This thread (whole topic) should be deleted.What's the point???PatAMD A64 4000+ @ 2.6GHz, Zalman7700Cu cooler, Corsair XMS 1GB DDR, LTK6800GT-OC, Asus A8V MoBo, WDRaptor10KrpmHDD, TrackIR4, CH FSYoke + TQ, XP-hsp2

Pat,For reason of ...? Insanity?Johan PlaneUppsala, Sweden-http://www.scandinavian-va.net/pilots/images/SE.gif

You're right to complain. All the more reason not to purchase products from developers which operate in this fashion - as good as the product is. You want service, and a very friendly download policy: buy from Flight One. I wish more developers would use the service.

The point is using this board as a FORUM to discuss things. If you see no point in this discussion then simply move on. If you see no point in discussing something that is controversial to the community then why are you here in the first place? Why post if you have nothing to add?I have to point out that PMDG's response to deleting my thread was because Vin felt the thread had "degenrated" into a verbal match between another poster and I because he disagreed with me. Indeed I did reply to that poster that I didn't appreciate his rude tone in replying to my original post. That was it. Didn't call him names, didn't flame him, etc. It never got truly offensive--on either side. Sorry that you guys can't see that for yourself since PMDG wanted to cover up the real issue--a customer complaint in a place where other potential customers go and might decide not to buy their products based on the negative feedback. Anyway since PMDG finally stated why they deleted the post (and making me look like a jerk in the process) I thought I should give my side of the story. Thanks again for listening.Regards,Pike

Does anyone know if when you checkout and they ask you if you want to buy the download service, they mention that you can just backup your download? It seems a little deceptive to make you think you need this to re-install if that is how it is presented.

I've been backing up my software addons since 2002. I have an external HD for backup purposes. I don't need to re-download products and go through the hassle of verification :-boom

spookymufu,"no add on for FS is worth more then $30 as far as I am concerned. The game cost $50 why would you by an addon thats more then the game??"You don

Backups fail, and sometimes software and installers become obsolete. I like PMDG but I think they should reconsider this policy. Or at least put a reasonable limit on number of downloads. If someone is downloading the software again and again and again I think they are entitled to charge a fee. That bandwidth costs money. But not just arbitrarily like this.My opinion.

Words from the wiseguy: Never forget, that when pointing a finger at someone, at least three points back at yourself.If you read my previous posting in this thread, I don't oppose to the principal issue - your posting was not a support issue, but a CRM thing - for which PMDG doesn't have a forum. This is regrettable.However, you as well as I, have to accept that moderators remove topics that are not conforming to the forum rules. And what is O/T is up to the forum moderator to decide - the judgement is in the eye of the beholder. It doesn't matter if the thread flames or not.Secondly, but perhaps most important, you do not sign your postings as per PMDG forum rules and guidelines. That in itself is reason enough to remove it. I must presume you have read the PMDG forum guidelines. I do find it quite unbelievable that you are christianed Pike, since that is a fish with a lot of small, but very sharp, teeth.Johan PlaneUppsala, Sweden-http://www.scandinavian-va.net/pilots/images/SE.gif

Hi,Please be more careful in your statements,In several of those posts I DID list my name as Matt Clement.Pike is a nickname I have gone by for some time. And having to post your real name certainly goes against what I thought was a basic policy here at AVSIM. So before you criticize, please be accurate.

And how would I know? That thread was removed, and the only posting that "Pike" has posted in the PMDG support thread is the one where you complain about the removal of your original posting. And that one is NOT signed. Neither is anything signed on your part in this thread, not that it's a requirement but it indicates to me that you usually don't sign your postings which is why I included that supposed "habit". If I was wrong, kindly excuse. But that's not really the point is it? You haven't commented on the first posting I made in this thread. So are we discussing a) or :( or maybee both?Johan PlaneUppsala, Sweden-http://www.scandinavian-va.net/pilots/images/SE.gif

The truth is this, that thread went downhill with folks including you doing nothing more than ad hominin attacks. PMDG's policy is their whether you like it or not. If you are telling me that in this day and age you are unable to backup your exe file then I would suggest you go out as soon as possible and purchase a acd writer today. I buy from most online vedors and have MANY cds full of all my exes. If you really believe that what PMDG are doing is so bad then please by all means READ BEFORE YOU BUY. Make slife that much easier. No one forces you to purchase. And for the ignorant, it goes like thisReplacement of Lost Download Products: Effective 18MAR06, PMDG has updated our Product Replacement Policy in order to serve you better. PMDG offers free download access to new product purchases for a period of seven (7) days. If additional downloads are required outside of this period, a customer must have purchased an EXTENDED DOWNLOAD SERVICE for each product that is to be re-downloaded.Extended Download Service costs $3.95/product and allows the user to receive additional downloads of their purchased product for up to 1 year from the date the Extended Download Service is purchased. ...............Randy J. Smith................A PROUD MEMBER OF THE PMDG BETA TEAM[h4]Evolution is a process that results in heritable changes in a population spread over many generations[/h4]

I don't usually sign my real name to posts, and frankly don't think its a great idea to do so in this particular day and age. I work in the banking industry as a Lending/Security Officer and its amazing how little people need to commit identity fraud. But that's PMDG's policy and I obeyed it--the first time. After disclosing that information once, I didn't feel the need to do that again. I guess a sig would help, but again using your real name in a unsecure environment carries very real risks.As for answering your question, the issue is both the fact that they removed a post for criticizing them (me not listing my name on EVERY post is a poor excuse) and requring me to pay $16 for access to products I spent over a $100 for, without having that requirement when I originally bought the products. Sure, companies change policies, but at least allowing me grace one time would have been appreciated. This discussion has been enlightning, and I appreciate everyone's views. Its clear that we all have our opinions on this subject, and I've enjoyed hearing your takes. For me, these two issues are enough for me not to want to do further business with PMDG. My loss? Perhaps, but I feel that there are plenty of other high-quality options available (the LDS 767 for instance) where customer support is still more important than making that one extra dime off a loyal customer. Anyway I keep saying thats it for me, but new posters bring up good issues and I'm terrible about keeping my mouth shut. Have to forgive me there! Thanks again for your opinions.

Randy,You have some major holes in your argument.1st: At no point did that thread even come close--on either side--to the degenerate behavior sometimes seen in forums. I ONLY stated that I didn't appreciate being talked down to like a 3-year old. Please don't come on this thread making statements like that which are GROSSLY inaccurate. 2nd: I explained what happened to my backup. Again read before you criticize.And lastly: Talk about ignorant. That statement DID NOT EXIST WHEN I DOWNLOADED MY PRODUCTS. HOW CLEAR DO I HAVE TO MAKE IT FOR YOU?Sorry for the caps, but you obviously decided to make a statement without really reading anything I have said and after all this time its very irritating when someone can't take the time to read through a thread before criticizing an opinion. And your right, life will be much easier with my new 767. A fantastic aircraft.

I use an external too, and its worked well until now. It was my fault, not the drive's. But thats when its nice for a company to support you instead of trying to make an extra dime off of you. It benefits me by having easy access to my aircraft when things go wrong, and its good for the company because I'll likely purchase more expensive products from them.