Hi all, 

The problem  

I have taken the decision that it is time for me to upgrade my GPU. I had been using the GTX 1070 since 2016 and for months now following the transition to P3D v4, I have become tired of the many visual compromises I had to make. More specifically, I have to always use 4x MSAA and I'm not even using a 4K display but an ultra wide 3440x1440. So, in short I have to live with shimmering and low res shadows. On top of that this GPU could not handle a combination of intensive add-ons with dense weather. Also, many times I had to turn down shadow quality or sim object shadows to get barely above the smooth 30 fps limit. Not to mention buildings and tree casting shadows which really make an immersion for me especially on dusk and dawn approaches and GA flights. Furthermore, being a DCS and X-Plane user, visually satisfying anti aliasing would always bring the fps down too. Before I decided that I need to upgrade, I made sure the GPU was been utilized 99% using gpu monitor software. It was obvious that the visual quality had to be compromised if I wanted to fly smoothly. 

 

My solution  

I had put some money aside for the purpose of upgrading and I have now sold my 1070. I plan to upgrade to the Gigabyte 2080 Ti  Gaming OC or the msi RTX 2080 Ti Gaming X TRIO. I know that many would advise for a 1080 Ti based on its lower price though I have two problems with that option. I can't find new ones and to me buying a used card  for 700-800 EUR does not sound a good deal. It's already a good amount of money to place. The RTX 2080 Ti is sure a very expensive card. I've never bought something that pricey. I know that  being solely a flight simmer I won't probably utilize the new ray tracing and DLSS technologies, but I can't overlook the fact that the 2080 Ti is around ~30% faster than the 1080 Ti and this is significant. Yes the price is close to 50% plus but I'm thinking at least I probably wont get GPU bottlenecked for a good amount of years. 

 

Some second thoughts  

Yesterday, I came across some reddit comments mentioning that Nvidia "will be releasing 7nm GPUs in 2019". Others said 2020. Others speculated that gaming 7nm GPUs will come even later. I read all these as speculations but with an open mind. I also understand that the gamer community is mostly composed of young people usually on a budget who have invested good money on GPUs and want to justify their decision to not enter the 20 series. I'm not a fan of paying if there is not a good reason either, however right now I want to enjoy flight simulator at its best and the 1070 seems not longer an option for the best visuals to me.  

 

Some maybe unanswerable questions  

So some inevitable second thoughts was raised: Will Nvidia release 7nm GPUs this year when they have announced a new gaming flagship just some months ago? Even 2020. Isn't that too early to expect their 20 series customers to spend more money in 1-2 years? Also, is really a need for better performance for flight simulation? I've seen reports that Ray tracing drop the frames significantly for >60Hz users however we happy 30Hz simmers, should we enter this hype for even more performance? It is certainly ugly to pay gold for a 2080Ti and in a year see a 30% more performance GPU released for the same amount of money or less. On the other hand, maybe I won't need more than a 2080 Ti for a good number of years. I tend to believe the latter should be the case, though you can always get surprised by how fast computer graphics evolve.  

 

Purpose of this thread 

So why I wrote all this. I know that the avsim community has a wide gamut of users and taking this as a fact I'd like to ask what is your opinion about this situation. Do you think buying the flagship gaming RTX is not the best solution? Or do you think I'll need anything more than that the next 4-5 years?  Also anyone with any insider or expert view on the 7nm speculations, I'd be happy to hear his opinion. 

Edited January 10, 20197 yr by Daedalus

I replaced a pair of 1080Ti GPUs with a single 2080Ti.  Performance-wise, the 2080Ti edges out the 2X 1080Ti config, but without all the hassles that come with the SLI config (flashing when using PDK features like TrueGlass, driver issues, etc)

I am very happy with the card's performance (I'm using an eVGA variant).  Ray Tracing was not a real consideration--my sole focus is on a powerful GPU that brings it in DX11 on a machine dedicated to P3D.

Will nVidia come out with something better?  Yes, undoubtably--they always do.  If you serve that master, you'll never ever upgrade, because there will always be something mo'-faster-better on the horizon.  The real question is whether it will do what you need now and for a reasonable time to come.  Yes, I think it will.  It's a significant move up--a 1070 to a 1080, a 1080 to a 1080Ti, and a 1080Ti to a 2080Ti are each a solid notch up the performance ladder in their own right, so 1070 to 2080Ti is a pretty big jump.

Your 21:9 WQHD monitor has a pixel count 40% smaller than the 4K UHD monitor I'm using, so you should be able to run very aggressive AA at that resolution without having frame rate limited by the GPU.  I easily run 4xSSAA pegged at 30fps with heavy clouds at 4K...but even with a 2080Ti I have to dial back the AA (to 4xMSAA) at night with DL on if I want to hold 30 fps.  Moral of the story is that even Rob Ainscough with an overclocked 9900K and two 2080Ti GPUs can't just throw the whole kitchen sink at it with impunity--but the amount of compromising that has to be done is FAR less with a powerful GPU in P3Dv4.

Regards

Thank you very much for the reply Bob. I appreciate very much your time to explain further your experience. I went for the msi Trio variant of the 2080 Ti and I only have to wait some time for my vendor to have it in stock. According to benchmarks the jump from my 1070 should be close to 100% increase, so I'm very curious to see the improved image quality. I agree with you, waiting for a better faster model will always have you waiting instead of flying. So, I am happy with my decision. Its a pricey move but I anticipate it will pay off with a good number of years of not being limited my GPU. Thanks again, and I will also post my reviews when I have the card in hands. Again thank you for your very useful input. 

Edited January 10, 20197 yr by Daedalus

1 hour ago, Daedalus said:

According to benchmarks the jump from my 1070 should be close to 100% increase, so I'm very curious to see the improved image quality. 

Hi Daedalus - When I moved from a GTX1060 to the 2080Ti, I had dramatically improved performance [roughly 8.5 times].  Before removing my 1060, I created a scenario with the FSL A320 (engines running) at FB KMSP (gate F10) at midnight with DL enabled and both taxi and landing lights on.  This scenario represented a situation I wanted to enjoy with great FPS, but knew I couldn't with the 1060.  My FPS was 4.7.  I saved the scenario and backed up my P3D settings.  After installing the 2080Ti, I reset P3D settings to what I had with the saved scenario, then loaded up that same KMSP scenario.  I was floored to see 40 FPS.  The improvement for my specific PC configuration was dramatic, to say the least.

I have since been able to significantly raise P3D settings and now enjoy excellent FPS in all situations.  Couldn't be happier.  I hope the same for you.

1 hour ago, Daedalus said:

Thank you very much for the reply Bob. I appreciate very much your time to explain further your experience. I went for the msi Trio variant of the 2080 Ti

I recently upgraded my 1080(non Ti) to the MSI Trio 2080Ti.... absolute game changer.  Get ready to have your mind blown... so much smoother at sharper graphics settings.

 

Couple points about the MSI Trio... it’s and absolute pig... it’s huge compared to the 1080.  I’m a little worried it’s weight is going to break my MB connection.  It comes with a mounting bracket but I couldn’t get it to work.  I’m sure it will be fine though 😃.  The other thing is my old 1080 only needed one 8-pin power connection.  The MSI Trio requires two 8-pin power connections and one 6-pin power connection. So make sure you have the extra power cables as it doesn’t come with any.

 

Enjoy dude... you picked a good card.

53 minutes ago, dmiannay said:

I created a scenario with the FSL A320 (engines running) at FB KMSP (gate F10) at midnight with DL enabled and both taxi and landing lights on.  This scenario represented a situation I wanted to enjoy with great FPS, but knew I couldn't with the 1060.  My FPS was 4.7.  I saved the scenario and backed up my P3D settings.  After installing the 2080Ti, I reset P3D settings to what I had with the saved scenario, then loaded up that same KMSP scenario.  I was floored to see 40 FPS.

That sounds like the 1060 didn't have enough Vram to deliver on that scenario and used shared memory. Fire up that scenario again and see how much of the 2080ti's 11gb are being used. If its more than the amount of VRam on your 1060 that will explain the very low 4.7fps with the 1060. Not doubt that the 2080ti will deliver a big improvement over 1060 but I would be willing to bet that if the 1060 had sufficient Vram for that scenario it would have delivered a much higher FPS. Perhaps the 2080ti will deliver "double" the performance of a 1060 but to determine that you would have to use a scenario the did not simple exceed the limitations of the1060 while being within the limitations of the 2080ti. The Bottom line: I suspect that low fps is solely the result of running out of memory on the 1060 at which point it uses shared memory which kills it completely.

Edited January 10, 20197 yr by Guest

2 minutes ago, Avidean said:

That sounds like the 1060 didn't have enough Vram to deliver on that scenario and used shared memory. Fire up that scenario again and see how much of the 2080ti's 11gb are being used. If its more than the amount of VRam on your 1060 that will explain the very low 4.7fps with the 1060. Not doubt that the 2080ti will deliver a big improvement over 1060 but I would be willing to bet that if the 1060 had sufficient Vram for that scenario it would have delivered a much higher FPS. Perhaps the 2080ti will deliver "double" the performance of a 1060 but to determine that you would have to use a scenario the did not simple exceed the limitations of 1060 while being within the limitations of the 2080ti. The Bottom line: I suspect that low fps is solely the result of running out of memory on the 1060 at which point it uses shared memory which kills it completely.

I appreciate, and agree with your analysis.  However, my point was, all things being equal, the move from a 1060 to a 2080Ti was dramatic.  Simple results from a simple A-B comparison.  The reasons for the improvement are not as important as were the results.  I'm hoping Daedalus has a similar result.

Hi, I'm currently in the process of configuring my RTX 2080 ti to provide optimal smoothenss and quality for p3d. I upgraded from a gtx 980 ti which I used for years and I'm on 4K with a 6700K at 4.6 GHz now.

First thing I noticed was a huge improvement in picture quality. For me blurries went away or are hardly noticeable and you can use highest texture resolutions without any problems. So the ground view is sharp and crisp and if you have the right add ons the card is a game changer in that regard.

But also with this card you will have to make compromises regarding graphic heavy settings. So even with this card on some add on airports at night with DL, bad weather, high AA settings you can bring the card to its knees with ease - just to guide your expectations into the right direction.

I can use 8xMSAA, FXAA on and DSR 1.5 without any problems in all conditions. All kinds of AA Supersampling are unusable for me at night.

Btw still using 4.3. here - maybe in 4.4. DL has been improved.

I still recommend this card you will be impressed - it delivers more than all other cards but not everything.

br

Mark

 

Edited January 10, 20197 yr by boss128

3 minutes ago, dmiannay said:

I appreciate, and agree with your analysis.  However, my point was, all things being equal, the move from a 1060 to a 2080Ti was dramatic.  Simple results from a simple A-B comparison.  The reasons for the improvement are not as important as were the results.  I'm hoping Daedalus has a similar result.

Indeed, no criticism of your comparison intended and it is certainly valid regardless of the reason for the difference.

REDACTED as potentially irrelevant (sorry for the post)

 

Edited January 10, 20197 yr by Henry Street

Thank you all very much for your very helpful inputs. I am very happy to hear that you have a so positive impression for the 2080 Ti and it seems that my decision will be rewarded. My 7700K should do the job for the time being. I understand that there can still be intensive scenarios especially at night where some compromises will still be needed, but I am sure as you agreed it will be much less than my previous 1070 would require and this is why I decided to upgrade. Again, thank you everyone for your help to validate my decision. 

Edited January 10, 20197 yr by Daedalus

18 hours ago, Daedalus said:

Thank you all very much for your very helpful inputs. I am very happy to hear that you have a so positive impression for the 2080 Ti and it seems that my decision will be rewarded. My 7700K should do the job for the time being. I understand that there can still be intensive scenarios especially at night where some compromises will still be needed, but I am sure as you agreed it will be much less than my previous 1070 would require and this is why I decided to upgrade. Again, thank you everyone for your help to validate my decision. 

Just to add very satisfied 2080ti user here as well.  This is coming from 1080ti SLI.

I am still waiting, I have the eVGA 1080 TI FTW3 and the 2080TI FTW3 is still too expensive, I see that on Amazon Germany they have for example just one available at 1536 euros. The 1080 TI FTW3 was clearly more reachable so to saying. That should say something to Nvidia.

Edited January 13, 20197 yr by Vali

I also considered the Asus and Evga variants, but at least where I live these were 100 and 300 euros move expensive. Given that the msi Trio has already a good stock overclock I think its the 'best' value/price ratio. And I put 'best' in brackets, cause its already a very expensive upgrade, however elevating the cost even more for little if any benefit is not a good deal to me. That's why I decided to go with the msi Trio.

Edited January 14, 20197 yr by Daedalus