature that works with every 4 engine plane but yours? I had enough, and could I get a refund I would - not because this is a bad plane, but because I will never support such an attitude towards customers.

Case closed, I will not bother you again with any requests or purchases.

Alexander Arlow

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9 minutes ago, McChester said:

Wow, this is Carenado level support i would expect for a 25 € plane, not for 70 € and over 590 € over the past years (and almost no support inquiries from my side). Its not the fact that it does not work, it's the fact that at first you did not even take the time to understand customer's (my) problems and then you get smart by just saying I shall be inventive - a feature that works with every 4 engine plane but yours? I had enough, and could I get a refund I would - not because this is a bad plane, but because I will never support such an attitude towards customers.

Case closed, I will not bother you again with any requests or purchases.

Alexander Arlow

Did you try what Chris wrote few posts above?

 

You can still process the controls in FSUIPC, just assign the axis in FSX/P3D. In FSUIPC axis calibration tab, on the page with throttles 1,2,3,4, bottom right corner there's a tick box that has something along the lines of 1->1,2 2->3,4. Tick that.

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5 hours ago, scandinavian13 said:

I asked in order to help troubleshooting. If you'd like to push back, then you can troubleshoot on your own if you'd like. Up to you

I said I'd try it out later. And I said that not being able to use FSUIPC and having to use P3D configured axis kills the whole sense behind FSUIPC (pointing out that this should not stay a permanent solution), regarding automatic addon bindings, spike filtering etc.

I wasn't offensive at all and get such a 'nice' answer? I'd rather sort it out on my own then, thanks.

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6 hours ago, AndyUK said:

I was about to ask a very similar question.  I've got 6 levers available and was wondering, before I buy the aircraft, whether it was possible to have 1 lever control engine pairs for throttle, prop and mixture without FSUIPC?  I know it's not possible via FSX:SE controls settings but does the addon come with its own control configuration "utility"?

I have 6 levers on my throttle quadrant assigned via FSUIPC without calibration (important). I use the most left one for engaging the reverser lever, then 4 throttles and most right for RPM. Mixture control  is done by clicking from autorich to autolean to autorich. This change is onle to be done twice: once you reach cruise and second time when you plan to land.

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Thanks for that.  To summarise what I've gleaned from this thread so far:

The addon doesn't itself contain any means of assigning control axes so the only way of assigning an axis to a pair of engines or to a function not available in the FSX:SE controls settings dialog is to use FSUIPC.  Am I correct?

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12 minutes ago, AndyUK said:

Thanks for that.  To summarise what I've read here so far:

The addon doesn't itself contain any means of assigning control axes so the only way of assigning an axis to a pair of engines is to use FSUIPC.  Am I correct?

Yes thats correct.

A working FSUIPC setup is here, but first unassign the axis' in the P3D controller menu:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/p4p3pttpv1enybg/PMDG_DC-6B_Throttle.jpg?dl=0

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42 minutes ago, AndyUK said:

Thanks for that.  To summarise what I've gleaned from this thread so far:

The addon doesn't itself contain any means of assigning control axes so the only way of assigning an axis to a pair of engines or to a function not available in the FSX:SE controls settings dialog is to use FSUIPC.  Am I correct?

See Wothans FSUIPC settings above.

It seems you are correct. Since mapping my controls inside P3D is not an option on the long run, since I have so many different airplanes and many different input devices I figures out a solution that works for me:

I downloaded a tool called vJoy (http://vjoystick.sourceforge.net/site/index.php/download-a-install/download) which creates a virtual software joystick device not directly linked to a physical joystick. And then I installed a little tool called UCR (https://autohotkey.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=12249) that allows you to map any physical axis to any logical axis of your virtual joystick. I start UCR only when flying the DC6.

Thereafter I exported the control settings into an .xml (to get the base data of the virtual joystick written into the xml file), changed the axes manually in the xml file, imported and voila - I have now eng1+2 on lever 1 and eng3+4 on lever 2 without altering any configuration of my other aircraft. (You need to create an FSUIPC profile for the DC6 where you delete any assignments and calibrations for that particular aircraft).

Hope that helps.

Alexander Arlow

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13 minutes ago, McChester said:

It seems you are correct. Since mapping my controls inside P3D is not an option on the long run, since I have so many different airplanes and many different input devices I figures out a solution that works for me:

I downloaded a tool called vJoy (http://vjoystick.sourceforge.net/site/index.php/download-a-install/download) which creates a virtual software joystick device not directly linked to a physical joystick. And then I installed a little tool called UCR (https://autohotkey.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=12249) that allows you to map any physical axis to any logical axis of your virtual joystick. I start UCR only when flying the DC6.

Thereafter I exported the control settings into an .xml (to get the base data of the virtual joystick written into the xml file), changed the axes manually in the xml file, imported and voila - I have now eng1+2 on lever 1 and eng3+4 on lever 2 without altering any configuration of my other aircraft. (You need to create an FSUIPC profile for the DC6 where you delete any assignments and calibrations for that particular aircraft).

Hope that helps.

Alexander Arlow

Hmm alot of work for this - did You see my FSUIPC setup for a similar setup ?

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7 minutes ago, Wothan said:

Hmm alot of work for this - did You see my FSUIPC setup for a similar setup ?

I did now, and that works - problem on my end was that I set the axis assignments as "Throttle x" and not as "Axis throttle x". With "Axis throttle x" it works like a charm and it is the much easier solution, thanks for that. Thats proper support :)

Alexander Arlow

Edited by McChester
Inserting my name

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58 minutes ago, McChester said:

I did now, and that works - problem on my end was that I set the axis assignments as "Throttle x" and not as "Axis throttle x". With "Axis throttle x" it works like a charm and it is the much easier solution, thanks for that. Thats proper support :)

Alexander Arlow

I´m happy to hear :happy:

I wonder with PMDG's high knowledge about FSUIPC, that they could not give the same information, and offcourse note that this should work, though unsupported by them.

That way You would have been helped and they would have their path clean for any additional problems.

FSUIPC has worked for me for ages now, including PMDG aircraft, but sometimes it can be cumberstone to setup right.

Ggenerally if FSUIPC gives trouble with Axis' assignments, using "Send to FS as Normal axis" together with "Axis [function N] Set" works. That's what I have used on all kind of complex addon aircraft.

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4 hours ago, Wothan said:

I wonder with PMDG's high knowledge about FSUIPC, that they could not give the same information, and offcourse note that this should work, though unsupported by them.

No need for the snark.

You guys act like you walked in here and asked for help without giving me any push back about how we officially recommend using a - let me be very clear here - 3rd party interface into the sim. You guys pushed back on me offering up the simplest solution. While that's fine, do keep in mind that FSUIPC isn't our software, so to expect us to support it and have some official recommendation (apart from the one that was provided) isn't quite fair.

If you all are doing interestingly complex stuff in FSUIPC, then you're going to have to get inventive. To argue that we should be troubleshooting your interface for you, and then shaming me for not going out of my way to do so is not only disingenuous, it's not exactly reasonable. It's great that you all are doing cool things with your sims. I've wanted to try similar with throttle 1 controlling the left side and throttle 2 the right on my own hardware, but never wanted to put the effort in. I definitely wasn't going to fault anyone for their stuff not working when I tried it on my own. FSUIPC is a powerful tool, but it can take some effort to make it all work. I don't think it's reasonable to put all of that in the hands of the dev of the aircraft.

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Kyle...

Actually setting up Fsuipc the way I showed isn't more complex than doing the same in P3D's own interface.

Once You learn the 3 different way of setting up f.ex the Throttles..

Back when I was a developer, I also spend time doing support for new releases, including FSUIPC setups. I even helped a guy via email to setup his highly complex home cockpit - and that was for a 30,- Euro addon. So it's more a matter of will and attitude.

But You don't need to do the same here, cause we are plenty here to help each other. At least showing my solution ( I don't even use that profile myself) has made one more of Your customers happy.

But Your right - no more snarking here. From now on I will try to help out others without intriguring comments - sorry if You feel hurt.

 

(Thx btw for resetting my reputation points)

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Kyle, just an idea...

PMDG since now has always developed jets with FADEC or other auto throttle systems that regulate the power for you.. now on the DC6 being powered by radial piston engines you get 4 seperate engines to power up. You will unlikely find any multi piston engine aircraft that has the same engine readout on its engines just because the throttles position is equal. 

A2A for example have developed an input configurator that allows to assign the engines seperately to the hardware. I'M not sure, but I believe Majestic has done so too for the Q400.. Both have highly complexe addons that run outside the sim via Simconnect.. Of course I do not know if the PMDG radial engine simulation is comparable to Accusim or what Majestics is doing (which PLEASE is NOT meant to be downgrading!!!! just concerning the programming) but IF there is a possibility in the PMDG code, you could take something like this into consideration. The DC6 is MEANT to be FLOWN, not to be watched.. The AFE is nice for a beginning, but becomes boring quickly. PMDG provides study level and we are eager to learn to fly the DC-6 properly. And the engines are a very central part, all above on a radial engine airplane, that should be known and mastered by the Captain :D (that's how RSR calls us :P)

 

Please bear with my english.. I've learnt it as a foreign language more than 15 years ago ^^

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