Hello all,

I am not wishing to start a fanboi war with this one.

I am simply looking at a birthday pressie for mine good self in October and this will be in the form of an upgrade for Flight Sim (only)

I have looked at the systems below and really seek some advice.

Intel                                                                                              AMD

CPU  core i7-9700K (see below)      AUD600                              Ryzen 7 3800X                         AUD630

M/B   ASRock Z390 Pro 4                 AUD220                              X570-A PRO Taicchi Ultimate   AUD300 (see below)

RAM DDR4 3000   2 x 16gb              AUD510                             DDR4 3000  2 x 1gb                  AUD510

Intel AUD1,300.00   vs   AMD AUD1,440.00 (who would have thunk it???)

I will be retaining all 7 of my SSDs and HDDs, my Power supply 1200w, and my GTX1080ti 

Now for my queries...

1. Core i7-9700 is 8 cores and 8 threads. Given probable/likely advances with P3Dv5???  (next gen) and XPlane 11 with Vulcan, due soon, am I better off with 8 cores and 16 threads (ie better CPU than the i7 9700k)

or find something with more cores/threads? I am not really into the core i9 stuff mainly because it is probably beyond my budget and the performance difference (with current Flight Sim Platforms) is,in my view,  marginal.

Please bear in mind that my current  i7-2600k (unclocked) is coping at the moment but barely.  Performance wise, FS2004 remains supreme but getting more and more irrelevant.

With regard to the X570, I anticipate no PCIe4 requirement so do I opt for an x470 in lieu, although I believe you can get X570 without the PCIe4.

I would expect that there will be no or few simmers who operate both systems but I would really appreciate some informed opinion on what options would be best for both, the P3D and XPlane future platforms.

Regards to you all

Tony Chilcott

I would say no on the 570 mobo. Overpriced atm and the need for pcie4.0 is long off.

Also something to consider, if you run stock (which seems to be the best bet on the ryzen 3's with the precision boost) you can keep the cooler that comes with the 3800x, on the 9700k you will need to buy a stout cooler, which should factor into your price.

I would honestly say if all you are doing is flight sim, intel still reigns supreme. If you do some other stuff like content creation as well as sim, then the ryzen would be a solid choice. Furthermore, it looks like you might save a bit for basically the same performance with a 3700x. Id probably go that route if i was choosing the ryzen.

I think either one would be a massive step up over your current system. And I doubt you would notice the couple of fps difference the overclocked 9700k would give you. Not like we are talking 30fps vs 120fps. I assume you are doing 1080 resolution with the fs9 running..

Edited August 4, 20196 yr by CaptainNick
added context

Nick,

Thanks for your reply mate.

You are absolutely correct with 1080 and FS9. and obviously the same for xplane and P3D.

I looked a little further and apparently, there are quite a few X570 boards available without PCIe 4 (cheaper than a top line X470)  but I am essentially looking to future proof.

As an aged pensioner, this is more than likely my last upgrade and if nothing else I am looking for a good system to run P3Dv5 (with the new engine) and XPlane with vulcan.

Am I better off with a top end x470 specifically for that reason. I am also concerned that the i7-9700 (apart from the cooling aspect) is only 8 core and 8 thread as opposed to 8/16 with the ryzen.

The 7-3800X Ryzen by the way, is only AUD30.00 difference in price 

Is the core i7-9700 the best CPU for flight simming in the i7 range and what would be the better alternative without going to Core i9 (beyond my finances)

Flight simming is the only use for this computer apart from emails and  occasional streaming of movies.

The other aspect is whether to go 2k or 4k TV (not monitor) and that would depend on price at time of purchase.

Thanks again

Tony

Short reply:

poo (personal experience & opinion only)

Recently upgraded to i7 9700k on ASRock Taichi Z390 and 2080ti and the results are awesome in FSXse, P3Dv35 and 4, FS2 and XP11. Using 4k moniitor with additional 24" monitors for flt plans and atc.

CPU is running at 4.9ghz on all cores and that seems to satisfy the requirements of those simulators with details cranked up.

Cheers,

Edited August 4, 20196 yr by ppo

Pierre,

Mate, I believe it would be truly awesome particularly after upgrading from my system. I also believe that the AMD system would be truly awesome and I don't think anyone

should be critical of either system. 

What I am after though is which system is, theoretically at least, going to handle the new and highly anticipated platforms best. I say this largely because I am somewhat anxious about buying a system that handles everything very well now, but next year (after the anticipated releases) I have something which will not handle the new ones well at all. 

Given that, as an aged pensioner, this is very likely to be my very last upgrade for flight simming and I am wanting it to be a really good one for the future. 

In short, both systems are going to be pretty good for 2019 and I have no doubts about that. It is 2020 onwards that I am trying to outfox LOL

Thanks for your input and "poo" is fine with me, mate

Regards

Tony

 

What I am after though is which system is, theoretically at least, going to handle the new and highly anticipated platforms best.

I doubt someone will be able to answer that one unless he has a crystal ball.. and even then...

Anyways, best of luck with your system Tony.

Cheers

1 hour ago, ppo said:

What I am after though is which system is, theoretically at least, going to handle the new and highly anticipated platforms best.

I doubt someone will be able to answer that one unless he has a crystal ball.. and even then...

Anyways, best of luck with your system Tony.

Cheers

It's not really a matter of having a crystal ball, performance is measurable, and fortunately for us, the performance of the CPU architectures in question has been measured time and time again.  Intel's Skylake architecture (6-9th generation Core CPUs) is faster than AMD's Zen 2 architecture (Ryzen 3000 CPUs) in games (i.e. real-time 3d applications).  This is mostly a result of the fact that Intel's CPUs run at higher clock speeds than AMD's.  With previous generation Zen and Zen+ (Ryzen 1000 and 2000) CPUs, there was a measurable, meaningful difference in the amount of work performed per second by these CPUs, however that gap has largely been closed now with Zen 2.  

Anyway, all of this has been hashed out many times on not only this forum but across the internet on tech sites.  If you care about having the best performance in games, Intel still wins that battle.  

Ryzen 3000 CPUs are overall very good processors that offer good bang for your buck.  I wouldn't tell someone not to buy one, except under very specific circumstances.  Gaming as a primary workload is not one of those circumstances.  If you want to buy a Ryzen 3000 just to play games - have at it.  9th gen Intel i7/i9 chips are on average a few percentage points faster in the majority of games, with that gap growing whenever overclocking is introduced into the equation, but it never results in a night and day difference between the gaming performance of the CPUs in question.  

Personally, I've stuck with Intel since the Core 2 generation.  AMD has yet to produce a faster processor for games in the 13 years since the launch of the Core 2.  They're getting closer though, and I absolutely consider offerings from both companies every time I build or upgrade a PC.  

fyi

the crystal ball comment was linked to "the new and highly anticipated platforms best"

Cheers,

1 hour ago, ppo said:

fyi

the crystal ball comment was linked to "the new and highly anticipated platforms best"

Cheers,

That doesn't change anything. Is it a real-time 3d application? It will run best on Intel.

Hello to you all,

Thank you so very much for all of your responses.

At this time I am thinking of going Intel i7-9700k, Noctua NH-D15 cooler with ASRock z390 Steel Legend and 32gb Corsair dominator 3200MHZ RAM. As previously stated, I will retain my case, power supply, GTX1080ti, and my 4 SSDs and 3 HDDs All up cost is going to be AUD1340.00.

My only concern at this time (I think both the AMD and Intel systems would be more than adequate for P3Dv4 and XPlane 11) is core and thread numbers for the new engines on both platforms. Again, I wonder if more cores/threads are going to be more beneficial as opposed to outright single core speed, and, with the i7 9700k I am punting that it will not make all that much significant difference.

PPO ... I understand/understood what you were saying and therein was my dilemma ... I cannot for the life of me buy a genuine crystal ball here ... They are ALL bloody fakes LOL

For TechguyMaxC ... I agree with you totally and I have followed your system faithfully.  Until now, AMD has not really been in the ballpark but very close to it and getting closer. As you said, neither system is going to be shamed with the current platforms ... be nice to have the money for an i9 system but .. Again, it will come down to what difference the new engines will make.

I have to say that this has been an interesting (at least for me) conversation with you all.

Regards

Tony

In regards to future platforms, it is really really hard to say.

If games start taking more advantage of multiple cores, since they have been around for over a decade then I can see it going to the route AMD is favoring (more cores etc, though I'm sure Intel wouldn't be sleeping either), but as long as they stay focused on basically single thread, max clock speed Intel will be on top, although the gap is significantly less now days then it was 5 years ago. Even then at the FPS either put out with comparable processors, I don't think anyone could tell the difference in actual use, its only when you have the FPS monitor etc up would you see it.

I think either way, having now chosen the 9700k you should be ok for the next several years, especially with flight sims. I doubt P3Dv5 will be that much harder to run than v4, and hopefully they take advantage of more of what modern cpu's can do besides crank the Gigahertz up.

If you are waiting until October, I'd wait until the Ryzen 3950X is released (supposedly in September) to see how that performs. Also, Lisa Su (AMD CEO) announced high end 7mm video cards for the 4th quarter or early 2020. You can check tomshardware or similar sites for more information. Even if they don't perform as well as Intel/Nvidia, I bet there will be downwards pricing adjustments as those are released.

Best of luck making a choice....

P.

43 minutes ago, pgde said:

If you are waiting until October, I'd wait until the Ryzen 3950X is released (supposedly in September) to see how that performs. Also, Lisa Su (AMD CEO) announced high end 7mm video cards for the 4th quarter or early 2020. You can check tomshardware or similar sites for more information. Even if they don't perform as well as Intel/Nvidia, I bet there will be downwards pricing adjustments as those are released.

Best of luck making a choice....

P.

The eternal hope of AMD fans - just wait until the next release!

I say - buy when you're ready.  There's always something faster just around the corner.

As for these specific releases, the 3950x isn't going to be any faster for flight sims than the 3700/3800/3900 as more cores don't increase framerate, which is what matters most to most simmer.  It's literally the reason you buy/build a new PC.  As for the next GPU from AMD beating out NV's high-end parts - I'll believe it when I see it.  

Still an Intel CPU to be released are they holding it back for the 3950x release, they would not do that would they.

Hello guys,

Thanks again to you all.

Let me just say that waiting till October is simply a financial thing. Waiting for the 3950x goes into the category as an absolute necessity if, I could afford to even consider the i9 9900k or the 7- 3900x. And, again, I would only consider the Ryzen, IF, the new platforms are going to make better use of the extra cores. That aspect, in itself, is what sparked this thread in the first place and if that (use of more cores) was the case I would not be looking at Intel at all.

I have the GTX 1080ti and unless Nvidia or AMD start a give away of their latest, I cannot afford either regardless of how good each one is ... they have simply priced themselves out of my market to the extent that if my 1080 blows up, I would have to give up simming until I could afford to throw some AUD2000 at a hobby,  sorry ... llifestyle. Apart from that, I don't think at this stage AMD has anything that beats the 1080ti as yet, but the next gen may go a little closer to the performance of Nvidias' latest, and I cannot imagine anything happening in Flight simming that would make the 1080ti absolutely and instantly obsolete. 

In the final analysis, nothing at this time is carved in stone and the good thing is that, in October, I may be able to extend my budget to go either i9 or 3900x and it would appear that the extra cost of the cooler for the i9 or i7, makes the total expenditure of both systems very similar. If I could just find out how the new systems are going to handle cores, that makes a decision very very much easier.  Can anybody tell me where to find that elusive bloody crystal ball in Indonesia?????

Thanks guys for all your input

Regards 

Tony 

PS Australia won the cricket