10 hours ago, Wobbie said:

FS4

Thanks for the link, Wobbie.

I actually just took Sublogic FS1 for a fly via emulator (the linked emulator for the Apple 2 is too old to work, but the flight sim roms are fine).

Sublogic's first sim was dreadful! It is amazing that we are all here after such a terrible start to the FS series. 

If you've never flown these old sims, it's worth doing so just to realize how far things have come.

Edited July 16, 20205 yr by n4gix
Removed unnecessary long quote!

16 minutes ago, OzWhitey said:

 

Sublogic's first sim was dreadful! It is amazing that we are all here after such a terrible start to the FS series. 

 

The first Sublogic sim was B&W and running at 2 FPS on my A2. Dreadful ? Such is the power of our imagination that I found it amazing then. We had had nothing like that before.  Imagination, the best addon of them all.

Is this thinking based on any reseach about MSFS?

Edited July 16, 20205 yr by Rimshot

2 minutes ago, Rimshot said:

Is this thinking based on any reseach about MSFS?

It is just an opinion based on my experience with flight simulators and on the real evidence that after 2 and more years of "Alpha" versions, you cannot finish a so long work with 15 days "Beta". I'm absolutely not comfortable with this.

Well, the sim has been in development for a number of years already. I have high hopes the released product will be quite nice. It is a start however, but the team have stated multiple times it is a long term project, so expect a lot of updates and fixes in the coming years.

Edited July 16, 20205 yr by Rimshot

On 7/15/2020 at 5:45 AM, LHookins said:

MSFS isn't perfect, but in places it gets close.

Hook

I have that feeling with clouds in P3D even with EA on 🥶

Note from Moderator: Please do not quote a long post when replying! 

Edited July 16, 20205 yr by n4gix
Removed unnecessary long quote!

44 minutes ago, OzWhitey said:

Thanks for the link, Wobbie.

I actually just took Sublogic FS1 for a fly via emulator (the linked emulator for the Apple 2 is too old to work, but the flight sim roms are fine).

Sublogic's first sim was dreadful! It is amazing that we are all here after such a terrible start to the FS series. 

If you've never flown these old sims, it's worth doing so just to realize how far things have come.

Found memories here, amazing we found that great stuff and dreaming what the future would bring...

Amazing to read that a lot of us are 30+  years in this hobby 😎

27 minutes ago, Dominique_K said:

The first Sublogic sim was B&W and running at 2 FPS on my A2. Dreadful ? Such is the power of our imagination that I found it amazing then. We had had nothing like that before.  Imagination, the best addon of them all.

Yes, I loved my first Sublogic flight sim too. I actually wrote my first sim - for the Commodore Vic 20 -  back in 1983. Sadly, the tapes have deteriorated and the sim is lost forever, unless you were a member of Melbourne computer clubs in the 1980s, in which case you might have a copy! Would be amusing to see it in action again,

From flying Sublogic's first Apple sim today, I'd say that the programmers only had a rudimentary idea of how planes work. "Hmm...you steer a boat with a rudder, I guess planes work the same way."

If you want to try the 1st sublogic sim, get the modern applewin Apple II emulator from here: https://github.com/AppleWin/AppleWin

 And then go to this page - https://fshistory.simflight.com/fsvault/fs1-apple.htm - from the site that Wobbie linked, and click the download emulator + FS image link.

Teh emulator is ancient so it probably won't work for you, but you can just take the fligthsim disk images from it - a2-fs1.dsk and a2-fs2.dsk - and use them in the newer emulator.

Do this, and you'll be flying at 3 fps, in a plane which has no ailerons, in no time at all!

 

39 minutes ago, Dominique_K said:

The first Sublogic sim was B&W and running at 2 FPS on my A2. Dreadful ? Such is the power of our imagination that I found it amazing then. We had had nothing like that before.  Imagination, the best addon of them all.

Actually, ailerons would have been the best addon of all, but perhaps that was part of an expansion pack!

Sublogic's first effort lacks basic control surfaces, but it does allow you to "declare war", something that is sadly missing from MSFS2020.

 

Just now, OzWhitey said:

If you want to try the 1st sublogic sim,

Don't ever revisit your first love 🙂. 

For those who are interested, here's how MSFS1979 flies...

You can see I've got my aircraft banking nicely at around 120 knots. Flight controls are in green in the centre - rudder, elevator and throttle (which is firewalled). My turn rate is -304 somethings, and I am climbing to 3000 feet.

How is the virtual world? Well, it's just that grid that you can see, plus the triangles on the right that could conceivably be mountains. Even the grid isn't very big, it's surprisingly easy to fly off the edge of the earth.

Flight dynamics? Well, I've never tried flying a plane that lacks ailerons, so maybe they do fly like this. But I doubt it.

Performance. I took my i9900K up to 5.1 for the occasion, was still only getting 3 FPS but it was a SMOOTH 3 FPS.

Recommendation: no need to delete X-plane/P3D v5/MSFS2020 from your system - this is not the new king of sims - but is worth a fly if you want something to do between now and August 18th.

Cheers!

Edit: Here's a video of professional flight sim, 1970 style: 

 

Edited July 16, 20205 yr by OzWhitey

9 minutes ago, Dominique_K said:

 

Don't ever revisit your first love 🙂. 

Ha ha. No, it's OK, seeing the old girl just makes me appreciate my new girlfriend even more.

53 minutes ago, awf said:

Amazing to read that a lot of us are 30+  years in this hobby 😎

Add me here, too. Although since 1991 / FS4 only, so I feel as a youngster in the crowd.

I still have all the boxes on my shelf. (Where's that floppy drive in the basement?) I couldn't resist ordering the Aerosoft MSFS box, too.

Kind regards, Michael

 

On 7/14/2020 at 4:14 PM, captain420 said:

I'm curious to know if any of the members from ASOBO Studio are from the Aces team that developed the original Microsoft Flight Simulator? Is is this a completely new team building this from the ground up?

To answer the original question (better late than never?), I know of two of my former colleagues that are working on the new version at Microsoft. One was a technical art lead and the other started as a high school intern and became a test engineer who worked with me for a time. I'll let them decide if they want to share their names. I have no idea if any of the Asobo employees ever worked at Microsoft, but I'm fairly sure that, if they did, they didn't work on FS.

One other thing to point out in response to later comments in this thread: Aces wasn't some independent entity or group inside the company. We were all Microsoft employees who were lucky enough to work on Flight Sim full time. Long before the studio concept took hold at MS, we were called all kinds of things - SIMS, the Simulations Product Unit, a subset of the Entertainment Business Unit, then AC&S, which stood for Action, Combat, and Simulations, and then someone just changed that to ACES when we dropped the action titles. I know there are at least a few others that I'm forgetting that happened during my 11 years on the team. 

The point being, we were Microsoft employees, and the informal and then formal nicknames they gave our team frequently changed around us. So it's not realistic to suggest that Microsoft should have worked with ACES to bring back FS, or to talk about the shutdown as if Microsoft and ACES were different entities involved in a negotiation or something like that. Like I said, in my 11 years, we had all kinds of names, but most of us didn't really care. If you had to give us a name, most of us just thought of ourselves as the Flight Sim team.

Anyway, I got hands on with the new sim last fall, and was blown away. In addition to my two friends, I knew Jorg at least by name back in my MSFS days, and have met several of the Asobo folks, and I'm deeply impressed, FWIW.