'Tdragger' since you guys did nothing with the default ATC, how hard would it be at this juncture for you guys to open up the default ATC code to allow third party venders to have more freedom in adjustments like adding SID/STAR procedures to default flight plans for example???Seeing we have another basic ATC system it would be nice if you guys opened the code up enough in an SDK for add-ons like 'Radar Contact' to fully utilize/tweak default features as much as possible (Add new voices, use of the default menu screen, speed restrictions, holding patterns at dense airports, etc)... Instead of Radar Contact looking like an add-on on top of FSX, it actually works within FSX... Looking at what we've seen in programs like Flight1's Ultimate Traffic and ASV6, I'm sure if enough options were made available in the SDK some mind blowing things could be accomplished using the default ATC system started by Aces. I would think everyone would be happy at that point as the real work of a fully featured ATC system would fall on the developers of Radar Contact (for example) versus Aces.

I don't know if that's possible or not. The SDKs will be available with the Deluxe edition in a few weeks.

Well 'Tdragger' by all means please check into this. It would be a great compromise if you guys could make this happen. Radar Contact 5 would be the add-on to get for everyone serious about ATC controlled flight (not that it isn't already but more so if it could be branched and built upon with the default system)... :-)

Just let the FSX SDK allow external programs to issue commands to AI aircraft (and thereby turn off the default FSX ATC).Wouldnt that do it? All FSX has to do then is make the AI aircraft follow the commands (heading, speed, altitute, and maybe holds too) issued by external ATC (eg radar contact).Surely the SDK can do this? It seems so simple. I mean the AI aircraft are currently being directed by the FS9 ATC, so i dont see why it could be so hard to let an external program issue the ATC commands.If Radar Contact was run on a seperate core then all the complex ATC "thinking" to handle SIDs, STARs, Airways, Holds, Backlogs etc would not impact FSX.Please! You can do it, I know you can. :)

>Surely the SDK can do this? It seems so simple. The idea is simple and doable but requires investment of some design/development time to put the required programming interface in place so you could access it through SDK. So unless ACES team had already done it there is little chance they would even start on this little project this late into the process.Michael J.http://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/for...argo_hauler.gifhttp://sales.hifisim.com/pub-download/asv6-banner-beta.jpg

"So unless ACES team had already done it there is little chance they would even start"The problem is it should have been thought about if they weren't going to do anything with FS9's ATC system in FSX... :-(I too think it would be a great idea if Radar contact could use the default menu for their commands. Sure would be better than the clunky setup in use now. It also would be nice if RC could use the default voices if need be...Guys Aces all but said screw it on the ATC front. A beefed up ATC SDK is a great idea but it won't happen. In three plus years of ATC being one of the most requested features updated (graphics/visuals not even on the list, go look for yourself), if this is all we got with no thought of alternatives then hang it up. At this point I wouldn't be surprised if the next version of FS found its platform on the next generation of XBOX (forget the PC option). Some of these great ideas in this community may need to go over to XPLANE in the next 4 to 5 years... Aces doesn't want better ATC nor will they help us make the default ATC any better (a harsh true fact considering the option presented here wasn't even thought about). Another hack job approach is all we can hope for with Radar Contact 5 (I know some will get upset with that statement and in all farness to the developers of Radar Contact, they are doing the best they can with what they've got from the FS developers). Aces at this late stage of the game helping developers out on the ATC front in the SDK is laughable to say the least. It's even more laughable to think online ATC will be manned all around the world 24 hours a day when and ware ever a simmer decides to fly (remind me to thank the guy who proposed this one)... I for one thought just like FS2k2, VC, and A320PIC that Aces would see the future with products like Radar Contact 4 and expand the default system or make it possible for developers to better utilize the default system (over what was done in FS2k4). It didn't happen. Even with the many request it doesn't look like it will happen.What's being asked in this thread is obvious but I'd be willing to bet it won't happen; in fact I'm sure of it... With all the pretty graphics and nothing real meaningful being expanded upon, I'd say it's about time to take this thing off the PC and put it on the XBOX360. Hardware would be much cheaper for all interested and the rest would have to move over to XPLANE... :-roll

Before you all get too pessimistic, I believe one of the features of the FSX SDK is a method of giving instructions to AI aircraft, including airspeed, altitude, heading, etc. I'm not directly involved with that stuff, so I hope I'm not misrepresenting it, but I think it's true.-Adam

If what you are asking for could be done by 3rd party, then I would absolutly buy it. In my opinion it's the big lack in FS.

That would be fantastic! But how do you know? A little birdie told you? :)

--> he works with tdragger and the gang ;)

I would assume he'd know more about it than most.I understand the dissapointment, but at this point it seems premature to say the SDK will not have this or that considering it hasn't been released as of this time. For all anyone is aware who has posted in this thread (except Adam or tdragger of course), the ATC SDK may be just what has been envisioned within this discussion to allow the RC team or other vendor to create very realistic ATC procedures beyond what has already been achieved with FS9.AI traffic in FS has had some command capabilities via RC and AI smooth with limitations, but reading a few of the blogs and posts on the forums it seems the interface between programmer and FS has been vastly improved allowing more variables to pass bettween a 3rd party program and the core product which will hopefully bring the ideas presented in this thread to fruition. Intersting ideas although a bit on the pessimistic side for the most part.Ian.

Adam is a member of the ACES team, who will be presenting at the AVSIM Conference as part of the FSX Showcase on Sunday. :-)

Currently in FS2004 there are a significant number of commands to AI aircraft which can be given by external programs.There have been two programs with completely different concepts which worked to resolve the traffic jam of AI aircraft on final.Radar Contact issues some commands to AI aircraft now.One of the significant enhancements of FSX which people tend to gloss over is the SimConnect API. For lack of a better term, and not having seen the actual product - it's been described as having the capabilities of FSUIPC on steriods.That statement may not be completely correct, but for the first FS has an interface designed into the base level to extract information and send that information to external programs / modules. It is also designed for those external functions to feed data and control commands directly into FS.One other word about SDK's.We have very good SDK's for FS2004. Like all SDK's, they are written for programmers and people who develop software and addons. They are not, nor do I expect the new ones to be, written as an instruction manual on how to make FS behave differently.If an AI aircraft behavior such as speed control is not written into the code, no SDK is going to tell you how to control AI aircraft speed.The behaviors have to be present first.A second point about SDK's is that many developers and people ignore them. They don't like the information about how FS does certain things and they choose to do them differently.Traffic Tools is a perfect example. Microsoft tells you that minute aircraft turnaround time for an AI aircraft is as real as the program can reliable handle.We CHOOSE to ignore that, write flight schedules with turnarounds as tight as 5 minutes - and complain because the buggy behavior which Microsoft told us would happen does occur.

Chris, with all due respect, you are painting yourself into a corner with an overly large brush and using the wrong color to boot... ;)Within a relatively short time FSX will be released with the SDKs included. Only after reading them carefully will anyone - outside of ACES themselves and those who're on the 'inside track' - will anyone be in a position to make definitive statements about what "can and cannot be done."

Apparently this guy has already obtained the SDK and related documentation and read through it all. How else could he come to such a conclusion :-lol